Thoughts on the FAST Ez-EFI system??

[GregWeld]

I have TWO cars with 8 stack EFI.... a pretty nasty little 406 in a heavy '56 Nomad / 700r4 / 2600 rpm stall converter / 3:73 Ford 9".... and a 383 / 5 speed / '32 Ford Roadster...

The 406 uses the Inglese intake manifold with Imagine Injection billet air valves... the 383 uses the all Inglese manifold with their air valves. BOTH cars use FAST EZ EFI and both cars run flawlessly... fire off instantly... cold drivability is "fire it - drop it in gear and drive off".

Given your location - and your statement that there isn't much available or around... provided that your motor is "built" to be EFI friendly (a wide LSA cam - providing good solid vacuum signal) I'd think the EZ EFI would be the right system... simply because it self tunes.

We can argue about how perfect the A/F's are all day long... but I'm LIVING PROOF that if you balance the air valves (using a meter) and you set the basic settings of the EZ EFI correctly (in other words - you actually have to READ and FOLLOW the instructions)... You'll be able to fire it up -- warm it up - drop it in gear and go drive - within 30 minutes - your car will be running great - and the next time you drive it - it will drive better and so on - until the A/F's meet the settings you selected. There are only 3 A/F settings -- Idle - cruise - WOT. There is acceleration fueling that can be changed... but most wouldn't really need that and you'd need a dyno to really see what your changes are doing.

So with the EZ EFI -- it's ONLY going to control fueling. The timing of the engine is standard same as a carb -- in other words -- just a good distributor, curved and set for initial and total timing properly. Frankly TIMING controls the performance of an engine way more so than the "perfect" A/F ratio.

BTW -- I don't sell this stuff - I have no vested interest in any of it - tuning or products. I'm just a long time EFI user that has real world actual use "opinions".

Caveat -- EZ EFI is not for radical cams etc. So do your homework/research on what is a good engine combo for EFI before choosing your ECU. If you need to run radical profiles -- then you're going to need a tunable system -- and a real good tuner and lots of dyno time.

[ks71z28]

good info Mark. My IR setup was perfectly happy being lean at cruise but really liked a richer idle a/f, no matter how I adjusted the blades. Had a big solid roller too which affected that.

How does an average guy monitor each cylinder individually to take advantage of this feature? I can see that on an engine dyno with headers that have pyro's or a/f bungs at each pipe. I'm thinking most of the guys never get their engines on an engine dyno and do their tuning on a chassis dyno or on the street and wouldn't have that type of exhaust to be able to individually monitor a cylinder. Would an infrared temp gun on the tubes give enough info? I do remember that feature and played with it a little, but I didn't have a real good way to monitor things other than a temp gun. This was a blown small block, not an IR setup but we were chasing a problem.

The Holley Dominator system has individual fuel trim, you will need to tune on a dyno with 8 o2's to perfectly set them, or use 8 EGT's, we use an IR thermometer to see if any cylinders are leaner or richer, and adjust there. IR systems are tricky and usually not worth the hassle, we did 2 over the last few years, although they look great!

[GregWeld]

R systems are tricky and usually not worth the hassle, we did 2 over the last few years, although they look great!


Really? That's a pretty big statement - pretty "broad"....

Mine run and work perfectly as do my buddies (4 other 8 stack systems of various ECU's and motor combos).

[camcojb]

Really? That's a pretty big statement - pretty "broad"....

Mine run and work perfectly and do my buddies (4 other 8 stack systems of various ECU's and motor combos).

mine did too. With a .650 lift [email protected] solid roller you could let the clutch out in first gear at 900 rpm idle speed and even without touching the throttle it was smooth as silk. No jumping back and forth in gear at that low of an engine speed. And there's pretty much nothing that looks as cool as an IR setup.

[supremeefi]

mine did too. With a .650 lift [email protected] solid roller you could let the clutch out in first gear at 900 rpm idle speed and even without touching the throttle it was smooth as silk. No jumping back and forth in gear at that low of an engine speed. And there's pretty much nothing that looks as cool as an IR setup.

I agree, I did a 427 windsor Ford, made 621 hp with 9.0:1 compression and an 8 stack, had 535lbft of torque at 3500rpm.

Being able to adjust timing helps a bunch. But I don't agree that you need a dyno, it's nice but not absolutely necessary imo.
And I know Greg had a bad experience but I do cals via the internet all the time, it makes a difference if you know what you're doing.

[GregWeld]

I agree, I did a 427 windsor Ford, made 621 hp with 9.0:1 compression and an 8 stack, had 535lbft of torque at 3500rpm.

Being able to adjust timing helps a bunch. But I don't agree that you need a dyno, it's nice but not absolutely necessary imo.
And I know Greg had a bad experience but I do cals via the internet all the time, it makes a difference if you know what you're doing.


Back when I first starting doing this -- there was no internet!

:willy: :rofl:


I agree that you can tune via emailing files.

[ks71z28]

They can be made to run well, but the drivability can be a bit fussy. Plumbing in a vacuum port to each cylinder is important to run a IAC, and also equal out the tip in throttle. 8 blades can be tough to sync at all throttle positions. We run tripple Solex carbs on our GT-2 240z, but that car always sees at least 1/2 throttle at all times!

[GregWeld]

Inglese's new(er) cast manifold for Small Block Chevys has a huge cast in plenum in the valley area... so vacuum is "plumbing free"... and the large volume smoothes out the pulses.

I run NO IAC on either of my motors... no need for it.

[shaun8541]

I agree, I did a 427 windsor Ford, made 621 hp with 9.0:1 compression and an 8 stack, had 535lbft of torque at 3500rpm.

Being able to adjust timing helps a bunch. But I don't agree that you need a dyno, it's nice but not absolutely necessary imo.
And I know Greg had a bad experience but I do cals via the internet all the time, it makes a difference if you know what you're doing.


Did you do that 427 with the EZ EFI or the XFI?

[ccracin]

I agree, I did a 427 windsor Ford, made 621 hp with 9.0:1 compression and an 8 stack, had 535lbft of torque at 3500rpm.

Being able to adjust timing helps a bunch. But I don't agree that you need a dyno, it's nice but not absolutely necessary imo.
And I know Greg had a bad experience but I do cals via the internet all the time, it makes a difference if you know what you're doing.

With all do respect, I'll bet everyone that had their car tuned either on a dyno or via the internet and had problems had a tuner that said "No Problem, I know what I'm doing". Then they were told their cam didn't match their heads or the distributor wasn't right. That's the one I like, the cam doesn't match the heads, so your car won't move under it's own power. Yet it drove into the dyno session. See my point? The problem is, how many hundreds and thousands of dollars does a guy have to spend to get the guy that DOES know what he is doing? I'm sure you are excellent at what you do, do you offer a guarantee? That was the reason we went with the EZ-EFI. It made 614hp and 544ft# on an LS415. We will see about drivability. However, it comes recommended from Wegner Automotive, and their resume is also very impressive. Are there limitations to it, yes. Will it do what we want, yes. I know you can not endorse self learning EFI systems as that would take money out of your pocket, but for the people that read these forums and never get involved in the discussions, I think it is necessary to be objective and give all the pros and cons. For what it's worth, if I do get into a build where we need more complex EFI control I would feel comfortable working with you from what I have read here. :cheers:

[GregWeld]

Chad -- Glad to see someone finally gets the point I've been trying to make... that for MANY folks -- these new self tuning systems work just "fine". They're not for every stinking motor ever built -- but with some planning with the engine builder - the motor can be built to be EFI friendly... and if you're not looking for every last one tenth of one percent horse power these systems fire up - starting running - and in a matter of 50 miles of driving they're tuned and ready to go. Then they keep getting better and better.

The sooner the "tuners/installers" out there embrace these - the sooner the stories become POSITIVE EXPERIENCES with EFI... rather than the HORROR STORIES I hear every time I go somewhere...

But, people have to learn the ins and outs of EFI vs just slapping it on any old motor and hoping for the best... But that's a whole different discussion. :cheers:



With all do respect, I'll bet everyone that had their car tuned either on a dyno or via the internet and had problems had a tuner that said "No Problem, I know what I'm doing". Then they were told their cam didn't match their heads or the distributor wasn't right. That's the one I like, the cam doesn't match the heads, so your car won't move under it's own power. Yet it drove into the dyno session. See my point? The problem is, how many hundreds and thousands of dollars does a guy have to spend to get the guy that DOES know what he is doing? I'm sure you are excellent at what you do, do you offer a guarantee? That was the reason we went with the EZ-EFI. It made 621hp and 550ft# on an LS415. We will see about drivability. However, it comes recommended from Wegner Automotive, and their resume is also very impressive. Are there limitations to it, yes. Will it do what we want, yes. I know you can not endorse self learning EFI systems as that would take money out of your pocket, but for the people that read these forums and never get involved in the discussions, I think it is necessary to be objective and give all the pros and cons. For what it's worth, if I do get into a build where we need more complex EFI control I would feel comfortable working with you from what I have read here. :cheers:

[fleetus macmullitz]

Chad -- Glad to see someone finally gets the point I've been trying to make... that for MANY folks -- these new self tuning systems work just "fine". They're not for every stinking motor ever built -- but with some planning with the engine builder - the motor can be built to be EFI friendly... and if you're not looking for every last one tenth of one percent horse power these systems fire up - starting running - and in a matter of 50 miles of driving they're tuned and ready to go. Then they keep getting better and better.

The sooner the "tuners/installers" out there embrace these - the sooner the stories become POSITIVE EXPERIENCES with EFI... rather than the HORROR STORIES I hear every time I go somewhere...

But, people have to learn the ins and outs of EFI vs just slapping it on any old motor and hoping for the best... But that's a whole different discussion. :cheers:

Very informative post Herr Veld. :thumbsup:

[supremeefi]

Did you do that 427 with the EZ EFI or the XFI?

Neither one, Accel Gen 7.
That's why I mentioned what I did. The XFI can't tailor the individual cylinder trim by load/rpm. It's an all or nothing calibration with the XFI and doesn't exist at all on the EZ.

Compos, thank you for the comment, I think:thumbsup:

Yes there are too many mediocre tuners out there, with every make of system. I know I've run across too many.
And yes I do gaurantee my tuning. But I ask all the right questions about the application BEFORE I sell anybody anything. And I'm not concerned about not making any money on the self tuning stuff, it's not my primary source of income anyway. If you look closely at the software there are better and average systems around.

But the nice thing about some of the better systems out there is that they will help an otherwise ill advised combination to some degree, i.e. another 427 Ford I did with a 249/[email protected] on a 110 hyd roller cam. It came to me with a Mass AirFlo system, self tuning right? Ran like crap, even after 3 chip changes and sending the ECM back twice. After swapping to a non self learning system, it idles at 750 rpm all day and runs great.

[Vegas69]

Last time I checked, factory cars self tune after initial calibration.

[GregWeld]

I ask all the right questions about the application BEFORE I sell anybody anything. And I'm not concerned about not making any money on the self tuning stuff, it's not my primary source of income anyway.


That is what most of the sales / tuner guys DON'T do.... they just sell or install and think they can figure it all out... SO KUDOS TO YOU MARK!

:cheers:

[supremeefi]

Thanks Greg, I try.

[Coursey]

http://i884.photobucket.com/albums/ac46/Coursey1983/1966%20Nova/28dad826.jpg

I was trying to think of a "clean" option to run my fuel lines.

Is it a bad idea to mount the regulator on the firewall between the distributer and coolant lines. Then run the fuel lines down behind the motor and on top of the trans. The lines would then run down the center of the car like the factory line is ran.