'65 Fastback project

[Matt@BOS]

A couple of years ago I decided it would fun to build a second car. Looking back it is surprising that it was only two years ago that I had most naive of understandings of cars. Especially project cars. Sometimes I wish I could take myself back to a time when I thought that there such a thing as a "done" car. I would definitely have more money.

All car projects start out innocently enough, mine especially. Seeing as how my dad and I had finished building a Camaro, I wanted a Mustang to go with it. I looked around for several months, searching for a '69 sportsroof. I thought a trans-am inspired Mustang might be a nice counter point for our "sophisticated" - and I use that term loosely - Camaro. Hanging around these websites, and going to SEMA, etc. I tend to get a lot of ideas, not all of which fit on one car.

One day I noticed that Mark of Lateral-Dynamics fame was selling a little '65 Fastback project car. For five thousand dollars, you can't really go wrong. When it comes to buying fastbacks in that price range, something resembling a tear drop shaped roof with some other metal attached is usually all one can hope for. So, I bought it. It needed repair work on the quarters and doors, nothing unusual. It really wasn't terrible. After blasting the car we discovered there was just enough rust though that about every respective corner of the car needs a spot patched here or there.

After blasting it and getting it in etch primer I let the car sit to save up a bit of money. All the while trying to figure out what to do with it. Every time I looked at it, I thought it looked really wimpy, like a secretary's car with a cool roof. First I lived with the look. I told myself as long as it had a cool stance I would be happy. Then I realized I wouldn't be able to stuff big tires under the car. The rear could be mini tubbed, but the front was a problem. I looked at fender flares, I mocked up some off the shelf fiberglass "E2" flares that help make '65s look like bastardized Eleanor cars. Those didn't work. Next I moved on to modeling some out of high density foam. Those still didn't give me the look I wanted. I started paying close attention to Ron S's "$5000 dollar budget Mustang." It is low, wide, and rounded compared to a stock little slab sided Mustang. Campbell Auto Restoration did pair similar to Ron's, and after seeing those I decided that was the direction that I was going to head in.

Off I went to buy sheet metal. I needed quarters and wheel houses, but figured I'd buy another set of fenders just for good measure. Oh, and I should mention now that I did so because I decided this was something that I might as well try and do myself. Having never done this, I figured it might take a couple of tries. $500 later (which seems like a great deal) I was on my way.

The guys at Best of Show were kind enough to give me a little corner of the shop, and let me barrow all of the assorted tools necessary to make a mess of things, and of course, make plenty of noise.

I figure most of you probably probably didn't bother reading my ramblings. That's okay. Mike Casti who is okay at sketching out Muscle Cars helped render things. My skills are limited to pencil and paper. Casti's are pretty much limited to the computer Chrysler sends him for work.

http://i366.photobucket.com/albums/oo103/69MSA/MattStang1.jpg

I wanted this car to be a little more obnoxious and racer car looking than the Camaro. Here is a rendering which draws its inspiration from a GT3. Now that I think about, it has to be blue and white!

http://i366.photobucket.com/albums/oo103/69MSA/MattStang22a.jpg

[Matt@BOS]

Getting started on the fender stretch I realized how weird it would look it if the doors were completely flat, while the fenders and quarters bulged out. Thus, I decided to carry the stretch all the way through the doors.

To maintain the location and the subtle, natural curve in the upper side body line elected to make a bunch of vertical cuts and pull everything out and up. Because the width increased from the door handle to the center of the wheel opening I was able to get by just adding in a a tapered strip, without ending up with a straight line.

http://i366.photobucket.com/albums/oo103/69MSA/IMAG0390.jpg
http://i366.photobucket.com/albums/oo103/69MSA/IMAG0339.jpg

http://i366.photobucket.com/albums/oo103/69MSA/IMAG0359.jpg
I mocked up a fender flair on top of the stretch but ultimately decided it looked too tacked on. I want the design to flow and like something Ford could have done, rather than something aftermarket.

With the upper part of the fenders and doors cut, I needed to bring the bottom out as well. To accomplish a little bit more of the "race car look" I decided to add fender vent behind the front wheels a la the Ferrari F40, Carrera GT, Viper, etc. Besides, doing this meant that I wouldn't have to stretch the middle of the doors :lol:

To create the smooth curved transition I used a small slip roller.

http://i366.photobucket.com/albums/oo103/69MSA/IMAG0392.jpg


To finish off the the opening I bent a little bit of round stock on the tubing bender. This was also done to add a little bit more strength just to insure nothing buckled, or bent excessively.
http://i366.photobucket.com/albums/oo103/69MSA/IMAG0474.jpg

I couldn't help but toss in a little bit of mesh just to see what it would look like.
http://i366.photobucket.com/albums/oo103/69MSA/IMAG0399.jpg

[daemon2]

Very nice start!

[Matt@BOS]

With the upper part of the door in place I moved onto the bottom. Because I added the fender vent in, I also needed to add some metal to the bottom of the door and since I there was rust in bottom corner I just replaced the whole bottom part.

http://i366.photobucket.com/albums/oo103/69MSA/IMAG0419.jpg
http://i366.photobucket.com/albums/oo103/69MSA/IMAG0519.jpg

After doing this I decided to to start playing around with one of the quarters so that I could what one whole side of the car would look like.

Off with the old!
http://i366.photobucket.com/albums/oo103/69MSA/IMAG0361.jpg

I think I've said this before, but I really have no idea what I'm doing. I usually as the guys if I can try something, and they say "sure, go do it."

These seemed like good places to make some cuts...
http://i366.photobucket.com/albums/oo103/69MSA/IMAG0367.jpg

http://i366.photobucket.com/albums/oo103/69MSA/IMAG0370.jpg

I tech screwed the fender in place. I need to spend some serious time grinding and hammering before I put it on. Then again maybe I should just buy another and start fresh. My still very basic skills have come a long way since I started, and I probably spend more than half my time fixing everything I do, usually at least twice. The doors and fenders have been cut countless times now. Actually, I've lost count :willy:

http://i366.photobucket.com/albums/oo103/69MSA/IMAG0376.jpg

Rolled out into the light, it still looks as ugly as ever.

http://i366.photobucket.com/albums/oo103/69MSA/IMAG0465.jpg

[Ron in SoCal]

Dude...if you don't do it at least three times, it aint right...:lol:

Seriously, having seen this car in person, I like where it's going. Much respect for getting in there and creating what you see in your mind's eye. I've always admired your creative streak and this is your canvas..:cheers:

[56pickup]

Looking good Matt! I am looking forward to this one! What are you planning on running for motor?

[waynieZ]

Rock on Matt! Looking good.

[67zo6Camaro]

Wow, Im floored! and so impressed. Im smiling from ear to ear and very proud that you took this project on. As your skills increase you will find that pride beaming to the surface no matter what someone says.

All great artist and/or fabricators have to start some place. You definately seam like you have the passion for the automotive industry wheather it's in the building or the designing phase.

As for the Ford.... I will always have a love for these cars. My first muscle car was a 68 Mustang. And as of Late, I always have my eye on an early Fastback as you have. My thought has been to splice the car down the middle and add about 4".

Anyway, I will be looking forward to your updates on this one. Man I wish we lived closer Matt, because I would be by there often to offer my help.

:cheers:

[Vince@Meanstreets]

Nice work Matt, this ones gonna be a new fav.

[Vegas69]

I'm with Brett, I can't think of a better way to learn than to jump in and start creating. If you mess it up to bad, you can always crush it. After all, it's a Furd. :D

I'll be down to see it soon. :unibrow:

[67zo6Camaro]

After all, it's a Furd. :D

:

Lol, did ya mean Turd?

[Flash68]

Matt, kudos to you for getting in there and just learning on the fly and making mistakes as you go and fixing them to the best (or least) of your ability. Big respect to you for that. And that stuff looks half decent to me. :thumbsup:

But I hate that I am starting to like these Mustangs more and more...

[fleetus macmullitz]

Matt,

Very cool how you're making your vision happen. :thumbsup:



But I hate that I am starting to like these Mustangs more and more...

I've heard that half the battle is learning to like them 'Stang stripes.

[ironworks]

I see so many guys go and spend 30K on a Wyotech diploma only to just have a shot gun blast of the basics. If you know you what to learn about how to build or work on cars, I think your money ahead to just dumping 30k into a desirable project. Just work on it until it's perfect. At the end you shoudl be able to get some kind of return on investment.

It's more important to care about the results then to actually have skill. You can learn skill, talent only speeds up the process. If you don't like it cut it off and off and do it again.

What is the worst thing that can happen, you have to re-quarter panel the car. Heck even some proshops can't do what you workin on. So the car goes to another shop to be re-quartered. I'm sure you have seen that a time or 2. :D :D :D

[Flash68]

I wanted this car to be a little more obnoxious and racer car looking than the Camaro. Here is a rendering which draws its inspiration from a GT3. Now that I think about, it has to be blue and white!

http://i366.photobucket.com/albums/oo103/69MSA/MattStang22a.jpg

Love it. Please do the GT3RS theme... grey and red would be a nice change. Blue and white is so played out. :unibrow:

[Jr]

The blue and white in the gt3rs paint would look good.

Have you considered the Maier racing rear setup? I love the look of that rear suspension setup.

[Tom.A]

I see so many guys go and spend 30K on a Wyotech diploma only to just have a shot gun blast of the basics. If you know you what to learn about how to build or work on cars, I think your money ahead to just dumping 30k into a desirable project. Just work on it until it's perfect. At the end you shoudl be able to get some kind of return on investment.
:D :D :D

Well said:thumbsup: I think the trade schools are way over rated.

Looks good Matt. Are you still looking at doing the cobra IRS?

[Ron in SoCal]

Details Matt. We need details! :hail:

[Flash68]

I'm envisioning a Coyote motor... right?

[ironworks]

Love it. Please do the GT3RS theme... grey and red would be a nice change. Blue and white is so played out. :unibrow:


Needs some red on the wheels to be proper

[Matt@BOS]

Hey guys, thanks for all of the positive feedback! Pictures don't even begin to cover the amount of time I've spend working on this thing. At first I think at least half of my time was spent just looking at things and trying to figure out how to approach each different area of the car. I was really cautious (at least I thought I was) about trying to get things to fit, without any real knowledge of how to accomplish what I wanted. They guys at the shop, have been incredibly helpful taking the time to show me techniques, but just like anything else, you generally aren't good at something the first time you try it. Dealing with that bent up quarter doesn't bother me in the least. The fenders and doors really tested my patience though. I had to completely remake those at least once, and have made so many cuts to remove high and low spots that it felt like a never ending process. That for me has been the hard part. Now that it is starting to resemble something I felt more comfortable sharing with everyone.

Since I'm going to start working on the quarters soon I figure that I need to be thinking about packaging the rear suspension. Tom, I know I talked with you about running an '04 Cobra IRS. I kicked that idea around for a few months, but I don't like the really wide track width associated with it. The rear wheels would have almost zero back space, and that would mean I would need the fronts to match. Not really sure I want to do that.

I've been looking at Mike Maier's setup and it really isn't bad for the price. right now, I think that might be what I'm leaning towards. It also looks cool, and I want this car to have an equal emphasis on looking cool and going fast.

DSE will be shipping their Mustang stuff within next month or so, and I would also love to have some of their parts on this car. Their suspension also allows you to put a Coyote motor in the engine bay. They even offer an option for LS engine mounts. I don't have a Coyote motor right now, but I do have an LS2 :_paranoid I've also collected a TR6060 that is practically brand new, and still have my old T56 which needs to be rebuilt. Hopefully some combination of those parts will work.

This evening there are a few more comments I'd like to get back to, and a few more pictures to post up!

Matt

[GrabberGT]

Im not fond of the "Ford Racing" script but love the concept. Would like it even better if it were blue instead of red though.

http://i366.photobucket.com/albums/oo103/69MSA/MattStang22a.jpg

[wiedemab]

It's more important to care about the results then to actually have skill. You can learn skill, talent only speeds up the process. If you don't like it cut it off and off and do it again.


Well said - - That has kind of been my motto on most of my projects. I really think that if you know what it is supposed to turn out like, you can get there. That's why I love seeing the work that the pro (the truly professional) shops do. It helps me and others to strive for that next level. It will take me much longer to get there (and likely will never be as good as the best, but better than some).

Great project - I love these little Mustangs. Keep up the good work!

[WSSix]

Looks good, Matt. I think it's great you're jumping right in on this build. Best of luck to you.

[65 347]

Very cool ideas, nice to see someone else build an early mustang. The LS motor idea is not bad, a lot of guys were putting the LS in fox bodies and were really fast.

Maybe with the hood stripe put the motor size or something like that.

Mike

[Matt@BOS]

Wow, Im floored! and so impressed. Im smiling from ear to ear and very proud that you took this project on. As your skills increase you will find that pride beaming to the surface no matter what someone says.

All great artist and/or fabricators have to start some place. You definately seam like you have the passion for the automotive industry wheather it's in the building or the designing phase.

As for the Ford.... I will always have a love for these cars. My first muscle car was a 68 Mustang. And as of Late, I always have my eye on an early Fastback as you have. My thought has been to splice the car down the middle and add about 4".

Anyway, I will be looking forward to your updates on this one. Man I wish we lived closer Matt, because I would be by there often to offer my help.

:cheers:

I definitely need to drop by your shop sometime and see what you've got going on in there. I'm sure I can find something to learn about. Maybe steal a couple of Ron's secret ideas too.

Have you seen the Ring Brother Producer Mustang? They widened that car about four inches total by adding 2" per side to the doors, fenders... everything. You can't even really tell anything was done in pictures.

Matt

[Matt@BOS]

Aside from sheetmetal, I bought my first parts for this project last weekend. I happened to be in just the right place at the right time got a pair of Ford GT seats. I've always thought these were the coolest looking vaguely retro sport seats. I looked into finding a pair for my Camaro, but at the time there weren't any for sale and list price from the Ford dealership was something absurd. I remember thinking each seat cost twice as much as my first car, so figure 7-8k a seat :wow: That's why they didn't end up in my Camaro.

Somehow I got these for $1400 for the pair. They are fancy and made of carbon fiber. Hopefully they add a little bit of lightness to made up for the filler, and wimpy Ford motor I hope to put in.

http://i366.photobucket.com/albums/oo103/69MSA/IMAG0510.jpg
http://i366.photobucket.com/albums/oo103/69MSA/IMAG0511.jpg

Matt

[Vince@Meanstreets]

Aside from sheetmetal, I bought my first parts for this project last weekend. I happened to be in just the right place at the right time got a pair of Ford GT seats. I've always thought these were the coolest looking vaguely retro sport seats. I looked into finding a pair for my Camaro, but at the time there weren't any for sale and list price from the Ford dealership was something absurd. I remember thinking each seat cost twice as much as my first car, so figure 7-8k a seat :wow: That's why they didn't end up in my Camaro.

Somehow I STOLE these for $1400 for the pair. They are fancy and made of carbon fiber. Hopefully they add a little bit of lightness to made up for the filler, and wimpy Ford motor I hope to put in.

http://i366.photobucket.com/albums/oo103/69MSA/IMAG0510.jpg
http://i366.photobucket.com/albums/oo103/69MSA/IMAG0511.jpg

Matt

fixed you @#!?& lucky guy. :lol: nice score. 8 lbs each?

[Flash68]

God I always have wanted a pair of those GT seats. Never thought they'd go for less than several thousand. Awesome score you dirty dog! Gonna really class up that secretary's car. :unibrow:

[WSSix]

Those seats rock! They will look fantastic in the mustang.

[DOOM]

Matt I'll be watching this one!!! But PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE put a Ford motor in it!! :cheers:

[Bryce]

Matt,

What are your suspension plans?!?!

[DFRESH]

Dude, that is sweet! I've always wanted a fastback---I love what you are coming up with on this one. Impressed at your skill sets--what a blessing to be able to delve into your creative side and have a place to let it run. I can only imagine how cool that must be.

How is Dad's car coming along?

D

[mdprovee]

Matt, I am impressed with your skill set, and just try attitude. I have wanted a little Mustang to make as a track car, so I will be watching this one.

[Chad-1stGen]

Very cool Matt! Looking forward to watching this build up. Love the 65/66 Fastbacks. Probably my second favorite car after a first gen Camaro.

[Matt@BOS]

Matt I'll be watching this one!!! But PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE put a Ford motor in it!! :cheers:

I will do my best to put a Ford motor in it. I almost bought a new Boss 302 motor. However, the car had been in a rollover, and the seller wanted way too much for it. Both of those things pretty much scared me away quickly.

Part of me just wants a little crate motor that would make for a nice daily driver, however the car is becoming increasingly less like something I would driver everyday. As soon as a get one nice part then I have to get another one, and the snowball continues :willy:

Matt

[Matt@BOS]

Matt,

What are your suspension plans?!?!

Hey Bryce, the shop is a dealer for DSE, so I'm considering their front. I know there are less complicated solutions to improving handling, but I still think their stuff is worth every penny. Installing their stuff is way less of a hassle than any of the other competitors' products that I've seen roll through Best of Show.

As for the rear, maybe Maier Racing? It might sound stupid, but when I pick parts for a car, I want parts that fit the rest of the level of the car I'm trying to build. In this case, I need something that works well, but also looks cool. I don't really care if the suspension looks really cool when I'm driving it, but I do if I'm trying to sell it eventually.

If you can talk me into something else, go right ahead :unibrow:

P.S. Doug, Chad, Mike, Mario, Brett - can't believe the number of you guys coming out of the Ford closet. It's crazy. (Dave doesn't count. We know he's been a little FoMo-curious for a while now).

[Chad-1stGen]

I've always liked these cars. One of the first cars I ever drove, and the first muscle car was a first gen stang.

I've always wondered why there are not more of them being pro-toured...

http://www.pro-touring.com/showthread.php?77820-Why-aren-t-there-more-Pro-Touring-Mustangs&highlight=

[Flash68]

P.S. Doug, Chad, Mike, Mario, Brett - can't believe the number of you guys coming out of the Ford closet. It's crazy. (Dave doesn't count. We know he's been a little FoMo-curious for a while now).

:lol: Nice. I can't argue.

[waynieZ]

I love the seats Matt, they'll definitely make a statement on the looks side of the equation.

[FETorino]

Somehow I got these for $1400 for the pair. They are fancy and made of carbon fiber.

Matt

The other week when I was donw there I couldn't help but like you. You just seemed like a great guy but now: Now out of complete jealousy that you found the seat I have dreamed of for my Torino at a price I can afford I hate you. :lol: Help a brother out and find me a set.


Hopefully they add a little bit of lightness to made up for the filler, and wimpy Ford motor I hope to put in.

Matt

Hey I saw your work so far and from a design perspective it looks very nice. I don't think you had that much filler on it.

You've been driving that Shelby so you know those Fords run just fine.:D

I still say build an old school windsor based motor using a stock Ford CPU and quarterhorse tuning software. Lots of trackable power to be had for cheap.

[Matt@BOS]

The other week when I was donw there I couldn't help but like you. You just seemed like a great guy but now: Now out of complete jealousy that you found the seat I have dreamed of for my Torino at a price I can afford I hate you. :lol: Help a brother out and find me a set.



Hey I saw your work so far and from a design perspective it looks very nice. I don't think you had that much filler on it.

You've been driving that Shelby so you know those Fords run just fine.:D

I still say build an old school windsor based motor using a stock Ford CPU and quarterhorse tuning software. Lots of trackable power to be had for cheap.

I'm sort of glad you weren't over at JR's when I stumbled upon those seats last week. We might have started a bidding war, haha. In other related news, can I interest you in a set of Sparco Milano seats that I was saving for a rainy day :unibrow:

How much would a Windsor with EFI run me? I have noknowledge about old Ford motors, and while the thought of putting one in has crossed my mind, I just know more about mod motors, and wouldn't hesitate to take the car back to RTTH with a Coyote in it, knowing that I could knock down 25mpg+ and not have to worry about blowing anything up on the track.

Matt

[Vegas69]

I really think you will regret building the same type of car you have already. Take what you've learned and apply it to this one.:unibrow: Specifically, less maintenence and more reliability.

[Matt@BOS]

I really think you will regret building the same type of car you have already. Take what you've learned and apply it to this one.:unibrow: Specifically, less maintenence and more reliability.


Less maintenance, and more reliability? Why do you think I decided to build a Ford this time :unibrow:

I've been thinking about how to make a better, faster car for a while now. I think our definitions of better and faster are going in completely different directions though. I doubt I'll be able to make this thing weigh more than 3100lbs. Right off the bat it should have a 400lb weight advantage. the car is flared 2.5." It's going to have more front tire (probably a 295) and a little less rear tire (295-315). Horsepower is a lot of fun, but I don't know that I'll need much more than 500 in this car. If I do add a blower (650ish) the car should still be fairly light. I'd like to run a dry sump and all kinds of oil coolers. I'm going to open up some quarter scoops to house those things. They'll probably just look cool, but maybe I'll drive fast enough, and long enough to take advantage of them.

Honestly, I wanted to just throw together a solid, relatively light car to have fun with, but I do tend to obsess over design elements I just couldn't make the car ugly. I don't really care about shiny paint, but since it is kind of a BOS car it will probably get that eventually. I doubt it will get too many rock chips since it will be ahead of the Camaros, and almost all Pro Touring cars are Camaros :lol:

Matt

[Vegas69]

I like your mind set on this one.

[Flash68]

I like your mind set on this one.

Yep. Sounds like a guy who's made a few "mistakes" on previous cars. :D

Seriously the plan sounds tough to argue with man. And I like to argue.

[Rick D]

Matt have you considered this front setup from the Roadster Shop?

http://www.roadstershop.com/products/1964-70-fast-track-mustang-suspension-ifs-form

Or

http://www.roadstershop.com/products/1964-70-fast-track-mustang-suspension-subframe-form

They seem to look really nice and cost is in line with the other setups out there.

[Matt@BOS]

Matt have you considered this front setup from the Roadster Shop?

http://www.roadstershop.com/products/1964-70-fast-track-mustang-suspension-ifs-form

Or

http://www.roadstershop.com/products/1964-70-fast-track-mustang-suspension-subframe-form

They seem to look really nice and cost is in line with the other setups out there.

Rick, I saw the Roadster Shop's front clip and their full frame when I visited them last year. They have outstanding build quality! I was not aware of their kit that welds in over the existing frame rails though. That is also some something to consider since I would like to keep the original pieces intact because the car has frame connectors, and crossmembers already built into the floor, and I would hate to replace something useful that came with the car.

I'm trying to keep things simple. I swear. I'd like to buy something that provides plenty of adjustment, and keeps added weight to a minimum, which is one of the really promising aspects of DSE front setup, which is made out of (mostly) aluminum. I also just remembered Agent 47 Racing. I like their stuff too. It isn't too over the top, looks like it installs easily, and gets the job done too.

http://www.agentfortyseven.com/harbinger/index.html#

So many choices now :willy:

Matt

[Flash68]

I also just remembered Agent 47 Racing. I like their stuff too. It isn't too over the top, looks like it installs easily, and gets the job done too.

http://www.agentfortyseven.com/harbinger/index.html#

So many choices now :willy:

Matt

Oh yeah that is another sweet option. That Harbinger is a beast! And I believe they are local to you down there, or close at least. At least you have some great options for this stuff... almost as many options for a stinkin Camaro. :D

That DSE Stang sure is kickin some butt since it came out.

[Matt@BOS]

Oh yeah that is another sweet option. That Harbinger is a beast! And I believe they are local to you down there, or close at least. At least you have some great options for this stuff... almost as many options for a stinkin Camaro. :D

That DSE Stang sure is kickin some butt since it came out.

Yeah, they're over in Carlsbad. My family is in construction/development, and I used to have to do plan take offs, and other horribly boring things related to mandated road improvements that the city would eventually pay for, for the street Agent 47 is off of. I still got lost trying to find them when I went to visit one day. Trust me though, when I found them, it was worth the little detour that I took. They're a rapid prototyping company that makes all kinds of stuff with really cool machines. They have a wall of CNC mills, 3D scanners and printers, machines that will "grow" parts out of pools of resin, etc.

Speaking of options, JME is another company that makes Mustang parts, and also happens to be fairly local to me:
http://www.jmeenterprises.com/JME%20New%20Suspension.shtml

Julio's stuff is cool as well, but there is now way I'm paying 10k+ for front suspension after adding in the cost of shocks and springs. I could probably build and race a Fox body car for that much.

Oh, and about DSE's Mustang, it has been kicking ass on small 340 treadwear tires. Something must be working there.

Matt

[FETorino]

Yeah, they're over in Carlsbad. My family is in construction/development, and I used to have to do plan take offs, and other horribly boring things related to mandated road improvements that the city would eventually pay for, for the street Agent 47 is off of. I still got lost trying to find them when I went to visit one day. Trust me though, when I found them, it was worth the little detour that I took. They're a rapid prototyping company that makes all kinds of stuff with really cool machines. They have a wall of CNC mills, 3D scanners and printers, machines that will "grow" parts out of pools of resin, etc.

Speaking of options, JME is another company that makes Mustang parts, and also happens to be fairly local to me:
http://www.jmeenterprises.com/JME%20New%20Suspension.shtml

Julio's stuff is cool as well, but there is now way I'm paying 10k+ for front suspension after adding in the cost of shocks and springs. I could probably build and race a Fox body car for that much.

Oh, and about DSE's Mustang, it has been kicking ass on small 340 treadwear tires. Something must be working there.

Matt


What about Griggs racing? They have been racing Mustangs new and old for a long time. Take a look at their GR 350 stuff.

http://www.griggsracing.com/

[Matt@BOS]

What about Griggs racing? They have been racing Mustangs new and old for a long time. Take a look at their GR 350 stuff.

http://www.griggsracing.com/

I thought about Griggs. Honestly, with the right tuning and driving all of the suspension offerings will probably provide for a really fast car. I kind of want to stick with what I'm either somewhat familiar with, or with people in the community/those local to me. That is why I keep coming back to DSE, Maier, or even the Roadster Shop after Rick mentioned them. I like the shocks all of those companies use, and I know they've spent some time developing their systems to work on street tires. I figure if I mix and match front and rear, I'll be a little bit ahead if I keep it within that circle. Maybe I won't have to do quite as much sorting things out. I could spend countless phone calls being that annoying customer that spent hours of time on the phone without ever ordering anything, but I'm trying to avoid that. So far I'd give my self a passing grade :lol: I've only bugged each of them once so far.

Matt

Ugh... I'm never going to make up my mind!

[Ron in SoCal]

Speaking of options, JME is another company that makes Mustang parts, and also happens to be fairly local to me:
http://www.jmeenterprises.com/JME%20New%20Suspension.shtml

Julio's stuff is cool as well, but there is now way I'm paying 10k+ for front suspension after adding in the cost of shocks and springs. I could probably build and race a Fox body car for that much.

That's my vote! I'll spend your project $$$ Bro. Make sure you get the cantilever rear too :D

Really all the options mentioned are good. Just a matter of personal preference...:thumbsup:

[Ron in SoCal]

Might be changing my vote...:lol:

http://www.pro-touring.com/showthread.php?90493-DSE-Mustang

[Matt@BOS]

Might be changing my vote...:lol:

http://www.pro-touring.com/showthread.php?90493-DSE-Mustang

Something is wrong with you. And Rob, and Dave. And Rick. All of you guys have remained on topic. We need to mark this page as an important day in history.

About DSE:

Pricing should be up in the next week or two, everything should be ready to ship sometime in July. If it does come out to 6 or 7k with remote canister shocks, that is about what I budgeted. Damn Ron, we could still buy a Fox body.

[Rick D]

Matt it is very easy to spend other guys money :lol:

Oh and I think I may have to change my vote, that DSE setup does look very impressive!

As you said any of the above mentioned will most likely get you up front, now staying there that is a different matter :thumbsup:

[FETorino]

The DSE stuff looks pretty nice and they are beating on it at tracks everywhere to prove it works.

I know I mentioned Griggs but my vote would be Roadster shop or DSE. My experience with the RS has been great so far. From what I've heard DSE is also a great family vendor to deal with. Dealing with a vendor who is accessible and willing to stand by their stuff is probably the most important piece.

It looks like the DSE stuff is designed to sandwich the stock subframe, is that what I'm seeing?

If that is the case I guess the condition of your front frame structure may be a deciding factor. If it is in really good shape then maybe the DSE is the right choice. If it is haggered then maybe the RS complete front end makes the most sense.

[carbuff]

I'm curious, with all of this talk on a Mustang project. Is there any site, similar to Lat-G or PT.com for the Ford guys? Not that I want to promote a different site, but it seems that so few Mustang projects are posted here, and I have to believe that there is a similar contingent of Ford guys as these sites seem to be mostly GM based...

[FETorino]

I'm curious, with all of this talk on a Mustang project. Is there any site, similar to Lat-G or PT.com for the Ford guys? Not that I want to promote a different site, but it seems that so few Mustang projects are posted here, and I have to believe that there is a similar contingent of Ford guys as these sites seem to be mostly GM based...

HELLO, I'm right here a Ford guy. Mustangs aren't the only Fords you know.:lol:



Matt I think you should sell those seats to help finance your subframe.

[carbuff]

HELLO, I'm right here a Ford guy. Mustangs aren't the only Fords you know.:lol:

Yeah yeah, I know there are one or two of you here... ;) But you have to admit these sites are predominately GM based. I've never built a Mustang (or any other Ford except for my father's old street rods), but I'm thinking I might have an interest in one some day!

[FETorino]

Yeah yeah, I know there are one or two of you here... ;) But you have to admit these sites are predominately GM based. I've never built a Mustang (or any other Ford except for my father's old street rods), but I'm thinking I might have an interest in one some day!

Yep just like when I was a kid and would go into super shops and the majority of the stuff was for a SBC. It's just the way it is. There are plenty of Ford sites devoted to engine building, drag racing and restoring cars but nothing PT specific that I know of.

When you say GM you mean LS don't you? Even your Pontiac doesn't have Pontiac power. Some of the Ford on here aren't Fords they have LS power.

Anyway when you pick that Ford someone here will know where to get the info you ned to build it.:D

[carbuff]

When you say GM you mean LS don't you? Even your Pontiac doesn't have Pontiac power. Some of the Ford on here aren't Fords they have LS power.

Not yet, but that is still the plan. It's still running the Pontiac 400 for now (and I just tuned it up last weekend since I still don't have a place to start the teardown yet!).

There are a few guys holding down the fort with some SBC and BBC power still. But yes, it's an LS-world in the majority I think. And I have 600HP of LS-goodness waiting to be installed!!! :woot:

[FETorino]

Not yet, but that is still the plan. It's still running the Pontiac 400 for now (and I just tuned it up last weekend since I still don't have a place to start the teardown yet!).

There are a few guys holding down the fort with some SBC and BBC power still. But yes, it's an LS-world in the majority I think. And I have 600HP of LS-goodness waiting to be installed!!! :woot:

Hmm the pictures in your link the red car has a SBC in it. You know 600hp out of a Pontiac is pretty easy to do these days.:D

[56pickup]

HELLO, I'm right here a Ford guy. Mustangs aren't the only Fords you know.:lol:






I am also a die hard Ford guy! :thumbsup:

[Matt@BOS]

Hmm the pictures in your link the red car has a SBC in it. You know 600hp out of a Pontiac is pretty easy to do these days.:D

Besides, 600 hp out of a Pontiac would be more fun than 600 from an LS.

Matt

[carbuff]

Hmm, I need to update my link then. Yep, the red car had an SBC, but I've since sold that car and the engine (separately, the engine went to a friend building a hot rod), and have purchased the blue one in my avatar. It is a Formula with (currently) a Pontiac 400. :)

Since I haven't built an LS car yet, I'm definitely going that route. But I definitely appreciate the potential those 'other' engines have...

And Matt, sorry about the hijack. ;)

[cencalc6]

Nice Looking Build Matt! :thumbsup:

[Ron in SoCal]

About DSE:

Pricing should be up in the next week or two, everything should be ready to ship sometime in July. If it does come out to 6 or 7k with remote canister shocks, that is about what I budgeted. Damn Ron, we could still buy a Fox body.

No can do Sir :D. 68 - 70 Fastback. Go big or go home...:cheers:

[Musclerodz]

based upon what I know about pricing on the new sub, pricing is similar to Chevy II sub. Expect just under $7500 retail on bare sub with canister shocks. Actual pricing is being released at Columbus. You know you want to go DSE.:yes:

[Matt@BOS]

No can do Sir :D. 68 - 70 Fastback. Go big or go home...:cheers:

Yep, that money could probably get us a vin and a roof!

Mike, I do want to go DSE! I think Kyle and Stacy would like me to go DSE, and I'm sure Dick would be happy if I ordered all those parts too :lol:

Here's the latest photo of my handy work. It's amazing what some Fibral and a skim coat of filler can do.

http://i366.photobucket.com/albums/oo103/69MSA/IMAG0524.jpg

Matt

[FETorino]

Yep, that money could probably get us a vin and a roof!


Matt

I know a guy who will give you some $$ for some seats to get you and Ron closer to that 70 fastback goal. :lol:

[Matt@BOS]

I know a guy who will give you some $$ for some seats to get you and Ron closer to that 70 fastback goal. :lol:

You kidding, I should be able to straight up buy a '70 fastback for those seats :lol:

It's not too late to buy the drivetrain from the Ford GT though, the owner only wanted 15k for it complete, from dry sump to Ricardo transaxle. Just get rid of your back seat. I'm sure the guys at the Roadster shop can make it work. You should do it. You would be my hero.

Matt

[Ron in SoCal]

It's not too late to buy the drivetrain from the Ford GT though, the owner only wanted 15k for it complete, from dry sump to Ricardo transaxle. Just get rid of your back seat. I'm sure the guys at the Roadster shop can make it work. You should do it. You would be my hero.

Matt

x2! Go Rob, Go...:thumbsup:

[Rick D]

x2! Go Rob, Go...:thumbsup:

X3 Rob, :thumbsup: :thumbsup: :woot:

[FETorino]

x2! Go Rob, Go...:thumbsup:

Nope I want my seats from the future and my motors from the past.

My little retro mil will have more hp and weight less than that supercharged mod motor.:D

I'm going to see if I can find some money to put that GT drivetrain in a 1st gen. Now that would be cool.

You kidding, I should be able to straight up buy a '70 fastback for those seats :lol:


Matt

Ok now that your warm to the idea of selling them let's talk price :unibrow:

[Flash68]

You kidding, I should be able to straight up buy a '70 fastback for those seats :lol:

It's not too late to buy the drivetrain from the Ford GT though, the owner only wanted 15k for it complete, from dry sump to Ricardo transaxle. Just get rid of your back seat. I'm sure the guys at the Roadster shop can make it work. You should do it. You would be my hero.

Matt

:thumbsup: Come on Rob.... be the real Rob in So Cal and be all that you can and should be. :D

[FETorino]

:thumbsup: Come on Rob.... be the real Rob in So Cal and be all that you can and should be. :D

I'll buy the drivetrain if you put it in your Camaro.:thumbsup:

[Flash68]

I'll buy the drivetrain if you put it in your Camaro.:thumbsup:

Done! I'd put a SB2 in a Pantera... I don't see much of a difference. :D

[Matt@BOS]

Got some work done on the passenger side quarter. I'm definitely going to have to do the driver side one this way too :lol:

After my first attempt I learned that it would be much easier to fit if I kept all of the edges of the original panel in place. Pulling and stretching the face of the panel while also trying to keep the edges in place before spot welding wasn't the greatest idea. I guess you could say I was asking that quarter skin to do too many things at once. This time around I made sure to give my self a reasonable amount of overlap that I could probably trim away later if need be.

http://i366.photobucket.com/albums/oo103/69MSA/IMAG0534.jpg

The first problem I ran into was getting the wheel opening to line up and have the right curvature. Two things that weren't good happened. One, I found out that pulling everything out just increased the radius and upset the arc of the wheel opening to the point where nothing lined up. Second, the '65's quarters are pretty straight up and down, and moving the the upper section of the wheel arch out was not pretty. Essentially, it just swiveled up, and started to look concave. You can see in the picture below that the sides stick out more than the top. I managed to fix this by relief cutting the inner lip, and massaging things until I got the shape I wanted. I also slid the middle piece of the quarter down to close some of the gap that I'd created.

http://i366.photobucket.com/albums/oo103/69MSA/IMAG0540.jpg

With the added width of the new quarter I've got room for brake ducts, or diff and trans coolers, or something...

http://i366.photobucket.com/albums/oo103/69MSA
/IMAG0542.jpg

Finally it is starting take on a little more shape. It is taking on more of a '69 Camaro side profile, and I don't think that's a bad thing :unibrow:

http://i366.photobucket.com/albums/oo103/69MSA/IMAG0548.jpg

Matt

[coolwelder62]

Hey guys, thanks for all of the positive feedback! Pictures don't even begin to cover the amount of time I've spend working on this thing. At first I think at least half of my time was spent just looking at things and trying to figure out how to approach each different area of the car. I was really cautious (at least I thought I was) about trying to get things to fit, without any real knowledge of how to accomplish what I wanted. They guys at the shop, have been incredibly helpful taking the time to show me techniques, but just like anything else, you generally aren't good at something the first time you try it. Dealing with that bent up quarter doesn't bother me in the least. The fenders and doors really tested my patience though. I had to completely remake those at least once, and have made so many cuts to remove high and low spots that it felt like a never ending process. That for me has been the hard part. Now that it is starting to resemble something I felt more comfortable sharing with everyone.

Since I'm going to start working on the quarters soon I figure that I need to be thinking about packaging the rear suspension. Tom, I know I talked with you about running an '04 Cobra IRS. I kicked that idea around for a few months, but I don't like the really wide track width associated with it. The rear wheels would have almost zero back space, and that would mean I would need the fronts to match. Not really sure I want to do that.

I've been looking at Mike Maier's setup and it really isn't bad for the price. right now, I think that might be what I'm leaning towards. It also looks cool, and I want this car to have an equal emphasis on looking cool and going fast.

DSE will be shipping their Mustang stuff within next month or so, and I would also love to have some of their parts on this car. Their suspension also allows you to put a Coyote motor in the engine bay. They even offer an option for LS engine mounts. I don't have a Coyote motor right now, but I do have an LS2 :_paranoid I've also collected a TR6060 that is practically brand new, and still have my old T56 which needs to be rebuilt. Hopefully some combination of those parts will work.

This evening there are a few more comments I'd like to get back to, and a few more pictures to post up!

MattMatt,I like the Idea of an LS power in a ford chassis.It's kinda like givin Cindy Crawford a new Boob job.:thumbsup: :thumbsup:

[Matt@BOS]

Matt,I like the Idea of an LS power in a ford chassis.It's kinda like givin Cindy Crawford a new Boob job.:thumbsup: :thumbsup:

Funny, I think Mario and Rob might love you for that comment. Somethings just don't need to be changed, and maybe a Ford in a Ford is one of those things :lol:

Matt

[FETorino]

Funny, I think Mario and Rob might love you for that comment. Somethings just don't need to be changed, and maybe a Ford in a Ford is one of those things :lol:

Matt

I'm good with Cindy's boobs as they are.:D

In the end it's your car so do what You want with it.:thumbsup:

You should sell me those seats though.

[Matt@BOS]

I'm good with Cindy's boobs as they are.:D

In the end it's your car so do what You want with it.:thumbsup:

You should sell me those seats though.

Not a chance on the seats bro. I'm also going to liken those seats to Cindy's boobs. If you got your hands on them, would you ever let go of them?

If for some reason they don't fit in my svelte, lightweight little car, I'll make sure they find a good home in your boat.

Matt

[Matt@BOS]

Little update. Or maybe it is a big update without any pictures. I bit the bullet and ordered suspension. The front is DSE's new Aluma-frame
Link: http://www.detroitspeed.com/1964-1970-Mustang-Products/032050-aluma-frame.html

Part of the reason I went with DSE up front is because I should, in theory be able to run a really big front tire. a 265 measures about 10.7" so with a 2.25" stretch maybe I can fit a 315, which is about 12.6." If I end up with a 295 I won't be disappointed either. As for the back, I could have bought a Quadralink, (and I'm very happy with the one in my Camaro), however Mike Maier's torque arm got my money. I really like the adjustability, i.e. ease of making spring changes, not having to crawl under the car to adjust shocks, etc. It also comes standard with a Speedway Engineering floater built into the cost of the kit.
Link: http://www.maierracing.com/
I've been working on the back part of the car, and as per usual, it has been fighting with me. Fitting the quarter initially was the easy part. The contour of the quarters has changed so much that I was forced to build my own outer wheel houses from scratch. As for the inner wheel houses, I just pushed them inwards to the factory frame rails. The goal was to get a 335 in the back, however the frame rails curve out to much at the back to be able to accomplish that, and it looks like I'll end up with a 315. Hence why DSE's new kit has an asterisk that notes that '64.5-'66 cars need to have their frame rails narrowed 1" for a 315 tire.

Made sure that I've got some space for some kind of oil cooler and/or brake ducting.
http://i366.photobucket.com/albums/oo103/69MSA/IMAG0563.jpg
http://i366.photobucket.com/albums/oo103/69MSA/IMAG0564.jpg

More pictures to follow as I get the back part together. All of the suspension should be arriving in about a month :D

Matt

[FETorino]

Matt

Sounds like you will have a slick suspension platform to dial in.

Is the rear kit the one with the cantilevered shocks in the trunk?

When the suspension stuff comes in let me know I'd like to stop by and have a look at it.

I promise I won't get near your seats:rofl:

[67XR7]

Matt your my Hero, I didnt want to be the first to buy the DSE Kit. after all the stuff Ive been going through to make my existing R&P kit fit the gateway front suspension....... I'm to the point now where I'm ready to just go DSE and get rid of the other stuff. please keep us updated!

[Ron in SoCal]

Matt - love the.suspension choices! I saw the DSE mustang in Columbus and that Coyote motor fits great...:D

[Matt@BOS]

Matt

Sounds like you will have a slick suspension platform to dial in.

Is the rear kit the one with the cantilevered shocks in the trunk?

When the suspension stuff comes in let me know I'd like to stop by and have a look at it.

I promise I won't get near your seats:rofl:

You would have to search pretty hard for those seats. We made sure to find and out of the way spot for them. :unibrow:

And yes, the rear kit is the cantilevered "Extreme" setup. I'm getting a couple different sets of springs and rocker arms with different motion ratios just to keep up with all the cool stuff is keeps finding.

As always, you're more than welcome to drop by the shop to see what's going on. I'll be sure to let you know when everything comes in.

[Matt@BOS]

Matt - love the.suspension choices! I saw the DSE mustang in Columbus and that Coyote motor fits great...:D

Good, you will have to tell me about how awesome it was when you get a chance. And I'm glad the Coyote motor fits. I ordered the kit with Mod motor mounts (none of my friends seem to have trouble free LS engines, except Shipka, and I don't even want to talk about my LS history) so I am looking forward to trying to stuff a blown Coyote under the hood. I want to keep it as close to factory Ford/Ford Racing as I can. Basically I want something reliable, and I think the best way to do that is to get a Ford Racing Aluminator which comes with forged crank, rods and 9.0:1 pistons built for boost.

Matt

[Matt@BOS]

Been busy sanding filler. Since I got pretty crazy with the metal work and it looks like the car might actually turn out nice, soon I'll be handing it over to Jesus at the shop to go over the side one last time for me and fix all of the wobbles and heavy sanding scratches along the side. Then it will finally get a coat of primer, well at least one side will. I'll be busy buttoning up the other side in the mean time.

Right now it looks like one of those funny test cars with splotchy camo on it, so forgive me if the side just looks like a blob.

http://i366.photobucket.com/albums/oo103/69MSA/IMAG0583.jpg
http://i366.photobucket.com/albums/oo103/69MSA/IMAG0582.jpg
http://i366.photobucket.com/albums/oo103/69MSA/IMAG0581.jpg

Just for reference I snapped some shots of another customer's 1965 coupé, which he has owned since new. From certain angles you can really see how much the side of the car has been changed!
http://i366.photobucket.com/albums/oo103/69MSA/IMAG0585.jpg
http://i366.photobucket.com/albums/oo103/69MSA/IMAG0589.jpg
http://i366.photobucket.com/albums/oo103/69MSA/IMAG0586.jpg
http://i366.photobucket.com/albums/oo103/69MSA/IMAG0588.jpg

Matt

[FETorino]

Matt

You should be proud:thumbsup:

It looks stout but subtle.:wow:

[Ron in SoCal]

That's a homerun buddy. Dick needs to give you a promotion...:cheers:

[Rick D]

That looks great Matt, you are doing an awesome job for your first time! You really can't see the stretch from the side view, but when you show the other stang WOW you really see it :thumbsup:

[waynieZ]

Very nice Matt! You've come a long way since I saw you. It looks great! You've got to be happy with how its coming out.:thumbsup:

[Flash68]

Dude that is impressive. You are actually talented. :thumbsup:

[Track Junky]

I'm really hating liking this. :mad:

[Matt@BOS]

Dude that is impressive. You are actually talented. :thumbsup:

Well, I don't know about actually talented...

I have access to a bunch of tools, and really wish I knew how to use them.:unibrow:

The good news is that I've gotten pretty good with a hammer, and the truth is I have learned that almost everything can be fixed with a hammer, and everything that can't be fixed with a hammer can be fixed with a couple different "straightening compounds" that come in cans. After that it is just a function of patience, concentration and dedication. I gotta say, that's where I struggle and that's why my whole car isn't in primer right now, lol.

Matt

[Matt@BOS]

I'm really hating liking this. :mad:

It's ok. There was a guy down the street from the shop that took one look at it and said, "good, he's making it look more like a Camaro." Just think about it that way.

Matt

[Vince@Meanstreets]

It's ok. There was a guy down the street from the shop that took one look at it and said, "good, he's making it look more like a Camaro." Just think about it that way.

Matt haa haaa thats not nice. Great work Matt, so are you working at BOS now?

[Flash68]

haa haaa thats not nice. Great work Matt, so are you working at BOS now?

If you mean by "working" hanging out and borrowing tools and making a mess, than yes. :lol:

[Vince@Meanstreets]

If you mean by "working" hanging out and borrowing tools and making a mess, than yes. :lol:

Im liking that arrangement.

[89 RS]

Your work is looking good Matt. Pretty good for a guy who is just "hangin' out". :D

[Track Junky]

Dave and I saw a cool looking 65ish stretched Mustang with 315's all around at Sonoma Raceway. I forgot my camera at home. Hopefully Dave got a pic and can post it. :unibrow:

[57hemicuda]

Looking down the side of that car from the top, is like Deja VU. Looks good, its funny once you get use to looking at the swollen version, the Ford version doesn't look right anymore.



http://57hemicuda.smugmug.com/Cars/Mustang/girls-with-erickson-boys-009/445664122_LPYvz-L.jpg

http://57hemicuda.smugmug.com/Cars/Mustang/mustang-fender-010/503651427_C3Ckq-L.jpg

[Bryce]

looks good Matt!

[Matt@BOS]

Looking down the side of that car from the top, is like Deja VU. Looks good, its funny once you get use to looking at the swollen version, the Ford version doesn't look right anymore.



http://57hemicuda.smugmug.com/Cars/Mustang/girls-with-erickson-boys-009/445664122_LPYvz-L.jpg

http://57hemicuda.smugmug.com/Cars/Mustang/mustang-fender-010/503651427_C3Ckq-L.jpg

I know I've posted elsewhere, but I want to reiterate that your car was a major inspiration getting me into all of this mess. The more I looked at your car, and the more I looked at the foam fender flares I sculpted for mock up, the more I knew that giving the car some curves was the only way to go.

Your car has, hands down, the best stance on any early Mustang. I really wanted to raise the front wheel opening too, but I didn't want to rip you off that blatantly. :lol: Everything else I've done has just been an attempt to further evolve the design. Well, the side vents I made as much out of laziness as anything else, I figured it would take me forever to stretch the metal in the middle of the doors, and rebuilding all of the body lines to stock appearance would have been hell. They also draw attention to the fact that the car is 2.25" wider than stock, and I wanted some of my hard work to be noticed, haha.

Matt

[Matt@BOS]

If you mean by "working" hanging out and borrowing tools and making a mess, than yes. :lol:

Yeah, well, it definitely beats "working" for the family business this past year, which would have consisted of sitting in on meetings and doing everything that accounting thought was beneath them:lol: I did that for a number of years and this is way more fun. I even managed to get a few of them off my back after they randomly saw me on TV whilst channel surfing passed SEMA coverage :lol:

Matt

[Matt@BOS]

Little bit more progress has been made. DSE parts also shipped out today. I definitely have more of an appreciation for custom fabrication by the day. Jesus has been going back and tidying up all of my work on the passenger side of the car, as I finish up the metal work on the driver side. It is amazing what a difference a little bit of skill and experience will do. He has been getting the lines on the car pretty nice and crisp, and has also been "adding lightness" by removing extra filler than I had on the car.

http://i366.photobucket.com/albums/oo103/69MSA/IMAG0609.jpg
http://i366.photobucket.com/albums/oo103/69MSA/IMAG0608.jpg
http://i366.photobucket.com/albums/oo103/69MSA/IMAG0610.jpg
http://i366.photobucket.com/albums/oo103/69MSA/IMAG0603.jpg

Matt

[Vegas69]

I'm diggin that Matt.

[ironworks]

It's really cool to see you get out there and give things a try. Not being scared to give something a try is the biggest battle.

It's only metal it can be fixed if you screw it up.

[Flash68]

Have a pro come in and clean up the mess. Always a wise plan. :D

Are those NewGens for mock up only or are they going on?

[Matt@BOS]

Todd, Rodger, glad you guys are liking it. A lot of work has gone into trying to make a ford look cool, and I'm glad it is starting to pay off :lol:

Dave, I will be running New Gen Lites on the car. Jon sold the set of split 5 spoke New Gens on my Camaro, and intended to make me a set of the 10 spoke wheels he designed, but that was right before everything went south. By the time the dust settled I asked if he could just build me a set of Lites for the Mustang. I like the Team 3 Mini Lite wheels as well, especially because they have more of a step lip design to them, however, I think the New Gen Lites are the perfect blend of retro-modern for my car which will draw on a mix of past and present road racing influences :thumbsup:

Oh, and the Lites aren't anymore money out of pocket for me at this point, so that also helps keep the build moving along faster, especially now that I am starting to need parts.

Matt

[Ron in SoCal]

... glad you guys are liking it. A lot of work has gone into trying to make a ford look cool, and I'm glad it is starting to pay off :lol:

Matt

Matt great job Sir! :yes: :cheers:

[67zo6Camaro]

http://i366.photobucket.com/albums/oo103/69MSA/IMAG0608.jpg
http://i366.photobucket.com/albums/oo103/69MSA/IMAG0610.jpg
http://i366.photobucket.com/albums/oo103/69MSA/IMAG0603.jpg

Matt

I was just about to ask when an update was due...

Super cool lines. Especially when you cover up all the color spots.:yes: this thing is just growing and maturing into something special. Keep the work and post comming.

[Matt@BOS]

I was just about to ask when an update was due...

Super cool lines. Especially when you cover up all the color spots.:yes: this thing is just growing and maturing into something special. Keep the work and post comming.

Because you're so good about your updates, I'll do my best as well. Don't think mine could ever be quite as detailed. About all I can say for the last round of pictures is that Jesus had to break out the DA to sand down a bunch of my excess filler, and then put on a skim coat to smooth things out further.

Now, the pictures below demonstrate just how much of a difference nice crisp lines make. Oh, and having everything in one solid color helps a little too :D Up until now it was probably really difficult for anyone on a computer to tell what the everything looked like. I guess today is the moment of judgment. What say you guys? Love it or hate it?

http://i366.photobucket.com/albums/oo103/69MSA/IMG957409.jpg

http://i366.photobucket.com/albums/oo103/69MSA/IMG956080.jpg

http://i366.photobucket.com/albums/oo103/69MSA/IMG950137.jpg

Matt

[Jtomas801]

Looks great! Awesome job.


Jon

[Flash68]

Dude. That looks great. Weld building cars. You building cars. There goes the neighborhood.

[Rick D]

Nope sorry I don't like it, I think you should scrap the whole thing and start with a different car.

Tell you what Matt I will send a truck to pick it up and get it out of your way?? Sound good??? :unibrow:





Ok I like it!!! :cheers: Great job!!! :cheers:

[DBasher]

Looks great, nice work!:thumbsup:

:cheers:
Dan

[Matt@BOS]

Thanks guys!

Dude. That looks great. Weld building cars. You building cars. There goes the neighborhood.

Nah, I wouldn't say the neighborhood has gone to sh** until you start building cars in your garage. I guess that could be sooner than I previously thought since you now have a garage. Just promise me you won't turn into Todd. One is all the world needs, and we might just have gotten another one, Vega$69 :lol:

Rick, if you send a truck, I will make sure it doesn't head back empty. I have quite a pile of Mustang sheetmetal lying around at this time. almost enough to build another car. Some assembly required. Quality fitment not guaranteed.

Matt

[Cris@JCG]

Looking good MAtt! Can I drive this one when it is done.. since you have already let me drive the SHelby.. :D

[waynieZ]

Matt it looks great!! you had it all fabed up on that side when I was there. Would love to see it in person now. Awesome job!

[Sieg]

Pretty impressive Matt! :thumbsup:

[67XR7]

I like the wheel choice matt, I went to look at the next Gen stuff and one thing lead to another and well....... without starting some big debate or argument on driverz inc, did you buy those wheels recently and if so where? thats all just want to wheel shop some more.

[FETorino]

Matt

That just keeps looking better :thumbsup:

That is going to be one sweet Mustang :D

Get a windsor based stroker with dry sump and you're ready to rock.


:cheers:

[WSSix]

I like it!:thumbsup:

[GrabberGT]

I know its a little early but have you given much thought to color? This combo actually looks pretty nice. Kind of a monochromatic, silver grey kind of look.

http://i366.photobucket.com/albums/oo103/69MSA/IMAG0603.jpg

[Matt@BOS]

Looking good MAtt! Can I drive this one when it is done.. since you have already let me drive the SHelby.. :D

I dunno Cris, how good are you at buffing cone rash off of clear bra?

[Matt@BOS]

Matt

That just keeps looking better :thumbsup:

That is going to be one sweet Mustang :D

Get a windsor based stroker with dry sump and you're ready to rock.


:cheers:

Still up in the air on that one Rob. I want a nasty old school motor, but I also think I might want to drive this car across the country, and a blown mod motor would be great for that.

Matt

[Matt@BOS]

I know its a little early but have you given much thought to color? This combo actually looks pretty nice. Kind of a monochromatic, silver grey kind of look.

http://i366.photobucket.com/albums/oo103/69MSA/IMAG0603.jpg

I've actually been thinking color all along. There are a couple light silvers with some interesting fine pearls, that look really slick, which I like. However, I'm leaning towards a twist on the iconic Shelby white and blue color scheme. I'm going for more of a vintage vibe than on my last build, so I'm probably going to have to stay clear from thousands of tones of grays I like. :lol:

Matt

[OLDFLM]

so I'm probably going to have to stay clear from thousands of tones of grays I like. :lol:

Matt

A project name your wife will like: "50 shades of Gray!" :rofl:

[GrabberGT]

A project name your wife will like: "50 shades of Gray!" :rofl:

Brilliant! Think about it next time your massaging those swollen fenders. :unibrow:

[Matt@BOS]

A project name your wife will like: "50 shades of Gray!" :rofl:

Don't have a wife. I started this Mustang a couple months after the girl very near and dear to me moved across the country. Coincidence... maybe, but it's not what you'd think. She has been in town recently and really wanted to stop by BOS to see the Mustang. Then she asked where the Camaro was because she missed it, so we had to drive down the street to say hi to it. She was dismayed to find that it currently has no engine. (I should mention now that I once asked if it was loud and annoying, and she said no - can you believe that?). After Visiting the Camaro she wanted to brew a batch of beer together (her choice was an English IPA). Oh, and she stopped by to make some sourdough bread today. It gets baked tomorrow, thanks to some obscenely long recipe from a bakery up in Dave's neck of the woods. Yes, I helped, and yes I compensate for partaking in such domestic activities by owning obnoxious muscle cars :lol:

Honestly, I need opinions. Should I just give up now and resign myself to life as a dorky, obsessed, car building, "racing Monk?" What are my odds at finding another woman that shows interest in, and enjoys said cars, is intelligent, attractive, funny, and brews beer, etc. etc? The only other woman, who I ran into at a car show, who genuinely liked my car, genuinely liked my car, and showed it way more interest than either myself, or the guy who later claimed to be her boyfriend. I cannot utter upon Lateral-G any of the things she said she wanted to do to my car. Just know, whatever is being posted in Ron's thread about trannys and shafts and, well I won't go on. In any case, none of that holds a candle to the things she talked about doing to my Camaro. No amount of clear bra, or instant detailer, or cleaner wax, would ever be able to make things right again.

I really wish I could say that either part, or all of this little story was either embellished, or fabricated, but the truth is, well... sometimes all you can say is that the truth just is.

Matt

[Rick D]

Uhh Matt and why do you let this "friend" of yours live across the country?? Sounds like you need to keep her close to you!!!

[OLDFLM]

Honestly my friend, my advice is stop looking!

I was president of the "He Man Woman Haters Club" after my divorce... single Dad of two girls... didn't date as a rule. Put my girls and my military career first. It worked, got both girls thru high school and college successfully, rose to the top of the ranks and got good at being alone.

Just when I swore I'd never get married or have kids again, I met my beautiful young bride! We now have to incredible little boys together and I've never been happier!!!

Last night after putting the boys to bed she said simply "What are you going to do in the garage tonight while I read my book?" She loves my car... loves the way it sounds with 3" dumps... loves the friends I've made in the hobby... and encourages me to spend time in my man cave.

They are out there my friend, stop looking... she'll find you! :yes:

[Matt@BOS]

Uhh Matt and why do you let this "friend" of yours live across the country?? Sounds like you need to keep her close to you!!!

She didn't feel like there were good opportunities to pursue a career of art and photography in San Diego. I've been given the really great opportunity to do what I want right now, which is something I couldn't have imagined even five years ago, and while I told her I didn't want her to leave, the last thing I'm going to do is tell her should stick around with me if it really interferes with pursuing her passion.

Matt

[GrabberGT]

Is it time to start a Relationships 101 thread?

Im not going to touch this myself. Im lucky to have my wife and family and I couldnt tell you how it happened.

[sokoloka]

Is it time to start a Relationships 101 thread?
This is something I'd actually be somewhat interested in seeing come together - I've had my fair share of interesting relationships and am now starting to wonder if I'll ever find anyone sane enough to get married to!

Back on track - the fastback looks GREAT! I'll have to stop by BOS in the next few weeks when I finally move back to SD. Figures I find out about all the cool car places after I move away for a year!

[DFRESH]

Well, first of all, if you want an opinion about a woman, you should know us by now---:ttiwop:

[89 RS]

Well, first of all, if you want an opinion about a woman, you should know us by now---:ttiwop:

:D

In all seriousness Matt, I'm no Dr. Phil, but I met my wife in college in a class that I needed for a science credit(not my major). The only reason I took the class was because my adviser said it would be an easy science class for me, turns out it was the only "C" I got in college. I did meet my wife there though, so it was worth it in the long run. We have been together for 15 years now, so I guess everything happens for a reason. A bonus is that my wife likes cars and understands my passion for all things automotive. When she wanted to help me change the oil on my car in college I knew that was a good sign.;)
Good luck to ya man.

[Vince@Meanstreets]

It might be a trick. Take her to the movies and pull the pop corn trick. See how she reacts then report.

[Matt@BOS]

:D



Well, first of all, if you want an opinion about a woman, you should know us by now--- :ttiwop:


:D
In all seriousness Matt, I'm no Dr. Phil, but I met my wife in college in a class that I needed for a science credit(not my major). The only reason I took the class was because my adviser said it would be an easy science class for me, turns out it was the only "C" I got in college. I did meet my wife there though, so it was worth it in the long run. We have been together for 15 years now, so I guess everything happens for a reason. A bonus is that my wife likes cars and understands my passion for all things automotive. When she wanted to help me change the oil on my car in college I knew that was a good sign.;)
Good luck to ya man.

Corey, you're not helping me out here, man. We met at an art class in college our senior year because both of us figured we had enough time to minor in something fun. :lol: For a minute I thought, you know, I do have a picture that might be appropriate. It shows her, in a small gallery where we went to college, facing away from the camera looking at a series of photos she took for a project photographing decay El Toro. I thought, this picture seems relevant, however without seeing her face, she would be kept safe from potential Facebook stalkers. I'm looking at you Doug, since I know we are Facebook friends :lol:

On a side note, Don't wander off at El Toro, not even to sneak in a little apple pie after RTTC. I went to help photograph the abandoned buildings, even if you have a permit. It is downright eerie. There is so little outside noise that you can hear every creak, rattle, clunk, or groan of the old hangers. You never know what noise is coming from where, and it is easy to confuse the noises for footsteps. There were a couple times I thought we were in the same building when we weren't. Some former marines say parts of the complex is haunted. :unibrow:

[Matt@BOS]

It might be a trick. Take her to the movies and pull the pop corn trick. See how she reacts then report.

I'm pretty sure the popcorn trick would not have an impact on things because she is already scheduled to leave on the next flight out of town tomorrow.

[ironworks]

Is there some type of subscribe you can do to this thread that will notify me when all this soft message in a bottle romance crap is done? This is getting all drawn out like Mario's thread, Doom, who is not trying to have a front fender unveiling. Just find a pix of Megan Fox and post it up. All this sappy crap is making my wife want to read my latg.

Haha

[DFRESH]

Is there some type of subscribe you can do to this thread that will notify me when all this soft message in a bottle romance crap is done? This is getting all drawn out like Mario's thread, Doom, who is not trying to have a front fender unveiling. Just find a pix of Megan Fox and post it up. All this sappy crap is making my wife want to read my latg.

Haha

:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

[FETorino]

Is there some type of subscribe you can do to this thread that will notify me when all this soft message in a bottle romance crap is done? This is getting all drawn out like Mario's thread, Doom, who is not trying to have a front fender unveiling. Just find a pix of Megan Fox and post it up. All this sappy crap is making my wife want to read my latg.

Haha

Seems like we are safe as of tomorrow night.:D


she is already scheduled to leave on the next flight out of town tomorrow.

[DFRESH]

It shows her, in a small gallery where we went to college, facing away from the camera looking at a series of photos she took for a project photographing decay El Toro. I thought, this picture seems relevant, however without seeing her face, she would be kept safe from potential Facebook stalkers. I'm looking at you Doug, since I know we are Facebook friends :lol:

I'll post it up shortly for everyone. :lol:

Let's talk at RTTC--or I'll be at C&C tomorrow morning--then off to a secret shop with A13 for some amazing changes to the car.

Double D

[Vince@Meanstreets]

I'm pretty sure the popcorn trick would not have an impact on things because she is already scheduled to leave on the next flight out of town tomorrow.

Doh, what ever you do... Do not cry, don't you shead a tear. LOL

[Matt@BOS]

I'll post it up shortly for everyone. :lol:

Let's talk at RTTC--or I'll be at C&C tomorrow morning--then off to a secret shop with A13 for some amazing changes to the car.

Double D

Sure thing Doug. We can talk at RTTC, tell Rodger to bring his wife, she will want to hear this story. Everyone else will need a little apple pie to admit to being interested.

Good luck finding that pic on Facebook. there are 85 year olds that are better at Facebook than me. WTF is timeline and why do I have it now?

So you guys quit bugging me, let's just get this over with. Here:
http://i366.photobucket.com/albums/oo103/69MSA/-8.jpg

I could post a picture of all of the boxes that came on a pallet yesterday, but I'll tell you guys right now that I didn't get 300lbs of chocolate and roses, so I doubt you'd care about what is in the boxes. :lol:

Matt

[Vince@Meanstreets]

Nice spy shot, let's see one with your arm around her man!!!


From what we can see she looks healthy :)

[Matt@BOS]

Nice spy shot, let's see one with your arm around her man!!!


From what we can see she looks healthy :)

Nope, that's all you're getting out of me. Maybe you'll see her if I drag her out to an event one of these days. Probably not on the west coast though. East coast/south might be fun though, I've been thinking of shipping my car out there to hit up some events one year. She does have a thing for speed, probably worse than me :lol: I remember driving separately up to the mountains and being asked, "what do you call it when the tires are screeching? You know, when you have to steer the other way."

Matt

[Matt@BOS]

Alright, new page, time for car stuff again. I had a little bit of free time yesterday, and couldn't keep myself from opening up my pile of boxes. I was like a kid at Christmas, okay better than Christmas.

Here is what arrived on Friday.

http://i366.photobucket.com/albums/oo103/69MSA/-5.jpg
http://i366.photobucket.com/albums/oo103/69MSA/IMAG0631.jpg

Alright, who has one of the other four before me? I know Strope got his a couple weeks ago.
http://i366.photobucket.com/albums/oo103/69MSA/IMAG0629.jpg

C6 spindles with 5x4.5" bolt pattern hubs, "severe duty" units will be available later in the year.
http://i366.photobucket.com/albums/oo103/69MSA/IMAG0624.jpg

Cast aluminum shock and control arm mount, with tubular upper and lower control arms. I'm looking forward to seeing how the new Speed-LIGN adjuster works for changing camber and caster. I cannot believe how much adjustability is built into this front end. I won't go into detail about all of it at the moment though.
http://i366.photobucket.com/albums/oo103/69MSA/IMAG0627.jpg
http://i366.photobucket.com/albums/oo103/69MSA
/IMAG0628.jpg

JRI Shocks. These just look well made, I really want get this car on the road to see what all the fuss is about with these. That probably won't be for a while though. These shocks are double adjustable for high and low speed rebound, unlike the former Afco units, which I believe had adjustment for low speed rebound, and compression. As for springs, this kit ships with with 400lb 10 in. front springs. My first thought was that this seemed a little under sprung, but I suppose with an aluminum N/A mod motor up front they really aren't that heavy. Somehow I have a feeling I will be changing things up for my needs.
http://i366.photobucket.com/albums/oo103/69MSA/IMAG0630.jpg
http://i366.photobucket.com/albums/oo103/69MSA/IMAG0626.jpg

Overall, I have to hand it to DSE, I have never seen an aftermarket part that comes close to resembling this. Their front subframe for the Camaro is amazingly well built, but this actually has aspects of today's OEM quality, coupled with the expected delrin bushed control arms, etc. :bow:

Matt

[Rick D]

WOW Matt :bow: :hail: :bow: :hail: :bow: :hail: that's just beautiful!!!!

That DSE stuff is really nice to :D :D

[89 RS]

Cool parts man, I can't wait to see this Mustang come together Matt.

[67zo6Camaro]

Not much to say here except Wow.

You know what picture I'm talking about don't you?:lol:

[Tom.A]

Coming along nice. I think we need more pictures to give our full opinion:D

[John510]

Awesome Matt!

[Vince@Meanstreets]

The 400's might be fine Matt, with the minimal cosine and effective ratio that the DSE geometry has worked into the frame.

[Matt@BOS]

:lol: you guys are all too funny. So, who is up for a little group road trip to the east coast? :unibrow: We can't miss Del Mar Thanksgiving weekend though. I was back there visiting her for Thanksgiving (which is when we realized things weren't going to work, haha) and I missed out on just about all of the fun in Del Mar. I'm not missing Del Mar this fall. Priorities, right?

Anyway, Vince, the reason I was thinking of adding more spring up front, was based off of two kinda vague assumptions. First being the fact that I am leaning towards a supercharged Coyote Aluminator engine, which would would put the engine plus intercooler weight in the 525-550 lb range. Second, after sorting out my Camaro, and driving several other similar ones, I'm starting to think I like a little more spring than DSE has been using on the first gens. I am also going to be putting somewhere between a 295-315 tire up front, which means I could probably add a little more spring, especially if the Mustang rolls as much as the Camaro does. Who knows what the car will actually need in order to drive the way I want it too. I might have rear springs that are stiffer than the fronts with the Maier torque arm...

Matt

[Matt@BOS]

Update! Been busy patching rust in the drip rails and replacing the panel behind the rear glass. That stuff really is no fun at all. I had to make some of that stuff from scratch. Everyone shaves drip rails, and now I think I know why. I probably had 30 hours into making and fitting the front corner on the driver's side drip rail so that the trim would fit over it perfectly.

Anyway, I started working on something a little more interesting, so here are some pictures. This was my first time playing with the English wheel, and I'm pretty happy I haven't had to make more than one hood scoop... at least so far. Still need to do some more hammering and grinding on it, but it is really starting to come around. Really wish I had big shrinker/stretcher. Making a bunch of cuts probably isn't the cleanest way of doing things.

The scoop is just a little bigger than stock, and will hopefully fit the engine I don't have yet :lol: The idea was to make something that looks vintage GT350ish and won't draw too much attention to itself.

http://i366.photobucket.com/albums/oo103/69MSA/IMAG0725.jpg
http://i366.photobucket.com/albums/oo103/69MSA/IMAG0724-1.jpg
http://i366.photobucket.com/albums/oo103/69MSA/IMAG0723.jpg
http://i366.photobucket.com/albums/oo103/69MSA/IMAG0730.jpg
http://i366.photobucket.com/albums/oo103/69MSA/IMAG0731.jpg
http://i366.photobucket.com/albums/oo103/69MSA/IMAG0729.jpg
http://i366.photobucket.com/albums/oo103/69MSA/IMAG0728.jpg
http://i366.photobucket.com/albums/oo103/69MSA/IMAG0726.jpg

[Flash68]

Dude. Looking soooo good. :bow:

[Rick D]

Very nice Matt, it must feel really good doing this one yourself :cheers:

[DOOM]

Love it Matt!!! With that new DSE front set up that FORD motor will look awesome in there.....:_paranoid

[Matt@BOS]

Rick, I'm getting to the point where it is starting to become more rewarding. I'm no longer having to spend endless amounts of time thinking about how to do things, and my work is starting to look much more presentable. By the time I'm done I might actually be good at this type of stuff. :_paranoid

Mario, I made that hood scoop with the intention that I could stuff a Boss 302 mod motor under there. According to the numbers DSE gave me, I should have 3/8" of clearance. Of course, If I put an LS in it, the scoop would mostly just be for show...

Matt

[Cris@JCG]

Looks good Matt! I vote for a LS ENGINE!!! Do it! I dare you!! You know I would do it.. :D :unibrow: :D


Rick, I'm getting to the point where it is starting to become more rewarding. I'm no longer having to spend endless amounts of time thinking about how to do things, and my work is starting to look much more presentable. By the time I'm done I might actually be good at this type of stuff. :_paranoid

Mario, I made that hood scoop with the intention that I could stuff a Boss 302 mod motor under there. According to the numbers DSE gave me, I should have 3/8" of clearance. Of course, If I put an LS in it, the scoop would mostly just be for show...

Matt

[Sieg]

Of course, If I put an LS in it, the scoop would mostly just be for show...

Matt
NEON wired to the tach lead!!!! :unibrow:

[Matt@BOS]

Looks good Matt! I vote for a LS ENGINE!!! Do it! I dare you!! You know I would do it.. :D :unibrow: :D

Really Cris, you would do something like that???

[Matt@BOS]

NEON wired to the tach lead!!!! :unibrow:

Sieg, that is not nearly elaborate enough for Mustang guys. They (does that include me?) go big or go home when it comes to this kind of stuff.

http://forums.themustangsource.com/f800/new-2010-mustang-engine-dress-up-parts-american-car-craft-511583/

[DOOM]

Looks good Matt! I vote for a LS ENGINE!!! Do it! I dare you!! You know I would do it.. :D :unibrow: :D

Matt pay NO attention to this man!!! He is very confused!!:willy:

[Cris@JCG]

Wait till you see the Miata that I just did a LS conversion on!! :unibrow: :D :unibrow:

Really Cris, you would do something like that???

Matt pay NO attention to this man!!! He is very confused!!:willy:

[FETorino]

Matt pay NO attention to this man!!! He is very confused!!:willy:

Yea Matt some people have no boundaries.:rolleyes: He's just lucky that type of activity is legal in this state. It shouldn't be :rofl:

[Swain]

Looks good Matt. Props to trying things on your own. :thumbsup:

[fleetus macmullitz]

Great project Matt. :cool:

Lookin' forward to seeing Coyote(not)Ugly under that modded hood and hearing some EXCEPTIONAL sounds from a late model motor. :P

[chetly]

[QUOTE=Matt.A;419833]As for the rear, maybe Maier Racing? It might sound stupid, but when I pick parts for a car, I want parts that fit the rest of the level of the car I'm trying to build. In this case, I need something that works well, but also looks cool. I don't really care if the suspension looks really cool when I'm driving it, but I do if I'm trying to sell it eventually.QUOTE]


There is a reason that Mike shows up to every auto-x with his suspension on his car and wins... The guy is a 5 time national auto-x champion and a suspension genius. The only thing Maier Racing is lacking is the funding to pay for a really good marketing person to get the word out on how good his stuff works.

[Matt@BOS]

Skip, I like that phrase, Coyote (not) Ugly. Might have to use that in the future.

Chetly, there is no doubt that Mike's car and suspension turns in some impressive times. He is one he'll of a driver, which is not to say that I'm discounting the ability of his products. I've got his rear suspension in boxes all stacked up next to the DSE front clip. I've got faith in the fact that this little car should be quick when sorted out, even with me driving ;) .

Matt

[Flash68]

I've got his rear suspension in boxes all stacked up next to the DSE front clip.

That is a damn tasty combo. Well done. :unibrow:

I even told Rob this makes me fancy a Mustang. Oh the horror.

[Matt@BOS]

That is a damn tasty combo. Well done. :unibrow:

I even told Rob this makes me fancy a Mustang. Oh the horror.

You've been subjected to subliminal conditioning ever since you picked up BMF. It isn't a big stretch to believe you would start liking Mustangs one day.

[FETorino]

You've been subjected to subliminal conditioning ever since you picked up BMF. It isn't a big stretch to believe you would start liking Mustangs one day.

Those Mustangs are the gateway drug, next thing you'll be building a Torino.:unibrow:

[fleetus macmullitz]

Those Mustangs are the gateway drug, next thing you'll be building a Torino.:unibrow:

Then a Falcon...

(Or a Falcon Ranchero pool table.)

http://i87.photobucket.com/albums/k156/wnyjazz/Counting-1.jpg

[chetly]

Skip, I like that phrase, Coyote (not) Ugly. Might have to use that in the future.

Chetly, there is no doubt that Mike's car and suspension turns in some impressive times. He is one he'll of a driver, which is not to say that I'm discounting the ability of his products. I've got his rear suspension in boxes all stacked up next to the DSE front clip. I've got faith in the fact that this little car should be quick when sorted out, even with me driving ;) .

Matt

Good to hear, He's constantly trying new things and evolving his stuff. I cant tell you how many rockers we went through on that rear suspension before he got it where it felt good. You'll like it, Im sure. I know Vaugn Gitten does. More people need to run his stuff.

[Flash68]

So how about an FE in this thing? :unibrow:

(been hanging around the Robster too much lately)

[Matt@BOS]

So how about an FE in this thing? :unibrow:

(been hanging around the Robster too much lately)

I could, but I'm looking for something that will make as much power as my 454 LS7. :_paranoid

I've been looking at some Ford pushrod crate motors because of their compact size, allowing me to tuck and set the engine back, but by the time I get through pricing out fuel injection, aluminum blocks, and 600-650hp capability they seem to get expensive. It also sounds stupid, but I'd like to get decent gas mileage out of it when cruising around town. I keep coming back to the Coyote mod motor with a magna charger because it is probably the only new blower that will fit under the hood. That setup probably weighs 25lbs more than a blown LS. With a big tire up front I'm not too worried about weight distribution. My 3800lb gt500 handles pretty well with 57 percent weight up front.

If any Ford guys have recommendations, please chime in! Links would be even better. I don't know much about Windsors or Clevors or FEs, etc.

Matt

[fleetus macmullitz]

I would go Coyote too.

Here's a little FE history as far as them in the '65 cars, built for the F/X class aka 'Factory experimental'.

Ford had 11 (IIRC) 427 SOHC '65 Mustangs built by Holman-Moody.
Here's a famous one.

It took a long time for it to happen, but for the guys that want to spend some serious $$$ they can get a new 427+cid Cammer with blocks and heads from more than just one source now. :cool:

http://i87.photobucket.com/albums/k156/wnyjazz/CH1008-72920_2.jpg

m-Q8PBknCDc&feature

_Fi6Lx604Ns&feature

Il0gIgevtms

[Rybar]

How did I miss this thread? This car is looking awesome Matt, love all the mods and direction your going with whatever powerplant you choose. :thumbsup:

[fleetus macmullitz]

oDeaJe4Hb6Q

Matt,

I haven't looked into what's going on with the mods to a Ford SOHC Raptor 6.2L motor like in the vid, but I would if I do a '65-'68 Stang.

I like more cubes and keeping it n/a.

If you want to do something different under the hood as well, a stepped on 6.2L would qualify IMO. :D

[preston]

Holy cow you have an english wheel but not a shrinker ?
They're only $100-200. Slitting and bending that hood scoop ugh, the standard little Eastwood shrinker would have curved that thing up nicely.
I might have already asked this on a thread on the other site so maybe you are the same guy but what english wheel do you have ?

Not a huge fan of the cantilevered rear shock setup. You are not gaining anything in terms of motion ratio as you already have > 1:1 with the normal live axle mounting scheme. I guess theoretically you could alter the motion ratio curve but I don't see much advantage to that, meanwhile you've increased unsprung weight a tad, added complexity and new failure/maintenance points, and you have noise action in the back of your cockpit with access to the outside. It does look super trick though. Not a put down on Maier at all, just saying I don't think that particular system makes a ton of sense.

if you don't want to do a Windsor I say go Coyote. These thing seem to be making more power every day and take to FI really well. I don't see any way in heck it will be cheaper than a Windsor though. A lot more work to get it fitted as well depending on how your front end ends up after the DSE stuff.
Please don't go LS even though its a logical choice and I've been tempted as well (the huge advantage of either of those motors is at the desired power level they will be much smoother and OEM than a Windsor, although not everyone with a hot rod wants "smooth")

[Matt@BOS]

Preston, we have a shrinker at the shop, but it is only a little one. It works fine for most shrinking and stretching of sheet metal for patch panels, etc. I practiced with a piece of 20ga to get the hang of things and it worked ok. However, I elected to work with 18ga because I figured it wouldn't pe as prone to warping when I welded it all together.

Skip, you've got me looking in another direction now. Initial findings say I would be stuck with and iron block. Hmm...

Now I'm waiting to see what Rob has to say...

[ironworks]

The thing I always think about on these engine swap Ford projects are "ARE YOU REALLY SELLING YOUR SELF SHORT NOT JUST USING THE LS ENGINE"?

They do everything better and there lighter and smaller and cheaper. So your will to pay more money and probably put in more effort just to keep the badge on the grille matching the VIN on the engine. You know if Ford would put some engineering time in like Chevrolet did it would be a no brainer.

The only down fall of an LS engine in a Ford is that it is a crossbred. But for a performance car is that bad. No one will care whats under the hood when you smoke their ass at a stop light.

Just Saying......

[Ripped]

Awesome build thread.

I really like the body mods. Nicely done.

My choice of engines, would be either the 460 block, which is pretty easy to make up to 1000hp fairly economically.

Or more likely leaning towards the Coyote 5.0

And here's a Coyote suggestion for you; 7.02 -1/4

oHwcR8sgwf4

Love the sound of that...

[Vegas69]

Put a Ford engine in it if you want any resale at all. I'm not a fan of the transgender personally.

[GregWeld]

My .02 is -- it's way cheaper to stick a LS motor in it....


It's way cooler to have a Ford in a Ford.... but it's a big azz waste of funds that could be spent on other areas of the car.


There's a LS motored Ford that was built out of a shop at the Sonoma Raceway.... and I don't care what you do -- or say -- ya can't catch the guy!
The only comments I heard all weekend was WOW!

Ping Charley -- he'll know the shop --- I'm too stupid to remember it.

[Vegas69]

Is a small block Ford with EZ EFI or similar really the end of the world? I happen to know one of the best small block Ford builders around.:unibrow: I'd go with the one at the bottom of this page just to send Starsky and Cole home with their tail between their legs. http://pettisperformance.com/?page_id=5

[GregWeld]

FOUND THE LINK


THIS CAR IS BAD AZZZZZZZ.........



http://www.cortexracing.com/projects/66-mustang-project-xecution/

[Matt@BOS]

Put a Ford engine in it if you want any resale at all. I'm not a fan of the transgender personally.

That is the main reason I want to put a Ford motor in it.

And to all you LS engine guys, yes, they are good engines, but I'm not just going to drop in an LS because I can. Im not sure i will gain that much, as opposed to a Ford motor. To build one up to the power I want also means it will either sound lumpy and idle at 1000rpm or have a blower on it, which will negate any weight savings. the more power you want, the more trade offs you have to make. I would do an n/a Boss 302 mod motor, but I don't want a torque less screamer that needs 4.56 gears. I will admit LS engines dominate their naturally aspirated Ford rivals, but the mod motors respond well to boost and can retain stock driveability. The other thing I have learned is that the closer I can get to oem, the less reliability issues I will likely have, hence I am leaning towards purchasing as much as I can from Ford Racing.

Who knows, next week I might just change my mind and decide I want to build a Ford equivalent of Badmotorfinger. I would, of course have Chevy stripes on it. :lol:

[GregWeld]

If you want a fantastic "new" Mustang --- take a look at Jack Maurer's new build... It already has a Ford motor - it goes like stink - looks fantastic - is full of carbon fiber parts (painted) has big fat tires (slicks) - has passenger seat - and it's CHEAP and for sale....

Charley knows how to get in touch with him. If I didn't already have enough cars - I'd buy it in half a second.

Buy a cheap dedicated "race car" and leave the GT 500 be your grocery store car.

[Matt@BOS]

Is a small block Ford with EZ EFI or similar really the end of the world? I happen to know one of the best small block Ford builders around.:unibrow: I'd go with the one at the bottom of this page just to send Starsky and Cole home with their tail between their legs. http://pettisperformance.com/?page_id=5

Argg, you aren't helping me. In fact you're all helping to turn me into the next Ron Myers. That engine is badass. Those red and blue fittings just send it over the top in being the right amount of wrong for me. So much for oem driveability in Socal traffic. Perhaps a chat with Pettis will be in order...

Greg that car is crazy fast from what I have heard from others. I won't be as fast as him, so I think I should focus on looking better when the hood is up. :lol:

[Vegas69]

I'm with you Matt in regards to factory parts and reliability. I'd focus more on weight reduction and less on high hp. It all comes down to power to weight ratio regardless. I know we talked briefly but what is the real focus for this car?

I was definitely kidding about that rowdy engine but he could build you a very reliable pump gas stroker.

[Matt@BOS]

If you want a fantastic "new" Mustang --- take a look at Jack Maurer's new build... It already has a Ford motor - it goes like stink - looks fantastic - is full of carbon fiber parts (painted) has big fat tires (slicks) - has passenger seat - and it's CHEAP and for sale....

Charley knows how to get in touch with him. If I didn't already have enough cars - I'd buy it in half a second.

Buy a cheap dedicated "race car" and leave the GT 500 be your grocery store car.

I just missed him at cars and coffee in Irvine a couple weeks ago, I think. He just finished a '69 Camaro, no? I heard that was also a nice car.

I don't quite want new car feel throughout, or fast new race car. To answer Todd's question, as cliched as it has become around here, I want something more Stielow-esque in terms of drivability. And before anyone says it, yes if that is what I'm after, an LS and plenty of driving lessons are probably the solution, but I did say, "similar," not the same.

[GregWeld]

I just missed him at cars and coffee in Irvine a couple weeks ago, I think. He just finished a '69 Camaro, no? I heard that was also a nice car. YES HE DID

I don't quite want new car feel throughout, or fast new race car. To answer Todd's question, as cliched as it has become around here, I want something more Stielow-esque in terms of drivability. I totally get that


It said my message was too short so added this so you could see what I really said... :lol:

[Cris@JCG]

You know which engine I would pick..

Hope you wake up early tomorrow morning.. We are Auto-Xing! This time we have a Mustang vs Mustang on the time clock!:D :unibrow: :D

[GregWeld]

THIS is what you need --- just call Gary Patterson at Shelby and order it up - tell him I sent you... 'cause I told him you're a baller and carry big cash!


http://i919.photobucket.com/albums/ad33/gregweld/Shelby%20mini%20nats/file.jpg




This is Jack Mauer's "new" Mustang.... It's a fantastic car!




http://i919.photobucket.com/albums/ad33/gregweld/Shelby%20mini%20nats/file-1.jpg

[camcojb]

It said my message was too short so added this so you could see what I really said... :lol:
it said it was too short because you put your comments INSIDE the quotes; to the software you didn't post anything. ;)

[ccracin]

Matt, I cant believe I missed this thread! Awesome work, I'm glad to see another "NON-PRO" dive into metal work like this. Keep up the great work. :thumbsup:

[GregWeld]

I have access to a bunch of tools, and really wish I knew how to use them.:unibrow:
Matt



Now you finally understand my signature line......

[Vegas69]

Then I have to agree with you ideals on a modern Ford engine and a reasonable supercharger if you want big hp in a Stielow fashion with a Ford symbol. http://www.evoperform.com/shop/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=267_334_355&products_id=1080

I can see why these guys are saying LS as you can make the same power for a hell of a lot less. What does a pull out mod motor bring?

[fleetus macmullitz]

Matt,

As you know the nice thing about the Coyote swap in the early Mustangs is that it's becoming fairly common.

Yes the 6.2L SOHC Ford has an iron block, but it should be a very torquey motor. Not sure how the dimensions compare.

With more cam and breathed on heads and intake, might give you the power you need while still keeping a lot of factory parts. I would think the price is likely to be a lot better than a Coyote, but I haven't checked.

Always can bore and stroke it as well. Nice not to have mess with a blower.

I've read that a lot of unlocked potential was left on the table with that motor.

It would be different too.

[GregWeld]

I have to tell ya Matt..... I just today somehow stumbled into this thread. I went back to page one and read all of it and double checked all the pics etc.

Somehow I thought you were building the GT500... so just wasn't interested in looking to see what was really going on.

Personally - I'm very proud of you! It takes real guts to cut up a perfectly good car, take on the challenges, and see it through. It's not easy. It is fun.

I like what you've done. :thumbsup: :lateral: :cheers:

[Ron in SoCal]

Is a small block Ford with EZ EFI or similar really the end of the world? I happen to know one of the best small block Ford builders around.:unibrow: I'd go with the one at the bottom of this page just to send Starsky and Cole home with their tail between their legs. http://pettisperformance.com/?page_id=5

Argg, you aren't helping me. In fact you're all helping to turn me into the next Ron Myers. That engine is badass. Those red and blue fittings just send it over the top in being the right amount of wrong for me. So much for oem driveability in Socal traffic. Perhaps a chat with Pettis will be in order...

Greg that car is crazy fast from what I have heard from others. I won't be as fast as him, so I think I should focus on looking better when the hood is up. :lol:

I actually like that motor. Screw SoCal traffic ..:D

[Vince@Meanstreets]

We stopped by BOS to pick up the Mopar and to see your mustang in person finally. Well, I did see the before stage when Mark owned it.

I must say, I don't know what you do for a living but you have a skill to fall back to if the current one gets boring. :thumbsup: Very nice work.

[Flash68]

Who knows, next week I might just change my mind and decide I want to build a Ford equivalent of Badmotorfinger. I would, of course have Chevy stripes on it. :lol:

That's the best idea you've had all year.

Those red and blue fittings just send it over the top in being the right amount of wrong for me.

Yes! :woot:

I want something more Stielow-esque in terms of drivability. And before anyone says it, yes if that is what I'm after, an LS and plenty of driving lessons are probably the solution, but I did say, "similar," not the same.

Then I have to agree with you ideals on a modern Ford engine and a reasonable supercharger if you want big hp in a Stielow fashion with a Ford symbol.

Totally agree and this sounds like exactly what you want and will get you the best of everything you're seeking, budget notwithstanding. :D

Coyote + blower = :thumbsup:

Of course the problem with that is it sounds boring to Rob. :lol:

[Matt@BOS]

You know which engine I would pick..

Hope you wake up early tomorrow morning.. We are Auto-Xing! This time we have a Mustang vs Mustang on the time clock!:D :unibrow: :D

...No. :lol:

won't make it. Way too early. Thanks for the invite. Can't act like an old person all the time though. I realized I can't act young when I'm old. It just doesn't work as well. Have fun autocrossing. I should have my Chevy back to lay the beat down on the Mustangs soon though, like two weeks...

[fleetus macmullitz]

THIS is what you need --- just call Gary Patterson at Shelby and order it up - tell him I sent you... 'cause I told him you're a baller and carry big cash!


http://i919.photobucket.com/albums/ad33/gregweld/Shelby%20mini%20nats/file.jpg



I like your style Greg. :D

And mucho cash it would be for those Arias/Shelby Hemi SBF heads. :cool:

[Matt@BOS]

Then I have to agree with you ideals on a modern Ford engine and a reasonable supercharger if you want big hp in a Stielow fashion with a Ford symbol. http://www.evoperform.com/shop/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=267_334_355&products_id=1080

I can see why these guys are saying LS as you can make the same power for a hell of a lot less. What does a pull out mod motor bring?

Maybe it is just me, and my terrible luck with LS stuff in the past, but it seems like big HP LS engines with relatively linear and smooth torque curves don't run much less than the Ford motors with blowers. I think once you want over 600, youre going to be to have to break open the piggy bank with LS stuff. Over 600 usually means forced induction or an LS7. My 454 LS7 should make 700 all day long, but it wasn't cheap to get there. Gregg warned me about what he called the "ls7 tax" and now I understand where he is coming from, and mine is only a hybrid LS7.

Coyote motors seem to run around 5-6k used and 6-7.5k for a new one depending on the various models. Superchargers run about 7k but usually that price includes everything you need.

Personally I'm starting to like the look of this combo.
http://www.jegs.com/i/Ford+Racing/397/M-6007-A50SC/10002/-1
http://www.jegs.com/i/Edelbrock/350/15880/10002/-1

the Edelbrock unit has the longest intake runners, and supposedly makes the most low end torque of the bunch.

[Matt@BOS]

I have to tell ya Matt..... I just today somehow stumbled into this thread. I went back to page one and read all of it and double checked all the pics etc.

Somehow I thought you were building the GT500... so just wasn't interested in looking to see what was really going on.

Personally - I'm very proud of you! It takes real guts to cut up a perfectly good car, take on the challenges, and see it through. It's not easy. It is fun.

I like what you've done. :thumbsup: :lateral: :cheers:

Thanks Greg! I definitely know what that line in your signature means now. What you didn't see from the pictures is how many times I had to fix things and do little stuff over, or try and figure out how to approach a situation. I'm sure you probably already knew that without me saying anything. I have to say, it is more rewarding by the day as i get more of a feel for what is going on. Somedays I just have to walk away, but that happens less often now. It definitely is a lot of fun. I'm starting to think I might have to build more stuff in the future that I can flip and sell at a loss, or ideally for the cost of the parts plus a little more money. :D

Vince, glad you made it down to BOS to pick up the Satelite. didn't realize that was you that was going to be getting the car. It has been sitting forever, and I've been hoping someone would be able to turn it into something cool one day.

[Flash68]

Some nice engine stuff @ Roush Yates for Black Friday.... :unibrow:

http://www.roushyatesparts.com/roush-yates-black-friday-special-s/856.htm

[67zo6Camaro]

Some nice engine stuff @ Roush Yates for Black Friday.... :unibrow:

http://www.roushyatesparts.com/roush-yates-black-friday-special-s/856.htm

trouble maker.... spend your own money :lol:

[FETorino]

Give this guy a call and get yourself a stroked windsor with AFR heads and beat the hell out of it.:D

http://www.fordstrokers.com/dart-based-windsor-liberator-shortblocks-/

[Matt@BOS]

Dave, you can keep trying to spend my money, but I doubt you'll get very far, with my credit card right now. The Camaro just went up on a trailer back to RPM for engine tuning. It's great news because it means I'll be able to drive it next week. It is not so great news for buying a Ford motor right now. I just got hit with the bill for pistons, and assembly, and will be hit for dyno tuning and some help from the mechanic at BOS to help get everything together.

Now, about these Ford Windsors, damn, they're expensive if you want to go all aluminum...

Matt

[GregWeld]

Now, about these Ford Windsors, damn, they're expensive if you want to go all aluminum...

Matt




Quit you're whinin' ---- You don't hear Charley and I whinin' do ya?

[Vegas69]

Quit you're whinin' ---- You don't hear Charley and I whinin' do ya?

Your rope is to short to make time....:lol:

[Vegas69]

Give this guy a call and get yourself a stroked windsor with AFR heads and beat the hell out of it.:D

http://www.fordstrokers.com/dart-based-windsor-liberator-shortblocks-/

The walmart of engine builders. Run....:D

[FETorino]

The walmart of engine builders. Run....:D

Not Wallmart

Just a short rambling about us here. My name is Jim I own and run fordstrokers almost single handedly. I opened fordstrokers after opening my small block ford tech forum. I figured I could not only sell parts at competitive pricing but one thing I could do better than any other mail order-internet parts house was provide superior customer service and the needed tech help.
*Try calling one of the major parts houses and ask them a specific 347 stroker question Good luck with that. Ya they ship your products for free, yes they have massive amounts of buying power when it comes to pricing, BUT they don't have the experience or technical know how to help you! That's where I thought I could gain your business. Friendly, knowledgable tech help along with fair pricing. That's my motto and I stick to it.

I encourage you to buy parts from me, but don't stop there. Please come over to my forum and feel free to discuss your build, ask questions, add your comments and have a good time while we all play in this hobby! Thanks for listening to my rambling and feel free to use the live support button on the far left side of every page. The person that will answer your call is ME.
We are located 30 miles west of downtown chicago
311 Village Drive
Carol Stream IL. 60188

Jim W

[Matt@BOS]

The walmart of engine builders. Run....:D

Already found the Walmart of engine builders, and they build LS engines.

Greg, I thought that whining about Ford motors and their prices was just something everyone did. It is also my understanding Chevy engines are generally so cheap in comparison you can't complain about them until they break. Well, I guess I broke code on that last part.

[GregWeld]

Well, I guess I broke code on that last part.



Sad but true I guess!! :lol:


:cheers:

[57hemicuda]

I've got a home built Walmart (LS) engine in my Mustang now. I grenaded 2 of them before I figured the oiling issues out. At last count I know of at least 10 of them that went south for the same reason, and thats just in our little community. When you lean on stuff that hard under those types of Lateral G's(no pun intended) you better be sure you've thought of everything.

Luckily I didn't have alot wrapped up in either engine I lost, my question would be, what are you really going to use it for? If its more of a show, with an occasional track day car, go with the super cool, super expensive Shelby Hemi, it surely will command way more attention. If its more of a track/ beat the living crap out it car, I'd stick with a basic SMF, or an LS. I just can't imagine that Shelby engine timing out early, it would be enough to make you put a gun in your mouth.LOL

[WSSix]

That's not bad advise. Build it so you can afford to break it.

[Ripped]

+1 definitely good advise, on deciding what you want to do with the engine, and car.

If you are even "thinking" that you want to possibly race the car, once in a while, then take the time to add the right componenents to your engine.

it might not be your builder, either. It might ber what you tell them.

"No I don't plan on racing the car." that's what I told my builder

-sigh-

sad part was even then, I knew that I might take it for a run down the drag strip to 'just see what it does'

be honest, no matter who you get to build it

[Royalworks]

Of all the engines i have blow up i found out that over building them is always the best way to go. Sure, stock engines can take more power but with the sacrfice of reliabilty. The factory detunes cars for a reason.

[Matt@BOS]

I've got a home built Walmart (LS) engine in my Mustang now. I grenaded 2 of them before I figured the oiling issues out. At last count I know of at least 10 of them that went south for the same reason, and thats just in our little community. When you lean on stuff that hard under those types of Lateral G's(no pun intended) you better be sure you've thought of everything.

Luckily I didn't have alot wrapped up in either engine I lost, my question would be, what are you really going to use it for? If its more of a show, with an occasional track day car, go with the super cool, super expensive Shelby Hemi, it surely will command way more attention. If its more of a track/ beat the living crap out it car, I'd stick with a basic SMF, or an LS. I just can't imagine that Shelby engine timing out early, it would be enough to make you put a gun in your mouth.LOL

I do plan to drive the car hard, and my goal with this Mustang is to take what I learned from building my Camaro with BOS and build a more capable, and reliable car that is easier to drive on the street and track, but also brings something new and different to the occasional car show. I like things purposeful, and I have tried to blend design and function as seamlessly as I can.

That Shelby engine is insane, but doesn't really fit into my budget. I could buy it, but it would kill my monthly car budget, and I don't want to do that, nor does that engine really seam like a good match for this little car.

I talked to Bret from Ridetech yesterday, and to build a 427 Clevor with injection and an aluminum block, I would be able to build a couple LS engines.

So, right now I'm thinking a regular old Windsor with aluminum heads and a dry sump, or that Coyote crate that is built for boost, and topped with a blower. Both would probably weigh about the same.

Still open to ideas, preferably those in the 12-16k range. :lol:

Matt

[FETorino]

Just drive down the street to Todd's guy.:unibrow: Todd isn't this your guy building SBFs?

http://pettisperformance.com/?page_id=5


He obviously build lots of Windsor based motors that make way more hp and stay together.

AL headed 408 with dry sump will take a beating for years and not come apart.

[Vegas69]

Yep, and it's the Outlaw 10.5 record holder. I believe at 6.67 and 217 mph. I just emailed Jason this week to introduce him to Chris Robinson and the new owner of my car and he said they are now running 6.30's in the 226-229 mph range with the new Hemi. He like's small block Fords.

Your right, he has a reputation for big power AND reliability.

Edit: It's now 6.50 at 218. http://www.pscaracing.com/records.html A record must be backed up within 1% the following run.
YgH0dMrYcnw

RNStZm5HsXA

[57hemicuda]

Still open to ideas, preferably those in the 12-16k range. :lol:

Matt

That is the thing, with some used parts you can build a 700hp LS for about 1/2 that if you aren't afraid to assemble it yourself. The Clevor Fords are pretty cool also, I think you could peice together something relatively cheap. Of course the dry sump stuff does add to the cost a good bit.

[GregWeld]

If it was me -- I'd buy the crate motor and stick a blower on it... lots of low end grunt - would look "appropriate" and be affordable.


If I went the Petitis or Tony Oddo route -- I'd end up with a beast.... 'cause that's the way those things go...


An LS motor is what makes SENSE --- but only dollars and cents....

[Matt@BOS]

That is the thing, with some used parts you can build a 700hp LS for about 1/2 that if you aren't afraid to assemble it yourself. The Clevor Fords are pretty cool also, I think you could peice together something relatively cheap. Of course the dry sump stuff does add to the cost a good bit.

That's the thing, I don't trust myself enough to build a bullet proof engine. I know I could put together a 650+ hp LS2 out of the parts I have lying around and about 6k, and I wouldn't hesitate to do if I was building strictly a driver/fun weekend warrior, but after all the sheet metal work, and the level of fit and finish it is going to get from the BOS paint shop, I just can't help but feel a little bad about putting an LS in it. I almost feel like the car deserves better. :lol: I'm going to have to wait and see how my wallet feels in a couple months...

[Vegas69]

If it was me -- I'd buy the crate motor and stick a blower on it... lots of low end grunt - would look "appropriate" and be affordable.


If I went the Petitis or Tony Oddo route -- I'd end up with a beast.... 'cause that's the way those things go...


An LS motor is what makes SENSE --- but only dollars and cents....

I agree with the crate and blower ideal. That's how I peg Matt as well. I will say that Jason listens and will build what he feels best suits you. He nailed me...

[Matt@BOS]

I agree with the crate and blower ideal. That's how I peg Matt as well. I will say that Jason listens and will build what he feels best suits you. He nailed me...

Last year I would have bought a crate motor and a blower without hesitation. Now I'm not so sure. Depending on how tame the LS in the Camaro turns out, I might decide to go old school in the Mustang. I really just don't want two cars that have a similar feel. I guess if they both drove really similarly I could just sell one, and build something else.

[Flash68]

I also would normally see you "making sense" with a crate + blower deal. But I like this metamorphosis I seem to be witnessing.... :cool:

Liz Miles' streetfigher couple Stang had a nice Windsor 427 in it I recall and wasn't too over the top.

I actually like the idea of an LS in the Mustang. I think if I had a Mustang that wasn't a Camaro you could tempt me to do an LS in that. Otherwise no way Jose.

I still like Roush Yates for you. Just do what Maier did and put a Nationwide 358 in it and be done. You know you want to. Just a little. :woot:

[Vegas69]

I remember talking to Mike at the taco party this year. He has to heat the oil to a certain temperature, then turn it over to get oil pressure, then warm it up to a certain temperature, etc... It would take you and hour to leave the garage. F that...

[Flash68]

I remember talking to Mike at the taco party this year. He has to heat the oil to a certain temperature, then turn it over to get oil pressure, then warm it up to a certain temperature, etc... It would take you and hour to leave the garage. F that...

Not exactly accurate. I talked to him for quite awhile (sober, mind you :lol:) at Goodguys 2 weeks ago about his whole system. It ain't as bad as you make it out to be. But it ain't no stock LS1 either.

Priming the pump is recommended by most (except Rob's dry sump guru) after prolonged sitting. But there are "adapters" out there to make that pretty easy.

Yeah Mike was hilarious describing his setup when I talked to him. I asked him how many stages his pump was.. he said "I have no idea". LOL. He said the whole system (motor, trans, dry sump system) has been in the car since last year and has run without a hitch since then. Some road course action, many autocrosses, and commuted to work (about 50 miles or so roundtrip) at least 10 times he said. Hey, who said that stuff can't be reliable? :unibrow:

Well, Matt?

[intocarss]

More of Sikora with Pettis power

Nov 14-18, 2012 , Las Vegas Motor Speedway, The Strip. Outlaw 10.5 racing. # 1 Qualifier & Low ET Doug Sikora
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qMsslw2NmWE&feature=youtu.be&hd=1

Don't forget my boy Artis Houston,,, Pettis "nailed him" too

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_Sj09-Om3nk

Sorry, any reason to post Drag racen vids :unibrow:

[preston]

I run a dry sump 427 Windsor TT in my '67 Mustang and I don't really do anything special other than cranking it with the ignition off for 5-10 seconds if I haven't started it in a while. I run the oil through a liquid based cooler tapped into the hot water feed and it warms up pretty quick even with a trunk mounted tank (note that it still also cools the oil, when I disconnected it at the track one day the oil ran 15 degrees hotter).

If you have any pretensions of building something special and think you will be tracking it, for me at least, the biggest drag on a Windsor is if you want an aluminum block. That's an immediate 2.5k+ option over a quality Dart iron block and a 4k+ option over an OEM LS block.

I've actually contemplated swapping to an LS because I really desire a very streetable engine and by the time you put any kind of cam in a Windsor I just dont' think it will ever be as tame (or as OEM) as a 550hp LS based stroker.

Here is what I think you should do (and what I can't do because it won't fit my chassis) -

Aluminator 5.0 with factory computer, and the new Hellion twin turbo kit that was on MM &FF cover last week. Top mounted blowers are just heat pumps in any kind of track work.

Twin turbo coyote - 7k rpm, 400rwhp right from the get go before you tune it or boost it, modern OEM factory based tune and runability, show car impact under the hood, aluminum block.

$7k engine, $2k computer, $2k FEAD and ancillaries, $7k turbo system

500->700 to the wheels at the twist of a knob and would drive like a factory 2012 Mustang around town.

The only negative is dry sumping would be a big hurdle as no "kits" exist right now, but you could piece something together with the Avaid serpentine belt A/C mounted pump.

[57hemicuda]

I think I agree with Preston, the LS is the best dollar for dollar racing/street engine that money can buy right now. That said, with the car getting BOS body and paint etc. you are probably right about the car needing better.

Look at my car at Optima, the design judges pretty much snubbed it, taking 31st in design with alot of less modified cars doing way better. I know the lack of interior hurt me, but I think it was the Chevy in a Ford that turned them off. Hell it would probably turn me off if I was a judge. You would probably be best to stay with some brand loyalty, it will help you in the end in my opinion.

[preston]

http://hellionpowersystems.com/images/stories/12twingallery/vsig_images/2012%20TT%20014_590_442_90.jpg

[GregWeld]

I really like the direction you're going Matt.... This build is perfectly suited to the peanut AutoX at GoodGuys shows you're so fond of running.... AND even better in L.A. traffic. Glad you finally made the right decision!!:unibrow:






http://i919.photobucket.com/albums/ad33/gregweld/Fun%20Fotos/file-1.jpg

[DOOM]

I think I agree with Preston, the LS is the best dollar for dollar racing/street engine that money can buy right now. That said, with the car getting BOS body and paint etc. you are probably right about the car needing better.

Look at my car at Optima, the design judges pretty much snubbed it, taking 31st in design with alot of less modified cars doing way better. I know the lack of interior hurt me, but I think it was the Chevy in a Ford that turned them off. Hell it would probably turn me off if I was a judge. You would probably be best to stay with some brand loyalty, it will help you in the end in my opinion.

Well said I couldn't agree more!

[Vegas69]

I think I agree with Preston, the LS is the best dollar for dollar racing/street engine that money can buy right now. That said, with the car getting BOS body and paint etc. you are probably right about the car needing better.

Look at my car at Optima, the design judges pretty much snubbed it, taking 31st in design with alot of less modified cars doing way better. I know the lack of interior hurt me, but I think it was the Chevy in a Ford that turned them off. Hell it would probably turn me off if I was a judge. You would probably be best to stay with some brand loyalty, it will help you in the end in my opinion.

Yep, that's why I mentioned resale way back in the thread. For a brawler, it doesn't matter that much. In this instance, he doesn't have much choice.

[Matt@BOS]

I really like the direction you're going Matt.... This build is perfectly suited to the peanut AutoX at GoodGuys shows you're so fond of running.... AND even better in L.A. traffic. Glad you finally made the right decision!!:unibrow:






http://i919.photobucket.com/albums/ad33/gregweld/Fun%20Fotos/file-1.jpg

Can I just put the whole thing under the hood? I might need some of your tools to pull of that swap.

Preston, I've seen some really impressive power figures coming out of twin turbo setups. I haven't ruled turbos out, but my lack of knowledge has kept me from actively pursuing that option. I know there are plenty of new oem cars running around with turbos, and I suppose have been for 30 years now, but I'm sort of clueless about them. I know the Mule has a pair, and I've ridden in Josh's twin turbo DC Camaro, but I've always wondered if they were simplistic and trouble free enough for me to run on a car without excessive amounts of tinkering and tuning.. Would I be able to run them and have a really linear power band for autocross so that I wouldn't have to downshift in short sections between corners?

Matt

[preston]

Turbos, especially twins, on V8 engines do not have laggy power bands unless they are setup for huge power. If you keep the boost low as you would on an autox you should barely even notice a transition to on-boost especially with these modern turbos. I actually think setting up the piping is easier than managing a front drive belt system, and you can turn the power up and down electronically instead of being stuck with the current boost of the heat pump.
I run a local go kart track in m "big" car (its like lap after lap of autoxing) and the turbo power plant is completely controllable (in a manner of speaking).

[fleetus macmullitz]

I'm going to have to wait and see how my wallet feels in a couple months...

That time frame won't work for us. We're ready to buy now.

[ironworks]

Thanks for the help yesterday Matt.

I was looking to voting in your online poll late last night when I got home from the show. I think with your larger then life almost Renner persona your beginning to take on, you need to put your whole life up for POLL on Lat-g.

I really think Renner did not allow this site to control his life enough and hence his fall from super stardom. Your door gaps are better, your skin is darker and I bet you have more hair. Plus that Bif the surfer dude look he has is not working these days like it used to.

Just sayin