Who needs 1000hp?

[fatlife]

I've noticed a big trend lately with everyone wanting 1000hp or close too it. I know with the twin turbo deal it is fairly easy these days. But why? What do you do with 1000hp??? Unless you are drag racing I don't see the reason. I'm guessing its for the wow/bragging rights factor? I'm not knocking it. I'm sure I would be plenty stoked to have that much hp, but realistally it seems silly. You have all that extra weight from the turbos, extra plumbing and complications, and a ton of extra heat, let alone you will never harness all that power, and when you do it will probably start breaking stuff.

Now let me say, that I have worked/tuned on a grand national that was putting out 20PSi on pump gas and had power for days, and it was a BLAST to drive, but this thing might of had 500hp. Even then it would burn rubber when the boost hit in almost any gear.

I am going to guess and say it is just the same as having the bear 6 piston brakes, 10 point roll cage, and 335 rubber on the back. It is just part of the fun of building a car, and its fun to have overkill. But to be honest, when I see cars with all this stuff, I kinda :rolleyes: as I figure that it is all just to be cool :cool: (which it is, who wouldn't want any of that!!)

So not that I think there is anything wrong with it, but is there anything you could actually use all that power for? :morepower

[nitrorocket]

In my case, I like to drag race. Money has kept me from racing this year with only one income and the sort, but I love to go to the dragstrip. I make a little over 1000 hp, but rarely use it on the street, but it is there if I ever want or need it. With turbos it does not effect driveability at all. Whether I drive around with the boost at 10 psi or 25 psi, it still drives the same untill it is floored. It is mostly just a side effect of turbos that they make massive power. My last motor was a 427" fuel injected N/A small block, made 650 hp and went 11.0 @123, but it was not a "driver" motor. I also wanted to go 9's as I drive it on the street. I wanted a street motor that was more reliable and was super cheap to build and no maintenance to drive, so I built a twin turbo LS1. Does that answer your question?? ;)

[fatlife]

Yes, but what about the guys who don't drag race?

[nitrorocket]

Well, Then It Is Just For Bragging And Completely Usless. :D

With a racing tire and an auto it is somewhat harnessable. I my car I have the boost level change per gear to help hook. 1st is 9psi,2nd is 12 psi, and 3rd is 18.5 psi, if I do a huge burnout, It will hook decent like this off the trans brake only, foot brake does'nt hit the tires and they go up in smoke about 5 feet out. :(

[Roadrage David]

Yes, but what about the guys who don't drag race? on the streets and on the cirquit race track 550/600 hp is ALL you need ....

[nitrorocket]

Also, on my ride in particular, I went from a tall deck small block (220 lb block) to the aluminum LS1. The turbo setup added about 80 lbs I would guess(I need to rescale it again to find out for sure), but I lost that or more with the LS1 swap.

[Datsbad]

Yody your too funny.

[fatlife]

I think its great to have all that extra stuff, even said I wasn't knocking it. Its definetly cool, but my question was about having 1000hp in a street driven car. I'm not asking in a negative way, just actually curious, and thought it would make for a good conversation. Not in anyway saying that it is wrong, just have been seeing it a lot lately and am wondering what people are going to do with it? I think it could make for an intersting/informative discussion. Hey Yody turned a new leaf, time for a new name :thumbsup: :lol:

[ArisESQ]

"extra weight" from the turbos seems like it would be negligible compared to gains you would see, so i would think that its a moot point.... i do agree with you though. 1000 hp is definently excessive when it comes to actual usable power, but then again, you can say you have 1000 hp.

and 335 are just as much for aesthetics as they are for traction... just an idea.

[crazy1969]

Have you ever watch the tv show called home inprovement (tool time) its all about more power . There nothing like pulling up to some prebby guy in his vette or porshe etc .looking over at him and girlfriend ( think there cool) and beening bitch slap by a REAL MUSCLE CAR .Thats whats its all about, old muscle with todays handling and power so the more power the better ,And looks of those twins under the hood!! :thumbsup:

[fatlife]

Have you ever watch the tv show called home inprovement (tool time) its all about more power . There nothing like pulling up to some prebby guy in his vette or porshe etc .looking over at him and girlfriend ( think there cool) and beening bitch slap by a REAL MUSCLE CAR .Thats whats its all about, old muscle with todays handling and power so the more power the better ,And looks of those twins under the hood!! :thumbsup:

lmao :D

[nitrorocket]

It's all about good looks!! :D
http://i8.photobucket.com/albums/a50/nitrorocket/_DSC0005.jpg



And Dyon queen bragging rights!! :D
http://i8.photobucket.com/albums/a50/nitrorocket/20065-200291.jpg
(I only went on because of peer pressure and my buddies paid for it!! :unibrow:

I am more of a track number guy. Who cares how much power you make. How cool is the car and how fast is it!

[Datsbad]

Good looks pretty much sums it up, I think !
why do people workout, get breast implants,etc....Looks. sometimes that is what is most important to some!
Is it overkill or not needed...? Probably yes

A LS1/LS2 with turbos is not hard to make 1000 and just come easy these days.

[RickM415]

hi Yody ...i want 1000HP!!! lol

[fatlife]

I'd personally prefer a motor like JP put in his nova, a stroked NA LS2 or whatever. To be honest my daily driver is a turbo, its a slow-poke 87 nissan 300zx 3.0 six cylinder with a little T3 turbo at about 10PSI with no intercooler. I like the turbos and the car is fun with a 5 speed and posi.

You are taking this the wrong way though I think. I am not critisizing anyone. I put the 454 in my car because it makes good hp without any add-ons. I like big cubes. I've only driven the car a handfull of times(not really tuned either) and it was fast! But it was managable. Had a smooth power delivery up until about 6,800 rpm(scared to go higher on an unsorted new motor) It didn't kick out sideways at 80 mphs unexpectantly, although a gear change could possibly change that, and it is getting different gears.

I'm probably right at about 600hp, prob a little more. I couldn't imagine trying to get on it with 1000hp on the street. Just seems like trying to keep the car in control would be more trouble and less fun than something with 5-600hp that you could enjoy more with the tires sticking. Although if I did have 1000hp on tap, it would be fun to turn up the boost once in awhile just for ****s and giggles.

But honestly I just see cars getting built over to the max so far out, that it seems a little absurd. Most cars would be much more fuctional and FASTER with a more well rounded system. I would bet that stielows latest car would be faster than the mule, due to the more linear and smooth power delivery from the LS7, rather than the massive TTmotor in the Mule. I think charlie even said that the Mule was almost too slippery on the track. However I do recognize that a lot of the fun of this hobby is having too much! Not everyone is concerned with absolute function. I know this and that's cool! :thumbsup: hey, its your car build it however you'd like and do whatever makes you enjoy it even more, but I thought a good post like this with the in's AND out's of building something with so much power might help some people :yes:

[shineym3]

While I have absolutely no interest in making 1000hp or even having my car make that (sorry for the old guy joke, couldn't help it! :D ) I do appreciate the work that it takes to get there. While it may sound a bit corny, I actually see building these cars as an art form. While people like myself consider a 1920's era poster of a monkey kicking back a bottle of alcohol "art" I also consider a well engineered machine a piece of art. Made even cooler by the fact that it aslo DOES something as opposed to just sitting there. Cars like anything that Mark Stielow has laid his hands on and FUEL interest me because they are so well engineered and defintely push a design envelope. 20 or even 10 years ago, a 1000hp truly streetable car was UNHEARD of, yet Mule is a living breathing example of that. I'd also be willing to bet that more than 1 or 2 people on these pages also have a thing for guns and watches too! :thumbsup:

[ilovefirstgens]

Have you ever watch the tv show called home inprovement (tool time) its all about more power . There nothing like pulling up to some prebby guy in his vette or porshe etc .looking over at him and girlfriend ( think there cool) and beening bitch slap by a REAL MUSCLE CAR .Thats whats its all about, old muscle with todays handling and power so the more power the better ,And looks of those twins under the hood!! :thumbsup:

While I dont think thats all of it for everyone it certainly does add a lot of emotion to the deal which is a lot of what theese cars are about.

And if we were all about function and speed we would all have c5s as 95% of the cars here have way more than the cost of a base c5 in parts and labor.

Also as nitro was saying a 1khp turbo car is VERY different than even a 600hp na or supercharged car. They love small overlap cams (read stock idle) and if you dont want the power its not there but when you do its there every time, kinda like having automatic nitrous. :D

[fatlife]

hi Yody ...i want 1000HP!!! lol
what are you willing to do for it??? :_paranoid :dance:

[fatlife]

and BTW maybe I'm just a weenie and can't handle the power!!!!! :fluffy:

[RickM415]

well its just fun to have 1000hp on a engine that runs on pump gas still gets 20mpg at least its reliable ....no adjustments needed ....quiet like hell and the power is as easy as turning up the volume hehe

best of all ...that sleeper status

[RickM415]

Yody ...were you working on mike`s gn ?

[ilovefirstgens]

Oh and just to be one of the cool people since im sooo into function over form im putting together plans for a tt setup but only 6-650rwhp on pump gas since with my 285s out back that will be sooo much more useable :lol:

[fatlife]

Oh and just to be one of the cool people since im sooo into function over form im putting together plans for a tt setup but only 6-650rwhp on pump gas since with my 285s out back that will be sooo much more useable :lol:
sorry, I'm going to apologize in advance for whoever told you, that you were one of the cool people. :lol:

[ilovefirstgens]

sorry, I'm going to apologize in advance for whoever told you, that you were one of the cool people. :lol:

Well its good to see the labotomy wasnt a complete success :thumbsup:

[fatlife]

I actually edited that post, and added a bit about the mule v the new camaro X. I think that is a good comparison of what I am talking about.

You have the Mule with the TT 1000HP small block, and then you have the camaro X with the NA 500hp(underated) LS7. Which do you think would be easier, faster, and more fun to drive? Obviously that is a subjective question and is going to vary from person to person, but I would take the X way before the mule. The LS7 will put out 600hp, get 20mpg, and have a smooth idle, and will also be a rippin motor with a smoother linear power delivery. But hey differnet strokes for different folks I guess. But if you look at the real purpose of any of this stuff that we put on the cars, the fundemental reason for all of this $$$ is performance. I think it would be hard to argue that a skilled driver could do more with the camaro X than the Mule due to the Mules over-abundance of power, even with it detuned. There must be a reason why Mark didn't build another TT machine.

I'm not saying that one thing is better than another even though it might sound like it. And I understand you can Detune a TT motor to make it more docile, just kinda exploring what having 1000hp is about. Thanks for not taking it as an argument and seeing it for more as a discussion

[fatlife]

Well its good to see the labotomy wasnt a complete success :thumbsup:

:rofl: :rofl:

[rocketman]

Well,everbody has a differnet idea of drivable.i run a 710 cube 1050 hp motor in my pro street car,and it's not bad to drive with a 4l80e it does ok on mpg,did 16 mpg on a road trip.

It's pretty cool when a guy in a import pulls up and you can nail the throttle at 80 mph and do a burnout :D

But mainly these 1000 hp rides are bragging rights.

[Blown353]

But mainly these 1000 hp rides are bragging rights.

No, they are street registered tire durability testers. I'm due for another check from Michelin for more "research" any day now. :P

[rocketman]

No, they are street registered tire durability testers. I'm due for another check from Michelin for more "research" any day now. :P


I wish I could get on M/T's r&d team. :cool:

[clill]

Actually the Mule was great on the track. We dialed the boost down so there would be no suprises but it probably would have been fine with more boost. I have had a Procharged big block that made 828rwhp on pump gas that would be a absolute bitch to drive on Power Tour. You would have to constatnly pay attention to what your right foot was doing. The Mule with the turbos drives like a 8 1/2 -1 comp smallblock unless you put your foot in it. I also have driven the effortless torque of the Red Witch, 532" 9-1 comp. All 3 are different but the Mule and Red Witch are both very easy to drive. Pump gas boost on the Mule is probably 700 hp ? and very easy to drive. A by-product of making 700 hp is the ability to turn the boost up to 1000 hp if desired. Most other 700 hp cars are alot less drivable. Maybe someday I can talk Mark into running laps with Camaro X and then turning the boost up on the Mule and running some laps and see what the differences are.

[camcojb]

Actually the Mule was great on the track. We dialed the boost down so there would be no suprises but it probably would have been fine with more boost. I have had a Procharged big block that made 828rwhp on pump gas that would be a absolute bitch to drive on Power Tour.


Sissy! :D


Jody

[fatlife]

Actually the Mule was great on the track. We dialed the boost down so there would be no suprises but it probably would have been fine with more boost. I have had a Procharged big block that made 828rwhp on pump gas that would be a absolute bitch to drive on Power Tour. You would have to constatnly pay attention to what your right foot was doing. The Mule with the turbos drives like a 8 1/2 -1 comp smallblock unless you put your foot in it. I also have driven the effortless torque of the Red Witch, 532" 9-1 comp. All 3 are different but the Mule and Red Witch are both very easy to drive. Pump gas boost on the Mule is probably 700 hp ? and very easy to drive. A by-product of making 700 hp is the ability to turn the boost up to 1000 hp if desired. Most other 700 hp cars are alot less drivable. Maybe someday I can talk Mark into running laps with Camaro X and then turning the boost up on the Mule and running some laps and see what the differences are.

Very interesting, and a good point about other 700hp cars v tt 700hp. I think that would be a great comparison, if it would ever happen

[Streetking]

You are right, 1000hp is useless on the street, but it is fun to have. As Charlie said, a turbo car can be made to be more "driveable" than a radical big block. My Viper makes 940 rwh on 93 oct and 1278 rwh on 109. Even with 355's on the rear, it blows the tires at 100mph, but it's more docile than the 534ci n/a motor in the Camaro. Now I got to get a stronger diff set up if I want to go to the drag strip with it. I have more fun in my daily drive SC300 with a small single turbo that puts down 500rwh through a automatic because it's more "streetable" power. I seem to do alot more track events, so I do prefer n/a motors more. They seem to last alot longer when you run hard all day long..

SW
http://www.fototime.com/CFF0640470756EB/orig.jpg
http://www.fototime.com/6134A366B70B9D4/orig.jpg
http://www.fototime.com/B0F726F4C3E54B4/orig.jpg
http://www.fototime.com/CCFDB9935D0E94A/orig.jpg
http://www.fototime.com/75C609400DB910D/orig.jpg

[fatlife]

Man your cars are all really shiny are you have the majic touch, cuz every pic I see always has those shiny glitter stars in them :cool:

I thought the SC was black with 505a's? man I can't keep track :faint:

[Streetking]

Man your cars are all really shiny are you have the majic touch, cuz every pic I see always has those shiny glitter stars in them :cool:

I thought the SC was black with 505a's? man I can't keep track :faint:

Thanks, the blk SC you were thinking of was my blk '97 with the Supra motor and 6spd in it. I went 10.1@144 in that car. I sold it to a friend of mine last year. I do have another blk '97, but it's got the same package as my white car except it has a bigger dual ball bearing turbo. I just got the blk car about 2 months ago. It has only 5k original miles on it, came from a old lady that never drove it. If she could only ride/see it now.. :D

SW

http://www.fototime.com/F9BA465582BC8C1/orig.jpg
http://www.fototime.com/5685F0E7D9738B9/orig.jpg

[XcYZ]

Wow. Incedible cars, SW. :yes:

[rocketman]

[QUOTE=Streetking]You are right, 1000hp is useless on the street, but it is fun to have. As Charlie said, a turbo car can be made to be more "driveable" than a radical big block. My Viper makes 940 rwh on 93 oct and 1278 rwh on 109. Even with 355's on the rear, it blows the tires at 100mph, but it's more docile than the 534ci n/a motor in the Camaro. Now I got to get a stronger diff set up if I want to go to the drag strip with it. I have more fun in my daily drive SC300 with a small single turbo that puts down 500rwh through a automatic because it's more "streetable" power. I seem to do alot more track events, so I do prefer n/a motors more. They seem to last alot longer when you run hard all day long..

SW


Whats tire's on the rear of the viper.

[rwhite692]

What Charley said.

Personally I don't NEED this much power. Taken to extremes, I could say I dont NEED any of my car hobby stuff, at all....But my Chevelle had big power and was not very driveable on the street... My wife would not, ever, drive that car. So, I am going TT this time, because I WANT to have very docile "around town" behavior and to have big power on tap when I WANT it. That, and to keep things intersting and build something I haven't done before, etc...

[chicane]

on the streets and on the circuit* race track 550/600 hp is ALL you need ....


I completely agree.

I too have noticed this trend increasing. Especially on other boards.... you have a bunch of "dyno number queen's" that bicker about it all the time, on who's who and who you think you are because of it. Who cares really ??

The funny thing is, that these geeks throw down all this smack and get their package built and then find out that they have to replace everything behind it..... because they blew it up..... again.

Go look LS1tech.
"Uhhh... rear end making noise. What or why did this happen ??"
"I blew out my driveshaft again..... why ??"
"Im on my enth set of u-joints, what to try next ??"
"What is a good rearend... I keep blowing mine up ??"

Maybe because you've dropped a 415cid and 300 shot into your 3500lb street car with a mini truck 7.5" differential ??

And they actually bitch about the cost of certain things..... Like "Why does Katech get so much for their engines / or shortblocks ??" "How can they ask for so much, its rediculous ??"

Probably because you have never been in the 1k hp arena before and that is what it costs ?? Not to mention that there is a damn good reason that they have the heritage they have and won the title's they possess.

Here's a great example of this..... right here. (http://www.ls1tech.com/forums/showthread.php?t=564515)

Pretty damn funny thou Yodemiser.

[Speedster]

Who NEEDS 1000 hp ? No one.
Who WANTS 1000 hp ? Some do, some don't.
Why 1000 hp ? Because you can.

Technology, reliability and availablility have made this type of number possible. And we are not talking drag-only trailer queens. With the easy access to turbos, centrifugals, intercoolers, EFI, crank trigger, 5/6 speeds, overdrive autos, paddle shifters, etc. power and speed have become easier and easier.

So whatever trips your trigger, fine. I just hope that everyone stays safe. Easy access to this power can be dangerous. I see this in the boating world too. Ten years ago fast boats went 80. Just a few went 100. Now the bar is 140 and a couple around 160. Some of these people are now dead. In the past 2 months half a dozen people were killed who couldn't handle power. We are reaching the point where 10 times as many people can afford this level of power, and I bet each one of you can think of a half a dozen people that would terrify you with 1000 hp. Especially if kids are involved. Can you image a newly licensed 17 year old out with 3 friends ?

Along with many of you, I consider myself a g-force/power/acceleration addict. I also have incredible respect for that and drive accordingly.

Just my .02 cents

[nitrorocket]

Who NEEDS 1000 hp ? No one.
Who WANTS 1000 hp ? Some do, some don't.
Why 1000 hp ? Because you can.

Some need it. It the track(dragstrip) you need all you can get, especially with a heavy car. It also depends on what you actually do with the car. Some like to drag race, some like to pull top end in challanges like the one for hotrod. Doing that stuff, 1000 hp does not go to far these days. Heck, my closest is trapping 175 at the track, figure that out power wise in a 3500 lb car!! :D It really all depends what the goals are for the car.

1000 hp...... That is a common number because it is easily achievable with 93 octane, with race gas, the same car can make 1200-1500 hp at the push of a button!! So really, any turbo car with a built bottom end is a 1000 hp motor if you turn up the boost.

[Leadfoot1]

I need to learn more about turbo's.....

Don't they need lots of spooling to be fun on the street?

Nitro, tell us more on your set up. I have a 30 000 miles 98 LS1 on the shop floor i need ideas what to do to it! 6-700 horses would do the trick for me!

I looked at Prochargers P1-SC....Why would i prefer turbos to a supercharger?

Lead.

(oh yeah! i saw that vid of your car....First, I need to say i agreed with others;i would not have had my 2 girls (2 and 4) that close...BUT WOW!!!! It sure kicks ass!)

I lost the link...care to run it again?

[nitrorocket]

Twin 60-1 hi fi turbos are nice and small(1000 hp capability) and would work great on your motor. My boost comes on at 2500 rpm. There really is no "lag" with 450 hp on tap without the turbos. Turbos are the most efficient and you quietest, reliable, and get the best mileage, but you have to find a kit, or be willing to do alot of labor. Procharger D1sc will make the same power (1000 hp) maxed out, but will not be as efficient, but is an easier bolt on. I went with turbos because I wanted the ultimate and wanted this to be the last setup I had to build for the car. I had alot of motors before I figured out that turbos are the way to go. I just wish I would have done this 5 motor swaps ago!! :D


And for the vid, My wife zoomed WAY in, that made me look REAL close, but I wasn't. :D

The latest street video:

http://thumbs.vidiac.com/1aae1a24-3c41-4fec-a8a1-981e018124aa.jpg (http://srvidz.vidiac.com/video/1aae1a24-3c41-4fec-a8a1-981e018124aa.htm)Click here to see Video (http://srvidz.vidiac.com/video/1aae1a24-3c41-4fec-a8a1-981e018124aa.htm)

An old dyno video wwith low boost and smaller turbos:

http://thumbs.vidiac.com/cff51b06-3df9-4894-be17-3251caa6e899.jpg (http://srvidz.vidiac.com/video/cff51b06-3df9-4894-be17-3251caa6e899.htm)Click here to see Video (http://srvidz.vidiac.com/video/cff51b06-3df9-4894-be17-3251caa6e899.htm)