69 Camaro at Best of Show

[waynieZ]

Glad your OK but sorry to hear of the problem. Did it damage the threads on the posi unit?

[Matt@BOS]

Glad your OK but sorry to hear of the problem. Did it damage the threads on the posi unit?

Wayne, thanks for the concern. Surprisingly everything seems to be okay. We couldn't find any damage on anything save for one small scratch away from all of the gears. After a few more track outings it is still working just fine!

[Matt@BOS]

Matt,

After giving you so much crap about painting your car purple while we were doing the build, I figured it would only be fair to paint my car in similar fashion. Lets hope we don't start a trend!

-brotourer

Right arm, Broseph. That's a nice color. Maybe you will get selected for a Goodguys Trend Setter Award??

[waynieZ]

Good to hear.

[brotourer]

Right arm, Broseph. That's a nice color. Maybe you will get selected for a Goodguys Trend Setter Award??

Gosh I hope not haha. Both your cars are looking awesome dude! Keep up the good work!

[Rick D]

Ok Matt, with all the Camaro talk in the mustang thread I thought you should bring it over here?? Now let's see some pictures of those fenders?? :hello: :hello:

[Matt@BOS]

Ok Matt, with all the Camaro talk in the mustang thread I thought you should bring it over here?? Now let's see some pictures of those fenders?? :hello: :hello:

Sorry Rick, I just can't help but be off topic. I don't have pictures of the fenders yet. I have to pick them up Wednesday on my L.A. errand running trip. Might have to drop off some shop stuff at Currie and let's see, what else? Oh yeah, I need to pick my Camaro up in Oxnard with Cris. There was something sketchy going on with the center section and I lost all the ring gear bolts on it again last weekend during some auto crossing. Cris was nice enough to tow the car to his shop, take the center section out, and send it over to Coast Driveline to have them check it out and fix it.

Matt

[Cris@JCG]

I promise to keep the RPM to 7200 when I am breaking in the ring & pinion! :whenitsdone:


Sorry Rick, I just can't help but be off topic. I don't have pictures of the fenders yet. I have to pick them up Wednesday on my L.A. errand running trip. Might have to drop off some shop stuff at Currie and let's see, what else? Oh yeah, I need to pick my Camaro up in Oxnard with Cris. There was something sketchy going on with the center section and I lost all the ring gear bolts on it again last weekend during some auto crossing. Cris was nice enough to tow the car to his shop, take the center section out, and send it over to Coast Driveline to have them check it out and fix it.

Matt

[Gandalf]

I promise to keep the RPM to 7200 when I am breaking in the ring & pinion! :whenitsdone:

You might be the first to do that Cris....

G.

[Cris@JCG]

Yeah.. We are also looking for a way to cut out the RPM by remote control .. so when he is @ Optima it can slow him down.. I am now accepting bribes! :D

You might be the first to do that Cris....

G.

[Matt@BOS]

I promise to keep the RPM to 7200 when I am breaking in the ring & pinion! :whenitsdone:

You might be the first to do that Cris....

G.



Might? or might not be the first? I can think of someone whose name starts with an R and ends with an Upp, who might have taught Cris about "breaking" parts in.

[Jr]

Matt,

Are you going to post before and after pics of the fenders?

[Rick D]

Matt,

Are you going to post before and after pics of the fenders?

Matt are you going to post ANY pictures :poke: :D

[Matt@BOS]

Matt are you going to post ANY pictures :poke: :D

I will post some pictures. They might not be good pictures, but then again you guys don't seem terribly picky. Everyone seems happy when Dave and Ron post pictures of -AN fittings or brackets.

I picked up the parts yesterday. They look pretty good. They don't have a gel coat with a slick shiny surface on them, but the lines are relatively crisp and fairly straight. All of the holes are drilled, or cut out. It will be interesting to see how they fit. I probably need to either make, modify or add a little structure to the area where the inner fender meets up between 10 and 2 o'clock.

Matt

[Flash68]

Everyone seems happy when Dave and Ron post pictures of -AN fittings or brackets.



Matt

Hey, I retired from that.... :getout:

Ron? Not so much. :thumbsup:

Oh... and I hear if you need to borrow any of my junker cars for a quick errand, I still better have you sign a waiver. :innocent:

[Matt@BOS]

Hey, I retired from that.... :getout:

Ron? Not so much. :thumbsup:

Oh... and I hear if you need to borrow any of my junker cars for a quick errand, I still better have you sign a waiver. :innocent:

Man, you are Captain off topic. We were discussing me using Dick's truck to teach that fence pole a lesson in the thread about the fastback build. You might actually want me to borrow your junkers. I stopped at the bank on my way back to the shop and just handed Dick the money when I got back.

[Ron in SoCal]

Hey, I retired from that.... :getout:

Ron? Not so much. :thumbsup:



Dave, Dave, Dave...:computer:

The reason you've retired from that is you've run out email images of someone else's parts or graphs :lol:

[FETorino]

New wide carbon fenders and of course with that comes new wheel hoops.:headscratch: So what are you doing with your wheels Matt? Just going with new outer hoops to gain some width or something else?:secret:

Oh and I apologize in advance for actually posting on topic in this thread. It seems that isn't normally allowed.

:popcorn2: :relax:

[Matt@BOS]

New wide carbon fenders and of course with that comes new wheel hoops.:headscratch: So what are you doing with your wheels Matt? Just going with new outer hoops to gain some width or something else?:secret:

Oh and I apologize in advance for actually posting on topic in this thread. It seems that isn't normally allowed.

:popcorn2: :relax:

I was just planning on re-hooping the front wheels. It is a lot cheaper than getting a new set of wheels. I do hope that one day there is someone like Ron or Steve Rupp with a DSE subframe to flood the classifieds with all kinds of wheels.

[FETorino]

I was just planning on re-hooping the front wheels. It is a lot cheaper than getting a new set of wheels. I do hope that one day there is someone like Ron or Steve Rupp with a DSE subframe to flood the classifieds with all kinds of wheels.

Yea I went Chevy bolt pattern on my hubs just so I could get one of Ron's extra sets.

[Ron in SoCal]

Yea I went Chevy bolt pattern on my hubs just so I could get one of Ron's extra sets.

Way to stay on topic. Nice.

You're already holding one hostage. What's next? :sarcasm_smiley:

[Flash68]

Dave, Dave, Dave...:computer:

The reason you've retired from that is you've run out email images of someone else's parts or graphs :lol:

:innocent:



Oh and I apologize in advance for actually posting on topic in this thread. It seems that isn't normally allowed.

:popcorn2: :relax:

Hey Matt, congrats on the GM Design Award at SEMA. Well deserved. :trophy-1302:

[Matt@BOS]

You guys wanted me to post a picture. Well, here is a picture. Use your imagination. :lol:

http://i366.photobucket.com/albums/oo103/69MSA/IMAG1003_zps9e9d15a8.jpg (http://s366.photobucket.com/user/69MSA/media/IMAG1003_zps9e9d15a8.jpg.html)

I promise I will actually get decent shots of how everything fit.

Matt

[Sieg]

:headscratch: It's a sideways fender that Rob photographed for you?

[Ron in SoCal]

I promise I will actually get decent shots of how everything fit.

Matt

Wait, what? Past tense? When'd you find the time? :)

[Greg from Aus]

Matt your just being a tease now. :guns: :guns:

[Matt@BOS]

Wait, what? Past tense? When'd you find the time? :)

I haven't taken the car apart yet. I'm putting together a list of things to fix and/or change.

So far I need to:
pick between between springs and sway bars.
450lb springs with solid speedway bar, or 550lb springs with .250" wall bar

possibly change master cylinders for softer pedal with more travel. If I go softer springs I want a softer pedal so that it has more travel and provides better modulation and feedback for trail braking since that setup should allow me to roll into corners softer and smoother but ultimately carry more speed. The big question in my mind is whether or not there is even a point to trying to drive the tighter autocross tracks, or Adams like that. Most of those turns are so sharp you need to be able to scrub off speed and turn tightly off throttle without getting a lot of push when applying throttle to exit the corner.

Also need to send wheels out to Forgeline to re-hoop. I don't suppose you have any lying around that I can borrow during that time, Ron? They will be returned with some Pilot Super Sports. :D

I've been going back and forth with Ron Sutton on front spring rates, and which to pick to try out after swapping to bigger tires. I feel bad because I'm a bit stuck with what worked with the 275s and might be trapped in the mindset that if it worked best with smaller tires, it must work best(er) with bigger tires. I probably haven't asked the right questions about cause and effect and how each change relates to the others I've made. I usually need a conceptual understanding of things before I warm up to using them. I think I feel more comfortable if I know how parts work and how best to drive with them.

[Ron in SoCal]

Matt I'll take that deal...:stirthepot:

[Jr]

MAtt,
What kind of master do you have on the car now?

[Matt@BOS]

MAtt,
What kind of master do you have on the car now?

I have individual master cylinders for the front and rear brakes. 3/4" front, 7/8" rear.

[Payton King]

what brake calipers ans sizes you were running, but if you are using willwood in the C5/C6 sizing and a 6:1 pedal ratio, you can drop the rear master to 3/4 and adjust the bias more towards the front. Will give you a little longer pedal.

What pads are you running?

I would opt for the larger 550 lbs in the front and a 300 or 325 in the rear. Guess I should ask what rate you front bar is and if you are running a rear bar.

[Jr]

Matt,
Who spec those master cylinders for you? Wildwood?

[Matt@BOS]

what brake calipers ans sizes you were running, but if you are using willwood in the C5/C6 sizing and a 6:1 pedal ratio, you can drop the rear master to 3/4 and adjust the bias more towards the front. Will give you a little longer pedal.

What pads are you running?

I would opt for the larger 550 lbs in the front and a 300 or 325 in the rear. Guess I should ask what rate you front bar is and if you are running a rear bar.

Payton, I belive the piston sizes are 4.04 front, 1.98 rear. I don't think it would be that bad, but the Tilton pedals have a 5.29:1 ratio. If I drop to 3/4 rear I will probably need to add a proportioning valve since I doubt the balance bar will have enough adjustment. It might if I get the rod lengths close to right. My brain is hurting trying to visualize if that would affect bias too.

DJW, Wilwood spc'd the masters and did tell me if I wasn't happy to drop to a 3/4 (just now remembered that part of the conversation.

[Payton King]

I would run a .70 in the front and 3/4 in the rear. It will keep you bias correct, increase your pressure with the same leg input.

Those masters are a touch on the large size for the pedal ratio. I am guessing it takes a fair amount of leg effort on your part to get the car to stop.

What pads are you running? That will make the single biggest difference in your braking, feel and modulation than anything else you will do.

[enzo]

You're crazy bro...

[Flash68]

You're crazy bro...

:lol:

[Matt@BOS]

You're crazy bro...

That's what I used to think too. But, if you believe in the old catch 22 them I'm not crazy... just stupid.

[morris69]

where did u get the first intake and valve covers from. secondly do u have any pictures of the interior? specifically the gauges?

[Matt@BOS]

where did u get the first intake and valve covers from. secondly do u have any pictures of the interior? specifically the gauges?

I got the intake manifold from Jeff Davis of Precision Metal Craft. I don't remember where the valve covers came from. I think I prefer them to the ones I have now, although the original ones I had didn't come with any venting.

[fleet]

Matt,

This gettin' ready for Optima ain't for posers, huh? :D

Now, how bout some hi-res pics of Dead Pool?




:lol:

[Richio1]

Matt,

This gettin' ready for Optima ain't for posers, huh? :D

Now, how bout some hi-res pics of Dead Pool?




:lol:

Yeah.

[Ron in SoCal]

^ I owe Matt a big thanks, as he's done his part keeping the pics rolling :thumbsup:

http://www.lateral-g.net/forums/showpost.php4?p=492639&postcount=1779

[Matt@BOS]

Matt,

This gettin' ready for Optima ain't for posers, huh? :D

Now, how bout some hi-res pics of Dead Pool?




:lol:

Skip, I made changes to my car for no reason other than because I thought it would look cool, and that was before I had the excuse of trying to work towards something.

Truth is it is all Brett Campbell's fault. The two of us sort of use each other's cars as a bench mark to see if we need to improve something on our own car. If he is faster than me, I'll want to try and catch up to him, and if I'm faster than him, then I know he'll be making changes, and I know that I'll soon be playing catch up again. It is fun competition and I think it has helped both of us acquire a lot more knowledge and maybe even a little more driving ability through practice. We've both taken a lot of baby steps but we've I think we've also come a long ways from when we started autocrossing a few years ago. I know we've closed the gap down on some cars that used to be beyond our benchmark for performance.

Matt

Oh, and no pics of Ron's car. It's up at QMP getting the engine buttoned up and broken in, I think.

[fleet]

Skip, I made changes to my car for no reason other than because I thought it would look cool, and that was before I had the excuse of trying to work towards something.

Truth is it is all Brett Campbell's fault. The two of us sort of use each other's cars as a bench mark to see if we need to improve something on our own car. If he is faster than me, I'll want to try and catch up to him, and if I'm faster than him, then I know he'll be making changes, and I know that I'll soon be playing catch up again. It is fun competition and I think it has helped both of us acquire a lot more knowledge and maybe even a little more driving ability through practice. We've both taken a lot of baby steps but we've I think we've also come a long ways from when we started autocrossing a few years ago. I know we've closed the gap down on some cars that used to be beyond our benchmark for performance.

Matt


Matt,


http://24.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_lsrwvcI0lO1qfsr58o1_500.png



... and a lot of fans will jump on the 'Matty Ice' bandwagon.

http://alt.coxnewsweb.com/cnishared/tools/shared/mediahub/03/20/00/slideshow_1002032364_falcons.0103_CC4.JPG


:gitrdun:

:D

[morris69]

any interior pics of the car?

[Matt@BOS]

any interior pics of the car?

http://www.camaroperformers.com/featured-camaros/1st-gen-camaro-1967-1969/camp-1110-1969-chevrolet-camaro/

[morris69]

Nice.... what are the switches under the a.c. controls for. I'm building a convertible 69 and was looking for ideas for interiors

[Matt@BOS]

Nice.... what are the switches under the a.c. controls for. I'm building a convertible 69 and was looking for ideas for interiors

The switches operate the headlights, headlight doors, and electric cut outs. The fourth switch was included in case something had to be added after the car was finished.

[Matt@BOS]

Got some changes going on.

Decided to try out a new look...

http://i366.photobucket.com/albums/oo103/69MSA/photo_zps91dfcd89.jpg (http://s366.photobucket.com/user/69MSA/media/photo_zps91dfcd89.jpg.html)

[FETorino]

:lol: Got some changes going on.

Decided to try out a new look...

http://i366.photobucket.com/albums/oo103/69MSA/photo_zps91dfcd89.jpg (http://s366.photobucket.com/user/69MSA/media/photo_zps91dfcd89.jpg.html)

How about some specs on what we are looking at? Other than the first shot of your new fiberglass fenders.

Is that a space saver spare in the background?

[Flash68]

So since track width is one of the technical discussions these days, what's your new measurement of outside of tire to outside of tire (NASA track width) and also the standard measurement track width most discuss?

[Ron in SoCal]

Got some changes going on.

Decided to try out a new look...


I should know better, really but...

Wait, what??

So since track width is one of the technical discussions these days, what's your new measurement of outside of tire to outside of tire (NASA track width) and also the standard measurement track width most discuss?

Dave, Bro...it's late man. Sure you wanna go there? You'll be up all night w a tape measure and a spreadsheet :lol:

[Flash68]

Dave, Bro...it's late man. Sure you wanna go there? You'll be up all night w a tape measure and a spreadsheet :lol:

My tape measure is put away. My stuff is done. Final final.

Maybe.

:lol:

[Matt@BOS]

I should know better, really but...

Wait, what??



Dave, Bro...it's late man. Sure you wanna go there? You'll be up all night w a tape measure and a spreadsheet :lol:

The HRE wheels are just rollers until I get the Forgelines back from being re-hooped.

Track or tread width, whatever you want to call it, from outside to outside, should be around 1" wider front than back. I haven't measured scrub yet, but I am a pretty unscientific person and it is going to be what it is going to be.

I decided to go with a 10.5" front wheel. It is less than ideal for a 315, but I was also running a 275 on a 9" wheel before and managed to turn some respectable times, while not destroying tires. I'm sure Rob will probably be telling me that I should stretch a smaller tire over a wider wheel, but at the end of the day, I think that the 315 on a 10.5" wheel will still net me better performance than a 275-295 on that same wheel, at least for my car and what I've been doing with it.

[FETorino]

The HRE wheels are just rollers until I get the Forgelines back from being re-hooped.

Track or tread width, whatever you want to call it, from outside to outside, should be around 1" wider front than back. I haven't measured scrub yet, but I am a pretty unscientific person and it is going to be what it is going to be.

I decided to go with a 10.5" front wheel. It is less than ideal for a 315, but I was also running a 275 on a 9" wheel before and managed to turn some respectable times, while not destroying tires. I'm sure Rob will probably be telling me that I should stretch a smaller tire over a wider wheel, but at the end of the day, I think that the 315 on a 10.5" wheel will still net me better performance than a 275-295 on that same wheel, at least for my car and what I've been doing with it.

Yep me and the guys that spec'd the Porsche GT2 cars would tell you to run a 12" wide wheel for a tire that large.:lmao:

On a 10.5" wheel I'd run a 285.:stirthepot:

I know you have a limited tire choice in the brand you are going to run.

[Matt@BOS]

Yep me and the guys that spec'd the Porsche GT2 cars would tell you to run a 12" wide wheel for a tire that large.:lmao:

On a 10.5" wheel I'd run a 285.:stirthepot:

I know you have a limited tire choice in the brand you are going to run.

I'd run a 285 on a 10.5" wheel too, if I was running a 295 on the back. I would also run the a 285/295 if all I was running were road courses. I bet you my tires, which will move a little more on the rim will push a lot less than your tires. :poke: And don't play the wheel base card either, we know that your car has a longer wheel base than some limos.

[67zo6Camaro]

One of the best things about the Lat-G community is the friendships you build. Case and Point... Matt has become one of my main local competitors lately as his times on the track have become equal and even faster than mine sometimes. (Note Matt, lol, I used sometimes... he he). Anyway even know we are competitors on the track we are still able to share information about our trials of success in the tuning of our cars. I was in need of some different coil springs for tuning and Matt stepped up to let me barrow some that he had. Pretty cool considering I'm trying to stay tuned to be faster than him and I'm sure he is making adjustments to stay faster than me.

http://i1113.photobucket.com/albums/k514/Fab50Three/IMG_5543_zps4b660c48.jpg

Even Rob Fe has stepped in to let help me out even know I'm a Chevy guy. That's his Watts link in the picture that I was test fitting in the Fab53 Camaro.

[67zo6Camaro]

So when I was down at BOS picking up springs, I was able to check out Matt's new adventures... The front fender changes and front wheel changes. I'm pretty excited for him as this is one of the thing I did earlier this year (and so has several other racers out there).

http://i1113.photobucket.com/albums/k514/Fab50Three/IMG_5539_zpse9e36539.jpg

http://i1113.photobucket.com/albums/k514/Fab50Three/IMG_5537_zps308d1048.jpg

http://i1113.photobucket.com/albums/k514/Fab50Three/IMG_5535_zpseb67ec22.jpg

[Tomswheels]

That thing might actually end up being faster than a Barracuda yet...:hello:

[Matt@BOS]

That thing might actually end up being faster than a Barracuda yet...:hello:

That was my actual benchmark, not Brett's car as a few had probably thought. I'm not sure what I'm going to do to be able to catch the Valiant though...

[Tomswheels]

HaHa! You and Brett both mock the Valiant, but I predict a rash of 67-69 Camaros being offered up in trade after the Valiant makes its triumphant debut. :bur2: Seriously though, those fenders look mean, and as you know, I say thats plenty of rim for a 315!:D

[Matt@BOS]

HaHa! You and Brett both mock the Valiant, but I predict a rash of 67-69 Camaros being offered up in trade after the Valiant makes its triumphant debut. :bur2: Seriously though, those fenders look mean, and as you know, I say thats plenty of rim for a 315!:D

Hey, I wasn't lying. I'm a little bit afraid of that Valiant.

[Flash68]

315's on a 10.5?! :eek:



:D

[Matt@BOS]

315's on a 10.5?! :eek:



:D

Yeah dude. Tom and I are among the last few holdouts who don't want to join Rob's hellaflush brigade.

I'm looking at getting a set of wheels that can fit both of my cars, and if I do, I'll be testing to see if wider wheels/smaller tires work better than wider tires/smaller wheels on an autocross.

[Flash68]

Yeah dude. Tom and I are among the last few holdouts who don't want to join Rob's hellaflush brigade.

I'm looking at getting a set of wheels that can fit both of my cars, and if I do, I'll be testing to see if wider wheels/smaller tires work better than wider tires/smaller wheels on an autocross.

I'd prefer to join Jiffy Pop nation if possible.

The Ridetech '33 seems to be doing pretty well with 315's on a 12. :poke:

[Matt@BOS]

I'd prefer to join Jiffy Pop nation if possible.

The Ridetech '33 seems to be doing pretty well with 315's on a 12. :poke:

Did you and rob attend a hellaflush club meeting yesterday? Sometimes friendly arguing is just too much fun to pass up. All I'm going to say is that the '33 works, however, when it was on the west coast my 275/9" fronts netted me lap times within half a second at Willow and Adams. Do you and Rob think a 255 would have been the secret to making me faster than the '33. :idea:

[ccracin]

Did you and rob attend a hellaflush club meeting yesterday? Sometimes friendly arguing is just too much fun to pass up. All I'm going to say is that the '33 works, however, when it was on the west coast my 275/9" fronts netted me lap times within half a second at Willow and Adams. Do you and Rob think a 255 would have been the secret to making me faster than the '33. :idea:

West Coast asphalt is stickier than mid-west or east coast! Just sayin! :stirthepot:

[Flash68]

Do you and Rob think a 255 would have been the secret to making me faster than the '33. :idea:

Assuming you put a 275 on the rear, yes. :D

[FETorino]

Did you and rob attend a hellaflush club meeting yesterday? Sometimes friendly arguing is just too much fun to pass up. All I'm going to say is that the '33 works, however, when it was on the west coast my 275/9" fronts netted me lap times within half a second at Willow and Adams. Do you and Rob think a 255 would have been the secret to making me faster than the '33. :idea:

It was the topic of the day on the hellaflush forum.:rolleyes: :lol:

In truth IMHO staying with your 275 but putting it on your wider 10.5" wheel would have made you faster.:D :thumbsup:

Matt, I'll take a Porter or a Stout.:thankyou:

No matter what, you have a ticket to the show and your driving skill is climbing faster than the temps in Baker. You better take your tricks back underground :secret: if people aren't gunning for you then they won't know what hits them.

:cheers:

[Matt@BOS]

It was the topic of the day on the hellaflush forum.:rolleyes: :lol:

In truth IMHO staying with your 275 but putting it on your wider 10.5" wheel would have made you faster.:D :thumbsup:

Matt, I'll take a Porter or a Stout.:thankyou:

No matter what, you have a ticket to the show and your driving skill is climbing faster than the temps in Baker. You better take your tricks back underground :secret: if people aren't gunning for you then they won't know what hits them.

:cheers:

A 10.5 would be better than the 9 but so would a bigger tire :lol:

[FETorino]

A 10.5 would be better than the 9 but so would a bigger tire :lol:

At this point all that matters is the beer you owe me.

:cheers:

[GregWeld]

Don't they have to run and drive before you need to worry about tires and stuff??


I think there's a 6 year date code on tires or they become non DOT legal. Tires on this thing must be way older than that!

[GregWeld]

OH wait!! This is Matt's thread! So sorry..... thought I was posting in ROB or RON's or DAVE's thread.

[Matt@BOS]

OH wait!! This is Matt's thread! So sorry..... thought I was posting in ROB or RON's or DAVE's thread.

The tires Ron just picked up from me are pretty well travelled. I don't think they're six years old, but he might want to check. They ran a One Lap, made a few trips back and forth between SoCal and NorCal, then I bought them, Rupp might have borrowed them, and Gregg might have used them as well. Now they're in Ron's garage and will probably end up in the hands of some member of the Rontourage.

[Tomswheels]

Wheels Schmeels. Just mount the tires and drive! When does the new fender/tire debut at the track? :headspin:

[Matt@BOS]

Wheels Schmeels. Just mount the tires and drive! When does the new fender/tire debut at the track? :headspin:

Wheels might be done by the end of next week. I hope. I'd like to get the car tested before paint so it might debut in a really ugly form in two weeks. Picture grey primered front end.

[Flash68]

The tires Ron just picked up from me are pretty well travelled. I don't think they're six years old, but he might want to check. They ran a One Lap, made a few trips back and forth between SoCal and NorCal, then I bought them, Rupp might have borrowed them, and Gregg might have used them as well. Now they're in Ron's garage and will probably end up in the hands of some member of the Rontourage.

:lol: sounds like someone got an insider deal.... :confused59:

[Ron in SoCal]

The tires Ron just picked up from me are pretty well travelled. I don't think they're six years old, but he might want to check. They ran a One Lap, made a few trips back and forth between SoCal and NorCal, then I bought them, Rupp might have borrowed them, and Gregg might have used them as well. Now they're in Ron's garage and will probably end up in the hands of some member of the Rontourage.

Matt whaddaya say we take that 335 and put it on an 8" rim? :lol:

[Matt@BOS]

Matt whaddaya say we take that 335 and put it on an 8" rim? :lol:

I think Tom already did that with my old 335 Nitto NT05s.

[Tomswheels]

:trophy-1302: Won the "Super Sunday" at the last Del Mar Goodguys with those very 335s on 10 inch rims and 295s on 9 inch rims up front. Sure the car was a little "Wiggly" but who cares when you are "Ballin" as the kids say on 335s? I believe it was Billy Crystal as "Fernando" on Saturday night live who said it best: "It is more inportant to look good than to feel good"...

I cant believe ive resorted to quoting stuff from the 80's when Matt was still in the womb...

[Matt@BOS]

http://i366.photobucket.com/albums/oo103/69MSA/image_zps800f4d42.jpg (http://s366.photobucket.com/user/69MSA/media/image_zps800f4d42.jpg.html)

http://i366.photobucket.com/albums/oo103/69MSA/image_zps03dcd8bb.jpg (http://s366.photobucket.com/user/69MSA/media/image_zps03dcd8bb.jpg.html)

http://i366.photobucket.com/albums/oo103/69MSA/image_zpsc580a36c.jpg (http://s366.photobucket.com/user/69MSA/media/image_zpsc580a36c.jpg.html)

[Al Moreno]

SWEEEET, not much longer Matt

[fleet]

http://i366.photobucket.com/albums/oo103/69MSA/image_zps800f4d42.jpg (http://s366.photobucket.com/user/69MSA/media/image_zps800f4d42.jpg.html)




Phat makes right. :unibrow:

[Jr]

Matt,

Did BOS say anything about the comparison of reworking the fiber glass fenders vs the metal fenders on the OLA car?

[garickman]

Don't you have a Marquez dash? Have you seen the competition series from Dakota Digital?

http://www.dakotadigital.com/index.cfm/page/ptype=product/product_id=880/mode=prod/prd880.htm

[waynieZ]

That's a sweet looking gauge setup.

[Matt@BOS]

I've never seen that before Greg. It is pretty trick!

[Matt@BOS]

Matt,

Did BOS say anything about the comparison of reworking the fiber glass fenders vs the metal fenders on the OLA car?

We didn't really do anything to the fiberglass fenders other than improving the fit and finish on the door gaps and getting rid of the low spot above the body line, behind the wheel openings. Pretty much all factory and aftermarket sheet metal is shaped that same way.

On the other hand, the work on OLC's fenders were pretty extensive and required both cuts and English wheel work.

They are really two completely different animals. In about a week I can tell you how big a tire you can fit.

[GrnDragon]

I'm sure you said somewhere earlier in the thread, but who makes the fenders and how much wider are they? I thought I saw that they were CF so I assumed they were Anvil, but above you said Fiber Glass?
Thanks

[Matt@BOS]

I'm sure you said somewhere earlier in the thread, but who makes the fenders and how much wider are they? I thought I saw that they were CF so I assumed they were Anvil, but above you said Fiber Glass?
Thanks

They are Anvil products. I think Anvil offers most, if not all of their parts in fiberglass as well these days. The quality on them is still above average. I think Anvil states they are around 1.25" wider than stock.

[214Chevy]

Got some changes going on.

Decided to try out a new look...

http://i366.photobucket.com/albums/oo103/69MSA/photo_zps91dfcd89.jpg (http://s366.photobucket.com/user/69MSA/media/photo_zps91dfcd89.jpg.html)

Matt, the look is awesome and I love the new wheels. But, since you got carbon fiber fenders and the wheels are black, you outta get HRE's black carbon fiber center cap. Well, it's not 100% CF, but it's a really nice CF print.

[Matt@BOS]

Matt, the look is awesome and I love the new wheels. But, since you got carbon fiber fenders and the wheels are black, you outta get HRE's black carbon fiber center cap. Well, it's not 100% CF, but it's a really nice CF print.

Hate to fool you, but those are just the roller wheels. :lol:

I'm having the Forgelines re-hooped. The car will look almost exactly the same as before, save for a few touches here and there.

[214Chevy]

Hate to fool you, but those are just the roller wheels. :lol:

I'm having the Forgelines re-hooped. The car will look almost exactly the same as before, save for a few touches here and there.

How wide are you going with the hoops? And are you changing the color/finish or still gonna keep them polished?

[Matt@BOS]

How wide are you going with the hoops? And are you changing the color/finish or still gonna keep them polished?

I'm having the wheels built to 10.5 inches will see how they work. If I'm not happy, I will probably try Rob's hella flush approach and go to an 11" with a 295.

I might also change the color of the centers. Not sure yet...

[Matt@BOS]

Getting closer. We shot paint on a few of the pieces yesterday. I also got the wheels back. One side rubs a little, the other is fine. I'm going to raise the car a little and throw some additional camber in it. So far things look to be an improvement after a little test drive.

http://i366.photobucket.com/albums/oo103/69MSA/image_zpscb81e7af.jpg (http://s366.photobucket.com/user/69MSA/media/image_zpscb81e7af.jpg.html)

http://i366.photobucket.com/albums/oo103/69MSA/image_zps27069a32.jpg (http://s366.photobucket.com/user/69MSA/media/image_zps27069a32.jpg.html)

[Ron in SoCal]

:hello: Steamrollers

[67zo6Camaro]

When is the test day? I'm in.... just txt me.

[Matt@BOS]

When is the test day? I'm in.... just txt me.

I'm looking at testing in a couple weeks. We'll get it painted this coming week and probably spend the first several days of the following week color sanding and polishing it back up so that I will be ready to get a new round of rock chips and cone rash! I'll definitely let you know when and where I'm headed out to.

[Jr]

So... Are we looking at 315's on there right now?

[Matt@BOS]

So... Are we looking at 315's on there right now?

Yes sir. A 295 or a 305 would fit much better, but don't want to change tire brands at the moment. I may very well drop down in size in the front and try a set of BFG Rivals in the future, but won't know for sure until I put some laps on the new setup and see how well it works within its current constraints.

[Jr]

Killer! Good luck at optima.

Are you going to be doing practice runs at Adams?

[Matt@BOS]

Killer! Good luck at optima.

Are you going to be doing practice runs at Adams?

I'm sure I'll be going out to Adams a few times. I'll probably be out there with Brett as we're both working towards dropping our times as much as possible, although I doubt we will be able to knock a full second off our times to get close to Brian's what Brian was running in his second gen. He gave us a good benchmark to keep chasing after!

I'd also like to get a little bit of time on a track like Big Willow again.

Matt

[Ron Sutton]

Hey Matt,

I heard your car ran Sunday. Give us the scoop !

[Matt@BOS]

Hey Matt,

I heard your car ran Sunday. Give us the scoop !

Sure thing Ron!

I haven't dialed the car in at all since putting it back together. It still has a few parts combinations that I figured would need to be changed, namely with springs and bars, but I was waiting on a set of spring seat bearings for the front and didn't want to change springs out before I got those because that job is no fun at all on a DSE sub. I also wanted to drive it as-is because I wanted to get a sense for how each change effects the car's handling.

I showed up in the morning with no idea what to expect, except that I should probably have more grip than before.

What I found was that the car was pretty fast, and definitely had much less understeer than before. Mid corner speeds were greatly improved. The car was still a little bit tight, but wouldn't push terribly off line or skip the front end at all, and throttle application could easily straighten the car out without messy amounts of oversteer.

I'm still getting used to having more useable power than before, so I still wasn't driving the car at the limit. There were many times coming out of corners, or going through sweeping corners when I realized I could have been giving it much more gas, and sooner too.

The bad, as of right now is that my setup last weekend with the big tires was that transitions felt slower because turn in was less precise. The car wasn't as easy to drive through the long slalom because it didn't immediately change direction, but once it did it had all the grip in the world.

The next thing on my list of changes to make is to drop spring rate in the front. Right now there are 700lb Hypercoils in there, which I'm sure are too much. I'm going to drop down 50-100lbs and see what it does. I also have some wheels spacers to throw on the back, and then I might soften the rear bar or springs. the rear now feels like it has a lot of grip, and I want to keep as much of that as possible, so I hope dialing in the front will fix my current issues.

I'll get a few pictures of the finished car up later today because I know everyone likes pictures.

Matt

[67zo6Camaro]

Matt I have those #650 or #600 for you. I want to take #600 out and put your #575 in the front.

Let me know when you want to meet up.

[Ron Sutton]

Matt,

Do you have any more track days coming up?

[Matt@BOS]

Matt,

Do you have any more track days coming up?

Nothing dead set in the next month. I wanted to run the Fontana Roval, but my radiator is leaking, and Ron Davis wanted me to send it back so they could see what is wrong with it, and fix it. hopefully that doesn't take too long, but it probably will.

[67zo6Camaro]

I just have to say, I was lucky enough to drive this thing recently. And I was able to drive the snot out of it. Matt has done a superb job of dialing this thing in and it was easy to flog around an autocross track at limits. So, good that within 3 runs I was able to match some of the fastest times of the day at the track.

Matt you have done a great job with this Camaro. It is easy to drive at limits. I just had to watch out how fast you could burn the rear tires with that 700hp on tap.


cheers and thanks again.

[Bryan O]

Nothing dead set in the next month. I wanted to run the Fontana Roval, but my radiator is leaking, and Ron Davis wanted me to send it back so they could see what is wrong with it, and fix it. hopefully that doesn't take too long, but it probably will.

Matt, where is the radiator leaking? Let us know what Ron Davis says.

Mine's leaking a small amount at the bottom of the filler neck each time I drive. I'll probably drive by Ron Davis and see what they think. I only have 15,000 miles on the car but I doubt my "tail light" warranty is still in effect. :lol:

[clill]

Over the years I have had a couple Ron Davis radiators develop leaks and they were great about promptly fixing them.

[Matt@BOS]

Over the years I have had a couple Ron Davis radiators develop leaks and they were great about promptly fixing them.

Dennis was very helpful on the phone and made it clear they wanted to stand behind the product, find out why it was leaking and fix it, rather than just have me go somewhere else.

Now I just need to take the car apart. Hoping to get a two week turn around once I ship it off.


Bryan, if your radiator is leaking more than an occasional drop from the filler neck, Ron Davis would probably like to see it as well, even if it is out of warrantee.

I just have to say, I was lucky enough to drive this thing recently. And I was able to drive the snot out of it. Matt has done a superb job of dialing this thing in and it was easy to flog around an autocross track at limits. So, good that within 3 runs I was able to match some of the fastest times of the day at the track.

Matt you have done a great job with this Camaro. It is easy to drive at limits. I just had to watch out how fast you could burn the rear tires with that 700hp on tap.


cheers and thanks again.



Glad you enjoyed driving it. Now I wish you had driven it before all the changes. It has been a fun process sorting it out, and trying all kinds of different parts, and trying to keep from losing any ground against you, whenever we go to local events. My goal all along has been to make the car easy to drive. Originally it was far too easy to lose control of it due a bad push, or get it into a four wheel drift with the power. It still doesn't break away as progressively as I want, but it has a ton of grip now and is probably good enough for me.

Matt

[mdprovee]

Matt, sounds like you are headed in the right direction for Optima. Good luck.

[Tomswheels]

Matt, the Camaro looked very impressive at the last SCCA event and at the So Cal Challenge. I'm really getting excited to see it at Optima....:gitrdun:

[Matt@BOS]

Matt, the Camaro looked very impressive at the last SCCA event and at the So Cal Challenge. I'm really getting excited to see it at Optima....:gitrdun:

Thanks Tom! Everyone is getting faster, from the crazy mopar owners to the Maiers and Hobaughs of this world, and I don't want to be left in the dust. I'm sure I will be soon enough though.

[Flash68]

Ah give yourself some credit. You've worked hard at it and put the time in. And it looks like you have some staying power. :D

[Matt@BOS]

Ah give yourself some credit. You've worked hard at it and put the time in. And it looks like you have some staying power. :D

I give it five, maybe ten more years, regardless of what we're driving until the hot shoes' kids are beating up on us. Last time I saw the Maier family their youngest was getting a custom fit helmet to her tiny HANS device. It's a good thing Todd sold his car when he did. I don't think his ego could handle the future of pro touring track days.

[Flash68]

It's a good thing Todd sold his car when he did. I don't think his ego could handle the future of pro touring track days.

:lol: :rofl:

[Cris@JCG]

All I care about is beating you! & your not drivng my cars anymore.. It is embarrasing when you are faster in my cars!:lol:

Thanks Tom! Everyone is getting faster, from the crazy mopar owners to the Maiers and Hobaughs of this world, and I don't want to be left in the dust. I'm sure I will be soon enough though.

[DFRESH]

Congrats on such huge improvements brother. I bet it feels great to be as fast as you are now! Amazing from even just a year ago isn't it? I have so much ground to cover now---LOL.

Will be at Optima to cheer you and Brett on.

I heard a rumor that El Toro may be down and out with a new developer on site. I wonder if we might be losing our RTTC venue there.

No more Taco party---that hurts the most.

D

[Vegas69]

I give it five, maybe ten more years, regardless of what we're driving until the hot shoes' kids are beating up on us. Last time I saw the Maier family their youngest was getting a custom fit helmet to her tiny HANS device. It's a good thing Todd sold his car when he did. I don't think his ego could handle the future of pro touring track days.

I'd just cheat like Dave. :lol:

[Flash68]

Not sure how there is Camaro talk in your Mustang thread (or why Rob would allow such a travesty) but I digress....

Matt, for the ball not bouncing your way the past 2 weeks you did really dang good man. You drove the car there sans trailer, had the restraint and maturity to not show the Farfegnugen car with the trigger happy Blow Off Valve who's boss on the road rally, and did half of your own navigating on said road rally (my bad!). :D

Seriously, you represented the real pro touring cars well and without even a fraction of the design points you should have gotten.

I mean.... 1 friggin point in the Design portion?! Yeah I'll say it... what a rip off that was. They must have gotten your car and the near stock looking 5th gen mixed up. :rolleyes:

I'll cap it off with this... How does a recent SEMA GM Design Award Winner get 1 point?

:bang:

Thanks for letting me navigate and hitch a ride. Was great being part of that cruise with ya. :thumbsup:

[Matt@BOS]

Not sure how there is Camaro talk in your Mustang thread (or why Rob would allow such a travesty) but I digress....

Matt, for the ball not bouncing your way the past 2 weeks you did really dang good man. You drove the car there sans trailer, had the restraint and maturity to not show the Farfegnugen car with the trigger happy Blow Off Valve who's boss on the road rally, and did half of your own navigating on said road rally (my bad!). :D

Seriously, you represented the real pro touring cars well and without even a fraction of the design points you should have gotten.

I mean.... 1 friggin point in the Design portion?! Yeah I'll say it... what a rip off that was. They must have gotten your car and the near stock looking 5th gen mixed up. :rolleyes:

I'll cap it off with this... How does a recent SEMA GM Design Award Winner get 1 point?

:bang:

Thanks for letting me navigate and hitch a ride. Was great being part of that cruise with ya. :thumbsup:

Dude, I had a blast on the road rally, probably just as much fun as driving in the actually track segments of the event. Never expected that, and I'm not just saying that because I dropped the ball on two of the three track components. Perhaps trying to get from Freemont street to the 515 freeway added an element of danger that made it exciting. That and getting revved at by a Subie wagon. :lol: Next time (Maybe Laguna Seca in March??) I think we should try and squeeze Brett in next to Jeffrey.

Okay, now... since this is my little build thread, I'm going to take it off topic a little bit (maybe I can tie it back to building the Camaro) and rant a little bit. I'm happy to have been given the opportunity to compete in OUSCI and I'm happy to have finished the event. I'm a little let down by my own driving, but hey, that is why we race and don't just look at parts and crunch numbers to find a winner.

The one thing I want to rant about though is the the design component. I might lose a few people here, but try and bear with me guys. I'm not writing this because I just want to bitch and complain, but rather because I really enjoyed the event, the level of organization was great. Both Jimi and the autocross team kept the event running fast, and most of all showed responsibility in making judgement calls to keep things safe. The Design portion was the only part of the event that I felt didn't live up to everything else. I highly doubt my opinion on the subject matters, or will be read by anyone involved, but here it goes anyway.

Design is subjective. It is an art form in its own right, and every viewer has a different opinion. Just as there are different schools and philosophies in art, from impressionists to cubists, and some of the post modernists whose works I have no idea how to classify, so there are similar subcultures in the car customizing aftermarket from the stanced and hellaflush movements that Rob greatly adores, to the more subtle and refined creations that builders like Trapanier and Strope have been turning, or the Ring Brothers, whose work has its own identity. My point is, there are many sub-genres of art and design in general. As individuals we are naturally going to be opinionated about what we see. Some of the most fun we have at SEMA is probably being able to lean over to one of our buddies at a show while standing next to a mid to high six figure build and saying, "man, why did they do that?" Still, most of us are mature enough to respect builds and builders for their craftsmanship and execution of concept, which is really no different than how art is critiqued. Where I take issue with the design component of the event is how haphazardly it was judged. The judges said they were looking for what differentiated each individual car from the way it left the factory. The design portion was also put in place to help well built street cars compete with their more race oriented rivals. I would be okay with that if the design score cards were indicative of the alleged scoring criteria. Tell me though, how does a mid engined Mustang with impeccable fit and finish not win the design portion under the aforementioned basis for critique? Eckler's can probably list on one hand the number of factory pieces retained on that car. On the other hand how does an Audi R8 with aftermarket wheels, underglow neon lights and a big wing take home third place in the segment? If Pfaff and Lingenfelter were judging based on how well they felt the Audi lived up to its concept, that would be different, but that wasn't the story this past weekend.

When they judged my car, they made it clear that they were looking for what made it stand out compared to a factory car. I have original doors, decklid and roof. Everything was built with attention to combining form and function with as little compromise as possible to either, while still remaining understated. I wanted the classic shape of a Camaro with a bit of the vibe of a contemporary grand touring car. I got one point. Steilow's car, which I feel follows a similar concept received 15 design points. Are our two cars really that different? Lastly, let's talk about the Lingenfelter Camaro. It has a vinyl wrap, aftermarket wheels, a different grille, and maybe some body kit pieces. Was it really deserving of more points than my car or even the CTS-V challenge car, if we're going to make a slightly more apples to apples comparison. I'll let you guys decide...

I wouldn't have bothered to write this all if I thought I was the only one who felt this way, but when Tim McGilton voiced similar concerns about the design portion in another thread, I figured there are probably a lot of us who feel this way, and maybe our opinions should be put out in the open. In the grand scheme these events are for people to enjoy, so maybe we shouldn't worry about who does or doesn't get design points, but at the same time, if these events are for fun, why are they becoming competitive enough that that two of the three podium spots were decided by style points awarded by judges who designed or owned the two cars in question?

[glassman]

Well said Matt. I agree 100%.

Its like me telling you red is better than blue.

Hopefully the'll tweek that for next year. And your paragraph goes "viral"

[waynieZ]

Glad to hear your getting to enjoy the car again Matt.

[Vegas69]

It reminds me of the first time I entered my car in a local show. I hung around all day expecting an award and zilch. From that day forward I had a new outlook.

Your car is very well executed. I'd say to the point where the average judge wouldn't appreciate it. I can see it winning the GM award and doing poorly at Optima. It's not loud enough cosmetically......

[57hemicuda]

Don't feel bad Matt, my Mustang got 0 design points, you can get much louder cosmetically then it. I think judging is so subjective, they need to mix that up a little bit, can't have the same group liking the same stuff every year. Lord knows my taste is way different then a lot of others.

Don't know if you are having the same SEMA/ Optima hang over that I had, wow that really kicks the crap out of you. Took Several days to recover.

[Lenie]

Matt, pretty much hard to take car judging serious anywhere as it can differ on any given day depending on the individuals selected to do the judging or which car club they belong to at the various shows throughout the country, although it does feel good when you are recognized w/no affiliations to that particular show. On a side note, I've seen your car in person in the past and cannot get enough of it, during this SEMA visit I went back to your car several times and your windows were always rolled up.....you're killing me!:poke: :P

[irishlsxer]

X2 on the windows being rolled up and dirty as hell too like someone actually DROVE it there or something....the nerve of some people

[Musclerodz]

Personally I think the design portion should have no bearing on the winner of the shootout. It clearly needs to be separated into a show award or removed if it can make the difference in a podium position at a RACING EVENT where the car that scored higher in all track events lost because of style points to a car that got beat in all track events. I had alot more typed here but I didn't want to :stirthepot:

These issues will show up more and more as competition gets tighter and tighter, and as long as changes are being made to correct issues like this at the next event to keep things fair, it will keep people coming back.

[Matt@BOS]

The windows were up and dirty because I was busy "networking" and didn't have any time to go visit the car and clean it off on Wed. or Thurs.:lol:

[WSSix]

Don't forget through all this Matt that you've built one hell of a car regardless of what some judges say. You're comments are correct IMO as well.

I think Mike has a good point about removing the "pretty points" from a performance competition. Maybe that's the solution and the direction the people in charge of OUSCI will head.

[Ron in SoCal]

"networking"

:rofl: :rofl: :rofl:

[Sieg]

http://sieg.smugmug.com/OUSCI-2013/i-rpfzPPX/0/XL/_MG_9252-XL.jpg

http://sieg.smugmug.com/OUSCI-2013/i-Z9CJ7Vg/0/XL/_MG_9243-XL.jpg

http://sieg.smugmug.com/OUSCI-2013/i-LC8FgXs/1/XL/_MG_9239-XL.jpg

http://sieg.smugmug.com/OUSCI-2013/i-vLmHX3K/0/XL/_MG_9241-XL.jpg

http://sieg.smugmug.com/OUSCI-2013/i-vdhDwsV/0/XL/_MG_9414-XL.jpg

http://sieg.smugmug.com/OUSCI-2013/i-nXvXKRN/1/XL/_MG_9419-XL.jpg

http://sieg.smugmug.com/OUSCI-2013/i-MnxS7Tk/0/XL/_MG_9429-XL.jpg

http://sieg.smugmug.com/OUSCI-2013/i-74ZZbsW/0/XL/_MG_9974-XL.jpg

http://sieg.smugmug.com/OUSCI-2013/i-M9DNvCz/1/XL/_MG_0013-XL.jpg

http://sieg.smugmug.com/OUSCI-2013/i-5Lx9zjP/0/XL/_MG_0131-XL.jpg

[aray327]

I love going to OUSCI! It's a great place to see outstanding cars get hammered.

I was thinking while watching the event that it's interesting to think you can objectively pick a winner at an event when there is a subjective portion of the judging. I agree with your opinion on the design segment! And I agree with whoever said it should be a separate award or eliminated altogether. Personally I think it should be separate to recognize someone who has really gone above and beyond to put together something exceptional. I love having the opportunity to see a mustang that was never built by Ford up close and personal, much less put through the paces at a racing event.

More importantly, Matt you were a winner before you arrived at the event! Your car has been at SEMA two or three times?? And you had the opportunity to compete in an event most of us will NEVER get to participate in. No matter what the scorecard or judges may say, you performed better than any of us key-strokers did simply by showing up. So congrats!

[tmadden]

Man I love that color!!

[Matt@BOS]

Aaron, thanks dude! I really need to thank Bill and Yancy for giving me the opportunity to compete in the event. All of us are at least a little bit competitive, otherwise we wouldn't be looking for ways to go faster. I had a great time out there with the car last weekend even though my times didn't set the world on fire. However, next year I will be equally happy to go out there, hang out an BS without having to worry about driving.

BTW, it was funny running into on the street on Friday night. Out of the corner of my eye I was thinking, "hey, that guy looks like Aaron," but it seemed to random of a place and chance occurrence to be you.

Sieg, you perfectly captured the look of "ouch that power steering fluid really burns when it gets in those cuts." Man, I don't know, or want to know what is in that fluid, but I still have grime that seems like it is etched into my hands from handling those dirty fittings soaked in p/s fluid.

I should probably give the talk about design points a rest, but I had what I thought was a good idea:

I think each car should receive xx/25 points based on sub categories (each would carry a maximum of 5 points and minimum of 1)consisting of, strength of concept, cohesiveness of design, fit and finish, form and function and overall presence. This would lend more objectivity to the segment since judges would be basing their decisions less off of personal preference, and more off of personal opinion of how strong a car functioned in each sub category. For example, if a trans am styled car or vintage race style car (i.e. Strope's Martini Mustang) was being judged and it had a rear Lexan window and zero billet parts, and a judge happened to have a preference for billet parts, and limo tinted glass, the car would still be able to receive a fair shake based on the attention to detail used to distinguish the vintage racing theme throughout the car. Most importantly though, it would not force the judges to assign a simple objective points style ranking with clear winners and losers to a subjective design segment. Everyone competing has put a lot of effort into their cars and this system would acknowledge everyone rather than giving (in my opinion) some well built cars zero points. Suppose next year that half of the field is comprised of award winning cars of very similar build quality judges, with this idea judges won't be forced to give one car 25 points and another equally impressive car 5 points.

Okay, guys, that's my idea. what do you think?

[FETorino]

Okay, guys, that's my idea. what do you think?

I agree.

The ranking in the design piece needs to be eliminated. It should be more of a design poker run as you describe with points for specific aspects. There doesn't need to be a winner and loser in the design portion but cars built to a high level should ALL get points.

I would also say there should be points within this potion for actual street car amenities. This is supposed to be the Ultimate street car competition.

[Vegas69]

My opinion is that the rules are clear before you have the privilege to run the event. It takes 4 solid segments to win including subjective judging. Without the judging, a race type car could easily wipe up the competition with the right driver. The rules seem to favor this segment as a pro touring car has won all but one year?

[Tom.A]

I think it is great you made the show and drove it there. Congrats!

[Chassisworks]

My opinion is that the rules are clear before you have the privilege to run the event. It takes 4 solid segments to win including subjective judging. Without the judging, a race type car could easily wipe up the competition with the right driver. The rules seem to favor this segment as a pro touring car has won all but one year?

Agreed. This is my PERSONAL opinion: As soon as you take out the judged portion the spirit of the event will dissipate, the level of build will go down, and the true race cars will come out to play. I have a buddy with an address in Montana; it would be pretty easy for me to register anything to that address.

It's an INVITATIONAL. Even cars who qualify through other events are not guaranteed a spot.

[dontlifttoshift]

Okay, guys, that's my idea. what do you think?

Like.

By standardizing the points system, it makes much more sense. It wouldn't be that hard to put together a plus or minus points system and leave most of the personal opinions out of it. You could break it into 5 categories with a maximum amount of 5 points per category for a maximum total of the same 25 points.

One category could be comfort and convenience with one point for each
-heater or ac unit
-radio
-interior, including carpeting
-windshield wipers
-put a decibel meter in the car at idle, I have no idea what the number should be but the it could be pretty high

Those points are pretty clear cut and most street cars should have no problem picking up 5 points right there.

One subjective category could be overall appearance/fit and finish and be subjectively judged on a 1 to 5 scale by people without any involvement in the cars that are competing. 1 point available for each of the following:

-panel alignment and gaps
-paint finish and detail
-custom fab work
-stance and wheel/tire fit
-cohesiveness of theme/execution

Even if your car isn't judge friendly because you painted it pepto bismol pink with baby blue spash graphics, you can still pick up points here. Wheels either fit or they don't, and panels are aligned or they aren't. 1 point if they do/are or zero points if otherwise.

I don't have it all figured out but something like this would accomplish the orginal goal of keeping out the racecars and promoting quality cars that are well thought out and streetable.

Drag week and OneLap have proven that if you can tolerate it, you can drive a racecar across the country, to think that a 75 mile cruise proves streetability is wrong. But using the points to reward someone for building a streetable car seems to be inline with the original intent.......to me.

[Chassisworks]

Drag week has proven that if you can afford to rebuild a $150,000+ Pro-Mod when it's over, you can drive a racecar across the country.

Fixed! :D

[Flash68]

I was lucky enough to received one of the limited edition Topps cards for the Matt Alcala driven 69 Camaro.

[Matt@BOS]

I was lucky enough to received one of the limited edition Topps cards for the Matt Alcala driven 69 Camaro.

I still have several stacks of those cards and don't know what to do with them.

[Sieg]

I still have several stacks of those cards and don't know what to do with them.

Close pin them to the spokes of your Stingray. :D

Nice time today! :thumbsup:

[sixnina]

I was lucky enough to received one of the limited edition Topps cards for the Matt Alcala driven 69 Camaro.

Those are badass I didn't get one:y0!:

[Vince@Meanstreets]

me too... Does it come with the gum stick that gives you a head ache when you chew it ?

Give em hell today Matt

[bulldog19]

Matt picture of your car from post SEMA Cruise on Hot Rod Website.
http://blogs.hotrod.com/sema-2013-cruise-130-photos-of-our-favorite-rides-94175.html/2013-sema-cruise-1969-chevrolet-camaro-rs-040/#axzz2lHPfYXgZ

[Matt@BOS]

Matt picture of your car from post SEMA Cruise on Hot Rod Website.
http://blogs.hotrod.com/sema-2013-cruise-130-photos-of-our-favorite-rides-94175.html/2013-sema-cruise-1969-chevrolet-camaro-rs-040/#axzz2lHPfYXgZ

Dang, I almost didn't recognize my car because it looks so clean in that picture. :lol:

[GregWeld]

I'm leaving a Matt A smudge on the trailer and a couple of tools in your honor. Lol

Was great spending some time with you at OUSCI and Scottsdale.

[FETorino]

Dang, I almost didn't recognize my car because it looks so clean in that picture. :lol:

That picture makes your car look like it's worth 2 design points:D

:cheers:

[fleet]

More press. :rolleyes:

@CamaroPerform: #Monday for the #WIN

Get some #Camaro right here: http://t.co/xKlzbBUbyZ http://t.co/NOmZKjGNw6

[pitts12driver]

Great work! Looks amazing and coming along well.

[Matt@BOS]

So, I'm bringing this back from the dead. It's been four years, and I've probably only put 4k miles on it at most. That might not seem weird for a hot rod, but when its working and trouble free, I drive it EVERYWHERE.

The cool thing about this build thread is that it chronicles pretty much everything from the time I new almost nothing except for things I'd learned on the internet, all the way up to the point where I'd learned "a little something."

Now that I'm running things over at Best of Show, I figured it was time to clean the car up, fix all of the things I was unhappy with, and see just how solid of a daily driveable pro touring Camaro we can build!

We started rebuilding the car at the beginning of 2018. In 2017 I dropped in a new LS7 from a well known engine builder, ran a total of two events, pulled the motor to seal up leaks, found out the bearings were shot after 1500 miles, rebuilt it, went to LS Fest West, and then lost a titanium valve spring retainer on my way home. At that point I decided to let it sit in the corner of the shop for a while.

Everyone has issues with hot rods, and I think it takes a couple builds to figure out what works and what doesn't for the type of car you want to build.

I logged about 37k miles on the Camaro, on the street and the track, and everything we're doing is designed to make it better at being a dual purpose car.

I'll outline all of the changes and parts going back on the car with photos, and discuss why we're using them, but for now, here's what we're doing, and its basically everything except for the body and interior (for now)

-New AME subframe with custom control arms, and spindles designed by Lateral Dynamics
-AME IRS
-JRi shocks valved by JJ at Ultimate Performance
-Restomod Air
-New brake system
- 454 LS7 with Dailey dry sump
- centerforce Dyad clutch
-complete rewire with American Autowire
-Racepak IQ3 display
-cooling system updates

[Flash68]

Been waiting for the details on all of this Matt. :cheers:

What's the bore and stroke on the new 454?

[Air-bender]

Hello,
Are you rebuilding the LS7 or sourcing a new engine?

[Matt@BOS]

Been waiting for the details on all of this Matt. :cheers:

What's the bore and stroke on the new 454?

It’s 4.185” bore and a 4.125” stroke.

Hello,
Are you rebuilding the LS7 or sourcing a new engine?

The engine going back in is a rebuild of the old wet sump 454 I had in the car. That engine lasted two years with a lot of miles. It had some oiling issues, along with some other things. I kept waiting for it to blow up and it wouldn’t. I finally pulled it after it fouled a set of plugs in 150 miles. Two of the pistons were missing corners, haha.

It’s always difficult to tell what factor(s) and it can be multiple, were contributing to the failure. Because of this, I always make sure all of the oil lines and cooler are checked and cleaned and also send the injectors out. We also had a bad coil pack, so I replaced the whole set.

[Ns RS]

We started rebuilding the car at the beginning of 2018. In 2017 I dropped in a new LS7 from a well known engine builder, ran a total of two events, pulled the motor to seal up leaks, found out the bearings were shot after 1500 miles, rebuilt it, went to LS Fest West, and then lost a titanium valve spring retainer on my way home. At that point I decided to let it sit in the corner of the shop for a while.”


Hi matt I remember you mentioned this to me at ousci last year did engine builder ever make good on a fix for your motor or did you chalk it up as a loss cause?

[Matt@BOS]

We started rebuilding the car at the beginning of 2018. In 2017 I dropped in a new LS7 from a well known engine builder, ran a total of two events, pulled the motor to seal up leaks, found out the bearings were shot after 1500 miles, rebuilt it, went to LS Fest West, and then lost a titanium valve spring retainer on my way home. At that point I decided to let it sit in the corner of the shop for a while.”


Hi matt I remember you mentioned this to me at ousci last year did engine builder ever make good on a fix for your motor or did you chalk it up as a loss cause?

I always have a difficult time figuring out what to do when it comes to sending stuff back to get fixed. I have a shop, and I know that sometimes things happen. As much as we try and get things right the first time, every now and then we have to go back and fix something. However, I also try and gauge whether or not its worth my time to send it back. My time is worth something and if I think I'll get stuck in endless troubleshooting/repair hell, I'd rather pay to rebuild or buy a new engine and be able to use the car!

In the instance with the engine in question, I decided to send it out for machining and rebuild it in house, instead of sending it back to the builder, and that's why I haven't mentioned them by name. I also just wanted to send the motor back and get a refund, but they weren't up for that.

Anyway, here's why I chose to rebuild it. The first time I pulled it, I found valves from two different manufactures that had different shaped bowls and a 13 percent difference in weight. If it was a kid putting the the heads together, I could maybe understand, but this wasn't an isolated incident, another one of our builds had the same issue. There were other issues like over half an inch of slop in the timing chain, cam bearings that weren't lined up with the oil passages, etc. When I got it all back together I broke a titanium retainer. The engine only had 3k total miles on it, 3 autocrosses and 20 minutes of road course time.

For those concerned about buying what I did, you are more than welcome to private message me.

[Ns RS]

I always have a difficult time figuring out what to do when it comes to sending stuff back to get fixed. I have a shop, and I know that sometimes things happen. As much as we try and get things right the first time, every now and then we have to go back and fix something. However, I also try and gauge whether or not its worth my time to send it back. My time is worth something and if I think I'll get stuck in endless troubleshooting/repair hell, I'd rather pay to rebuild or buy a new engine and be able to use the car!

In the instance with the engine in question, I decided to send it out for machining and rebuild it in house, instead of sending it back to the builder, and that's why I haven't mentioned them by name. I also just wanted to send the motor back and get a refund, but they weren't up for that.

Anyway, here's why I chose to rebuild it. The first time I pulled it, I found valves from two different manufactures that had different shaped bowls and a 13 percent difference in weight. If it was a kid putting the the heads together, I could maybe understand, but this wasn't an isolated incident, another one of our builds had the same issue. There were other issues like over half an inch of slop in the timing chain, cam bearings that weren't lined up with the oil passages, etc. When I got it all back together I broke a titanium retainer. The engine only had 3k total miles on it, 3 autocrosses and 20 minutes of road course time.

For those concerned about buying what I did, you are more than welcome to private message me.

I followed your build and had wondered what happened as the car was mia for a while so I asked.

I was disappointed to hear of your motor problems - I followed your build (among others) and was vested in it. It was sad to hear anyone from the lat g community experience such troubles but the other inconsistencies you listed above is just plain lazy.

Appreciate you sharing your opinion then and now and making the offer to others to pm you if they have questions. Experience shared publicly or via pm is still sharing.

I wouldn’t hesitate to

1) Officially use the vendor/member feed back section and
2) also unofficially pm anyone here for their thoughts on any vendor or member I’m about to engage in a transaction and
3) use a credit card in the event it turns to dogsht.

I feel I’d get honest opinions either way then be able to proceed in making my own informed decision after.

[glassman]

Sorry to hear about you putting it back together, i was hoping to pick it up for 20 cents on the dollar :)

Love this car alot, one of my favorite 69's, from the color to the rims to the "performance" (stuff happens,,,,right?)

I think i read it right, a 454 LS right?

Anyways, best, mike

[Matt@BOS]

Sorry to hear about you putting it back together, i was hoping to pick it up for 20 cents on the dollar :)

Love this car alot, one of my favorite 69's, from the color to the rims to the "performance" (stuff happens,,,,right?)

I think i read it right, a 454 LS right?

Anyways, best, mike

Mike, I’m sorry you didn’t buy it for 20 cents on the dollar too. You’re honestly way better off waiting for me to dump a ton of money into it, sort out all the issues and then sell it for 50 cents on the dollar.

...and yes 454 all aluminum LS7, well technically it might be a 457.

[rustomatic]

With all this talk of special builder-specific LS stuff going wrong (I think I remember the big-time builder you mentioned at Sonoma), can we at least hear that the crate motor in your awesome white Mustang still works correctly?

Your (expensive) experience reminds me of why I gave up on both machine shops and automatic transmission rebuilders in the late 1990s: They always seemed to require unnecessary return trips, sometimes including court.

Here's looking forward to seeing the IRS go into this car!

[Matt@BOS]

With all this talk of special builder-specific LS stuff going wrong (I think I remember the big-time builder you mentioned at Sonoma), can we at least hear that the crate motor in your awesome white Mustang still works correctly?

Your (expensive) experience reminds me of why I gave up on both machine shops and automatic transmission rebuilders in the late 1990s: They always seemed to require unnecessary return trips, sometimes including court.

Here's looking forward to seeing the IRS go into this car!

Yeah, the Mustang's engine is still running strong (knock on wood)! There isn't anything too radical with it though. All of the aftermarket parts on it have undergone factory durability testing. At the end of the day, I think you're always choosing between reliability and power. I know after two to three years, I'll probably refreshing the engine in my Camaro again.

[WILWAXU]

Yeah, the Mustang's engine is still running strong (knock on wood)! There isn't anything too radical with it though. All of the aftermarket parts on it have undergone factory durability testing. At the end of the day, I think you're always choosing between reliability and power. I know after two to three years, I'll probably refreshing the engine in my Camaro again.

Well.. you keep the Mustang's RPM's so low.. it should live forever :lmao:

[Matt@BOS]

Well.. you keep the Mustang's RPM's so low.. it should live forever :lmao:

I should probably raise the rev limiter. its set so low I keep bouncing off of it.

I'm working on getting the major stuff on the Camaro done this weekend so we can hopefully fire it this coming week!

[WILWAXU]

I should probably raise the rev limiter. its set so low I keep bouncing off of it.:ohsnap: where it set now?

[Matt@BOS]

:ohsnap: where it set now?

It’s set at 8k, which is safe, and gives some room for over revs on shifts. The rotating assembly is balanced up to 8400rpm and nobody really seems to talk about when the valvetrain starts to to get unhappy.

[Matt@BOS]

Okay, time for a few photos, and some tech! If you're building a car, or sorting one out, hopefully this info might be of use.

The Art Morrison front Subframe bolted right into the car. To run the Dailey dry sump we had to notch one of the motor mount stands on the AME subframe. We also machined a set of offset aluminum bushings for the rack in order to drop it down a little and get its lines to clear underneath the dry sump pump. We may decide to go with a Woodward unit in the future. I had a DSE 20:1 rack. Its been very reliable, but it feels like there is a little squishyness to it (maybe bushings are partly to blame). I installed an AGR 15:1 unit before running LS Fest West, which was the final event in the car before rebuilding it. Steering was noticeably faster and more "direct" feeling. Maybe its just me, but the initial turn in on the 20:1 rack is vague and difficult to feel. Once it is turned in, it seems much more precise when adding steering input. Before you guys tell me that its bushings or slip angle in the tires, I tested back to back.

Next up on the suspension, would be the billet 1" drop spindles from Lateral Dynamics, along with prototype adjustable A arms. These arms allow for fine tuning camber, caster and track width.

I also put together a splined Speedway engineering swabar and drop down mounts so that the bar will not interfere with, or limit steering angle. After a bunch of testing and measuring, we found that the tie rods would be the first thing to hit at full lock. With a pair of rack limiters, I think we would be able to run a 12" wheel up front, and be in board enough to turn the tires at a low ride height without hitting the fenders.

I also redid part of my exhaust for ground clearance. At some point I'm going to change header flanges.

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