Dreamin Ta's

[NOT A TA]

I did the plastic headlight with turn signal swap so I could use the turn signal openings for the brake ducts about 10 years ago. Currently setting the ducts up on each side of the radiator as shown in the pics below. The turn signal openings are way out at the side of the car and air is moving fast horizontally due to bow wave with a splitter. Also using air from right above the splitter may reduce air pressure on the splitter a bit (less downforce). With the duct openings in the core support the tubing is shorter (less weight) and less convoluted also so flow should be smoother. Ideally the openings in the core support would have a more rounded curved entrance but I was using what I already had.

In the lower pic you'll also see a hood to core support seal, bumper bracket seal, and core support to fender seals. So the only air that gets past the core support is through the radiator or the brake ducts.

http://i240.photobucket.com/albums/ff292/NOTATA/The%2014%20Car%20Performance%20Therapy/004_zpsaxq1s3fe.jpg (http://s240.photobucket.com/user/NOTATA/media/The%2014%20Car%20Performance%20Therapy/004_zpsaxq1s3fe.jpg.html)

http://i240.photobucket.com/albums/ff292/NOTATA/The%2014%20Car%20Performance%20Therapy/007_zps1zv3uuom.jpg (http://s240.photobucket.com/user/NOTATA/media/The%2014%20Car%20Performance%20Therapy/007_zps1zv3uuom.jpg.html)

[WSSix]

Good work, Bob.

Great information, John. How's the car coming along? What are your thoughts on using the grills or the bumper overhand on the later TA's like mine as air inlet for brake ducts or the engine? I'm planning at some point to close off the core support entirely like a 3rd or 4th gen to control air flow.

[Panteracer]

Thanks for the input John.... I think I am going to
stick with the turn signal ducts for now..
My splitter has an added on piece below so it is much larger
than just the normal Ta one
I was looking at closing the ends off also... maybe use rubber like you

Need to get the bumper brackets done.. big heavy ones are
not going back on... then work on the fitting the nose and glass hood

Bob

[Panteracer]

Finally got the radiator mounted up

[Panteracer]

Rear view

[WSSix]

Nice work, Bob!

[Panteracer]

Thanks Trey.. not bad for just a carpenter

Now I need to mod the hood as the back of it hits
the top of the firewall.. guess those lowered frame spacers
I put in years back lowered things just enough to cause more work

Bob

[Panteracer]

Doing a little more to reduce weight as the alum
hinges seem too costly for me

[preston]

I've done things like that in the past.
Did you weight the difference ?

Since my car was fully caged I started hole sawing all the internal roof unibody parts. AFter my 3rd or 4th hole cut, I took out the calculator and figured out how much weight I was saving, after all I was cutting out 20+ 2.5" holes.
I'd spent 20 minutes cutting the first 4 holes. I figured if I cut all 20 it would save - 1.1 lbs.

I put the hole saw away.

[waynieZ]

Bob that's looking really trick. Your doing a great job.

[Panteracer]

Thanks Wayne

Yes all the drilling takes time and the hinges only
Weigh about 4 lbs each. The metal on them is fairly
thick but really only shaved about a half pound plus for
each. Kinda like the look though


I am looking at taking roughly 100 lbs off the front end
when done. Then head to gutting the doors next
The door bars are suppose to weigh 50lbs each

One Pantera guy said 1000 1" sheetmetal holes is only
about 3 plus lbs. might just be the cheap Russian steel
they are made of:)

Bob

[MtotheIKEo]

I'm taking the door bars out of my Camaro right now, I'll let you know what they weigh. I've heard more around 50 pounds for both doors combined.

[Panteracer]

Yes I would like to know
My glass and actuators are out
and it really helped. Guess I can weigh
all that now that I have a scale at the shop

Bob

[MtotheIKEo]

Got the drivers side door bar out. 22.0 pounds on the dot on my cheap luggage scale.

[Panteracer]

Thank for info. I still have a bunch
of front end work before I get to the bars

Bob

[NOT A TA]

Good work, Bob.

Great information, John. How's the car coming along? What are your thoughts on using the grills or the bumper overhand on the later TA's like mine as air inlet for brake ducts or the engine? I'm planning at some point to close off the core support entirely like a 3rd or 4th gen to control air flow.

I like the idea of using the bumper grill openings for brakes and/or engine intake while keeping the bottom feed for radiator. Closing off the core support is a good idea.

[NOT A TA]

Thanks for the input John.... I think I am going to
stick with the turn signal ducts for now..
My splitter has an added on piece below so it is much larger
than just the normal Ta one
I was looking at closing the ends off also... maybe use rubber like you

Need to get the bumper brackets done.. big heavy ones are
not going back on... then work on the fitting the nose and glass hood

Bob

I'm surprised no one has come up with a lightweight version of the bumper brackets even if they need to sell them as "off road only". I considered making some but have already gone way too far fabricating and modifying. Should bring my project thread up to date here.

Your core support looks nice!

[Panteracer]

John
What motor are you running in your car??
Is there a build page.

Bob

[Panteracer]

John
Bumper brackets are my next thing
Fairly simple with a flat bar below and then
A couple of angles above. Using all aluminum

See you have a 400. Any specifics??? Oiling issues?

Bob

[WSSix]

Thanks John. Definitely update your build thread. Your car is awesome!

[Panteracer]

Just received my new hood latches and front ducts
for the bird

Bob

[WSSix]

I'm thinking of going with those as well, Bob. Will you be running just two? Will they be the only thing keeping the hood closed? My concern is they won't be strong enough to hold the hood down at high speeds if only using two. Thoughts?

[Panteracer]

Trey
I figure if they can hold down Hobaug's
hood I am good. They actually have a pretty
good latching system on them. I will try to get
a picture of the inside the next day or so
Having my Pantera group over for Super Bowl

Bob

[carbuff]

I run these on my fiberglass hood and have never had any problems. I've been to at least 120, depending on if you call that high speed. ;)

[Panteracer]

Thanks Bryan

Bob

[NOT A TA]

John
Bumper brackets are my next thing
Fairly simple with a flat bar below and then
A couple of angles above. Using all aluminum

See you have a 400. Any specifics??? Oiling issues?

Bob

The aluminum brackets should save a few lbs. Just keep in mind with all the lightweight fiberglass and aluminum front end stuff you may want to tie the frame horns together with something substantial so you don't end up with the engine where the center console belongs if you stuff it in a tire wall.

Engine in my car is a fairly mild 400 that was a little under 300 RWHP on a dyno. Should have a little more with the new exhaust and some carb work. After I get the car back on track and sorted with the current engine I'll build a bigger power engine. For now it's remaining basically a momentum car till I get the aero tuned.

I had oil issues with the first 350 P engine and used a 7 Qt. Canton RR pan on the 400 P when I installed it, no issues with the Canton pan. I'm going to add an Accusump oil accumulator now because I'm doing a bunch of aero work that will hopefully increase cornering capabilities quite a bit.

I've seen 2nd gen glass hoods blow up in the center at high speeds when only using hood pins or latches out to the sides. It all depends on the aero set up of the particular car. I had a 74 Camaro bracket car that it had happened to when the previous owner was running it (over 120). The gel coat was all spider cracked and hood needed to be replaced. Every car and various brands of hoods are different so YMMV but I'd be cautious and consider also using a center latch of some type if you're planning on high speed. A good wind gust head on while on track might make your car think it's going 30 MPH faster.

[NOT A TA]

Thanks John. Definitely update your build thread. Your car is awesome!

Thanks Trey! I'll update mine but I'm gonna update yours first about the wheel cribs/jacking discussed in the beginning of it. I should have done that a loong time ago. ahahaha

[WSSix]

Thanks for the info on the latches gentlemen. I intend to keep my steel hood for now. I'm more worried about speeds up to 100mph really. I might eventually do an HPDE event but I can't see that being a regular occurrence. I'll make changes if it does. Main thing is I want to get rid of the front pull cable. It's annoying with the car so low, lol.

John, the cribbing has worked out well for me. I dislike jack stands. Only down side is I can't get my jack under the front cross member. I need to get the wheels up one some blocks first and then I can get the jack under the front.

[Panteracer]

John
Will be working on a bar to tie the frame rails
together. My friend gave me one that I need to shorten
just a little. Hope to have my buddy weld something up
tomorrow.

Good info on the latches. I do remember now Hobaug worried
about his hood so he cut some vents in it. That might be my solution

So what aero mods are you doing to your car??

Bob

[NOT A TA]

Long list of aero modifications.
1. Extended air dams for different height splitters
2. Splitters, different lengths for tuning, height and pitch adjustable
3. Underbody tray from splitter to diffuser with tunnels, height and pitch adjustable independent of body rake
4. Side splitters extended out from under tray
5. Wicker bills in front of wheel openings
6. Rear diffusers, probably a couple different designs
7. 3 different rear spoilers
8. Foilers behind wheel openings (these may actually be detrimental and not used on track)
9. Seal radiator support so only air allowed past is through radiator and brake ducts
10. Side window panels from cage to body to reduce chute effect on road courses
11. Roof fences?
12. Tire air dams
13. Front splash pan opening block offs
14. Modified fender vents couple different types
15. Rear wing
16. Cowl opening seals

[Panteracer]

John
Sounds like quite a list
Would love to see pictures as things progress

I was thinking some front skirts on the front splitter
to the fenders. Aka Z06 style. Have not got that far yet
Trying to keep CAM class for rear splitter but will more than
likely do a larger one also

Good stuff. Keep us posted

Was also wondering your car weight?
Trying to lighten mine

Bob

[NOT A TA]

John
Sounds like quite a list
Would love to see pictures as things progress

I was thinking some front skirts on the front splitter
to the fenders. Aka Z06 style. Have not got that far yet
Trying to keep CAM class for rear splitter but will more than
likely do a larger one also

Good stuff. Keep us posted

Was also wondering your car weight?
Trying to lighten mine

Bob

My car was 3500 before the safety upgrades. Probably about 3750 after. During the current project I've removed a few things like the HVAC and more factory sound deadening but added metal to the front/rear firewalls and done a bunch of chassis stiffening plus added weight with aero parts so I'll guess it'll be up over 3800. The next engine/trans will be lighter and then we'll see what happens after that.

I'll get around to updating my project thread but till then here's a pic of some prototype parts I made for the front during mock up. Might give you some ideas.

http://i240.photobucket.com/albums/ff292/NOTATA/The%2014%20Car%20Performance%20Therapy/002_zpsfhida09i.jpg (http://s240.photobucket.com/user/NOTATA/media/The%2014%20Car%20Performance%20Therapy/002_zpsfhida09i.jpg.html)

[Panteracer]

I finally got the wiring back in for the fans and relays
Mounted the Vac res tank and then did one of the
Brake ducts

Bob

[Panteracer]

Finished Brake duct

Bob

[flomofo]

Were the headlights made for any F-body or were they a universal number?

[Panteracer]

Headlights are Summit racing.. 7" diameter I believe.. like $70
for the pair.. its a racecar not a show car... but trying to make
it look somewhat showy and I needed a place to put the turn signals

Bob

[Panteracer]

My buddy gave me a brace so cut it down
and then had my buddy weld it up

[Panteracer]

Painted it up and Fabbed a couple of plates to sit inside
the frame rails

[Panteracer]

Brace bolted in place

[WSSix]

Nice! I have one that goes under the car. Looks almost like another sway bar until you realize it's welded in.

[Panteracer]

I decided to do a tow hook while I have everything
open in front. Kind of like a Mean Streets copy but with more
offset since the Birds grille is different

Bob

[Panteracer]

Finally got the lights fitted up and the nose brackets
done. Need to add one more brace on the lower center
as things flex just a little too much

Bob

[WSSix]

Nice work, Bob. You'll have it back on the road soon!

[Panteracer]

Trey
I have been a liitle slow on things lately
Had the death cough cold for a couple of weeks
Then I did a little yard work

Now time to get the bird done
Been looking at brakes

Bob

[Panteracer]

Added one more vertical brace and a tie to the lower glass nose
as things were flexing slightly... I figured I needed the support for
the added piece I put on the spoiler

Bob

[Panteracer]

Almost done with one of the braces... cleaned up
the cut inner fenders... got myself into doing some
body work on them and finally said good enough.... its
a race car

Hope to drive it this weekend and see if anything moves
around before I try to fit the hood

Bob

[Panteracer]

Finally took the bird out for spin after playing
with Can Am cars yesterday. Good to get it back
on the road. Need to get the front sway bar mounts redone
then start on fitting the new glass hood. Several weeks
before running Crows Landing

Bob

[Panteracer]

I finally got to fixing the nutserts that were loose on the
front swaybar... fabricated some backing plates on both sides
and had to make access holes in the frame on the side where
the Power Steering is bolted thru

Attached is the fabrication starting

Bob

[Panteracer]

Finished backing plate for the passenger side
I then had to shim the sway bar to get the bind
out of it.. it took some time to get it right
Then I made some curved plates to keep the sway
bar from moving left and right.. I had this issue in
the past and hitting the frame with one side is not good

Might be a different car.. but I could not tell much on my test run

Getting ready to Autocross it so all that is left is the hood
but I could run without

Bob

[glassman]

Nice...:cheers:

[Panteracer]

Mikey
You need to come out and run at Crows landing
in two weeks. Good place to test also as they usually
have a test track you can run as much as you want for $20
Also close to home for you

Bob

[SSLance]

So it looks like you threaded the bolts through the backing plate and then pounded a small piece of sheet metal around the head to keep the bolt from loosening when tightening the nuts on the bolts, is that what I'm seeing?

Why not just put a couple pretty good tack welds on the bolt heads to the backing plate?

I am afraid of having this same issue some day, with the monster muscle bar I'm running up front...I'm just waiting for the day those bolts pull out of the frame.

Car looks good, now get it finished up and go out and get some seat time in it!!

[glassman]

Mikey
You need to come out and run at Crows landing
in two weeks. Good place to test also as they usually
have a test track you can run as much as you want for $20
Also close to home for you

Bob

Yes. I plan on it. Now, if only i had a running car.....the tune is tomorrow (wed) so heres hopin its dialed by the weekend.....Sons weddin in our backyard in four weeks, prepping the house, then "no worky" on the house for 1.5 years.....Crows here we come!!!!

[Panteracer]

Lance,
yes threaded thru... locktight red then the sheetmetal
Not sure how to use the new welder my buddy has at my
shop... need to get a quick lesson.... so just went with this for now
After 28 years these things were bouncing around.. if I have
an issue I can get to them now..Nutserts were a pain to get out
I have a big gash in my arm from the sharp rotor when trying to pry them out

Mikey,
yes time to go to Crows.. mine can run even if the hood is
not on it.. would like to get the gear changed but too much
going on at work right now

Bob

[Panteracer]

So I finally weighed the car.. after adding the 5 point roll bar,
Disc brakes- still going to go bigger, 18" wheels with larger tires
out back, glass front end, hood, alum front supports, lexan rear window,
mono leaf springs, no side windows, sub frame connectors, hollow
front roll bar, alum fender braces etc I have saved 232 lbs so far
Car is at 3448 lbs without me in it... I know that's not the way
to weigh it but was how it was weighed at the good guys ride tech booth
a few years so I know it was accurate

I also just bought my folding bike so I don't have to walk a million
miles out at Crows landing this weekend.. getting old and the old
back pain goes right to the knee

Bob

[glassman]

Now you have to customize that bike!!!

Cars tuned, almost ready too run, but gotta help down in LA this weekend with my oldest, wedding prep sturff....

Keep it sunny side up and Crows!! how a bout some pics??

[Panteracer]

Mike,
I had a couple of other buddies wanting me to put
an engine on the bike also.... Hot Rodders:)

Might just run Crows one day to shake things down
as I have a million other things going on also

Bob

[WSSix]

Nice work, Bob. Now go have fun beating on the car!

[fleet]

Nice work, Bob. Now go have fun beating on the car!

Agreed. :thumbsup:

[Panteracer]

One of my Buddies is wanting a 455 for his girlfriend's car
So I brought two more motors from my old shop to the new one
to see what I have

1975 455 destroked to 428 but bored so 440 with carrillo rods, weisco pistons,roller rockers, etc.. crank walked due to bad scatter shield... all bearings bad
Built in Idaho

400 balanced, blueprinted but all stock items 1971 block
Rod bolt went out the side of the pan.. built in Oklahoma

455 1973 stock motor out of a junk car... spun bearing

Here we have 4 of the 9 motors this car has had over the years
so I thought a group shot before I start getting rid of them

Bob

[fleet]

One of my Buddies is wanting a 455 for his girlfriend's car
So I brought two more motors from my old shop to the new one
to see what I have

1975 455 destroked to 428 but bored so 440 with carrillo rods, weisco pistons,roller rockers, etc.. crank walked due to bad scatter shield... all bearings bad
Built in Idaho

400 balanced, blueprinted but all stock items 1971 block
Rod bolt went out the side of the pan.. built in Oklahoma

455 1973 stock motor out of a junk car... spun bearing

Here we have 4 of the 9 motors this car has had over the years
so I thought a group shot before I start getting rid of them

Bob

Bob,

If you had a nickel for every Poncho motor you had in that car...

:G-Dub:

lol

[Doug1]

Car's looking great! Won't be long now.

[Panteracer]

Thanks Doug,
Trying to figure out what way to go with brakes
found out the Speed Tech road assault uppers cannot
take an AFX spindle so need to change them if I want
to go Aero brakes... Baer makes a 14" setup but I wanted to
stay away from a drilled rotor.. they do make one but for
$600 dollars each too much..

Question is does it make sense to go 14" all the way around
or do 14" in front and 13" in back or keep my 6 piston 13" wilwoods
and buy a 6 or 4 piston 12.888 out back

If I change things out on suspension later then will the brakes be wrong
sounds like it... tired of doing band aids but for $5k in brake systems
it better be right.. seems like pandoras box keeps opening up

Bob

[Panteracer]

Did a little digging into one of my hurt motors
Thought the 400 had a broken rod bolt that went
thru the side of the pan. After pulling the pan it looks
like the rod bolts held up fine but as you can see the
Rod did not fair too well... Kinda hard on the crank also
Everything else seems to look ok

Now to check the 455 I think I spun a bearing. Never know
what you find in an abused motor

Bob

[Panteracer]

So I finally got into another damaged motor yesterday
A 1971 455 that was only run about 5 times
before I spun bearing...I did win at Slush series
with this motor before it let go... a junkyard dog that
I bought for $455.... everything else looks fairly
good so trying to decide if I get it redone or
sell it the way she sits now in case someone
wants to stroke things up etc

Bob

[Panteracer]

I figured out that I could not run Good Guys
without a hood so thought of taking the Pantera
but decided I might as well get the thing done
Cut the new latches in.. needed to get longer screws
and cut and file the underside as it was double layer
in some spots and not in others... Hot outside but
got it done.. Then I finished drilling my hinges for lightness:)
and then started the fitting.. hood to hinges needed to be
notched to let it move forward then I had to notch the bolt
holes to the fenders so it would sit down

It fits fairly well but I need to do some glass work in the center
to get the nose to line up.. go enough to go racing now.. will deal
with it when it goes to paint later

Bob

[MtotheIKEo]

Any pictures of the aerolatch pin mounting on the core support? I am getting ready to do mine and collecting ideas.

[Panteracer]

I will be at my shop tomorrow night and
can shoot a few more pictures. My core is
actually an aluminum tube. You need to look
under the hood to see where the backing plate lands since the hood
has some layers and curves. Then i found a place where
I could get to the verticle from underneath the tube to get the nut on

Really a lot easier than I originally thought
The thing I really like is positive locking and
if you don't have them latched you can see them
sticking up from the drivers seat. Been to a few events
where someone forgot to put hood pins in and busted
the hood and windshield. I actually had a vender break
A hood on my 69 trans am clone many years back
Tech took it down the street with hood locks open

Bob

[Panteracer]

Picture of the latch pin
Like I said on an alum crossbar
but just find a place you can get to below

simple install

Bob

[Panteracer]

Hard part was finding a place to fit the latch
where I could have the backing plate installed
I had to cut a little off one end in order to get it
installed... but all good... also as stated before
my screws were too short so a trip to the hardware
store for metric screws was needed

Glad this part is done.. have fun with yours

Bob

[Doug1]

How hard would it be to put these latches on a hood that's already painted? Mine has an airbrushed bird on it and I'd hate to have to replicated that but I need some sort of latches and I like the look of Aerocatch.

[carbuff]

We (we meaning Eric) installed them on my painted fiberglass VFN hood. I wasn't there when he did it, but I don't recall him complaining too much. I expect it's no harder that drilling through any other painted surface. Tape it up and cut through paint so you don't scratch.

The key is finding a point to mount them. Mine are more inboard that Bob's, and also turned 90* to keep them in the channel across the front of the hood. Here is a picture (kinda dark, but you can see them) of my hood:

http://i100.photobucket.com/albums/m23/carbuff69/1971%20Firebird%20Formula%20-%20Project%20TOW/IMG_20160106_092717_zps6t9wgmhc.jpg (http://s100.photobucket.com/user/carbuff69/media/1971%20Firebird%20Formula%20-%20Project%20TOW/IMG_20160106_092717_zps6t9wgmhc.jpg.html)

You can see the pins mounted in this picture also:

http://i100.photobucket.com/albums/m23/carbuff69/1971%20Firebird%20Formula%20-%20Project%20TOW/update_0531_10_zps994f07a2.jpg (http://s100.photobucket.com/user/carbuff69/media/1971%20Firebird%20Formula%20-%20Project%20TOW/update_0531_10_zps994f07a2.jpg.html)

[Panteracer]

Doug,
Yes I remember seeing your airbrushed bird.. very cool
The latches have a fairly large flange on the top side
so if you tape things up and mark it you will be fine

The biggest issue I had was all the stuff below was not in
the same line.. up and down and curves.. so that created
a little issue... I think Hobaug ...where I got the info on the
hinges- summit carries them- cut his in on new paint
when I was looking at his build

Bob

[Panteracer]

So I finally ordered rear brakes and a master
with a proportioning valve for the bird 12.88 4 pistons
to go with the 13" 6 pistions up front

They told me roughly two weeks so I figured the Pantera
was going to Crows but also needed new rear Rotors and pads

I come back from a meeting today and the stack is in the corner
everything came from Wilwood for both cars

Not sure I can get the gear change done before the 4th weekend
on the bird so I will start with the Pantera and then get going
on the bird... kinda like Christmas:)

Bob

[SSLance]

What a nice surprise to come home too!! Good luck on the upgrades!

[Panteracer]

Thanks Lance.. goal is to get the braking
and gearing right on the car and now that things
are lighter try to dial it in.. at that point I hope
to get some secret sauce data from someone who
knows what works:)

Bob

[carbuff]

Someone has a busy weekend coming up!

[Panteracer]

So after running the Pantera on the 4th it was time to start
working on the Bird... finally got the brakes mocked up out back
Now need to change out the master and then to the rearend shop
for a much needed gear change

Bob

[Zoomin]

Wilwood sure puts together a nice package of quality stuff.

What gear ratio do you have now, and what are you going to?

[Panteracer]

Have 411's and going to 373's
The TKO 600 tranny gears are so low and close together
I hit the rev limiter way too quick... Big torque motor
needs to bite a little better

Bob

[Panteracer]

So now that the rear brakes are done and the
rear sway bar is changed to an adjustable one
I ordered up a new pair of front tires going from
275 to 385's Bridgestone re71r but a little shorter also
as they are making a 30 series... Then I need to get
serious and cut the front fenders to get some more clearence

Bob

[carbuff]

Which rear tire are you going to run? I wish they made those tires in a larger size which would work for the rears. I'll be curious to see those mounted on the car given the 30-series height. :)

[Zoomin]

385's? oO


:D


Wouldn't that be cool with some 435's out back? :poke:

[Panteracer]

Zoomin.. not too much tire otherwise it will push like a dog:)
I had to make the Pantera rears smaller a long time back to get
rid of the push

Bryan,
I am running 335 Rival S tires out back.. they seem pretty good but
I don't have a lot of time with them.. yes the Bridgestones in my
opinion is the best tire out there unless you are running Dot Road
race tires which I run on my Pantera all the time

I wanted to get a little more clearance in height but also in
the turning point of the tire... I have only a 4 3/4" offset so
much of my rim is offset outside.. not the best in working but
my liking in looks.... when you put on modern a-arms they seem
to pull the wheel backward with the castor.. works great but in
my case hitting on the bolts that hold the fenders.. I had to grind
them and they still sometimes hit.. so get a shorter tire

I have found that running at shorter tire on my Pantera 35 series vs
40 series makes the car stick so much better on the track... Just
my experience so figured try it on the Bird

I also cut a tire in the front recently so need to flair the front
fender... figured get a little wider tire since cutting things...
was originally thinking 315's but don't think they will work with my offsets
and again I think the bridgestone is that much better to give up a little size

Bob

[carbuff]

Got it. I've had new Rival S's on TOW since March, but haven't driven on them yet other than a few miles. 275/315 currently, but I'm going to try and squeeze a 315 up front as well. When I did it previously, everything was great until I hit a bump at full lock. This is what I got for my trouble (315 Rival S with 5 miles on it...). Well crud, I can't copy my link at the moment, but suffice it to say that I have a new Rival with a cut to the cords. And I think if I had just rolled the fender I would have been ok. Live and learn...

[Panteracer]

So I did a little measuring and the new tires
are about 1/2" wider and 1/2" shorter. The shorter
dimension only lowers the car 1/4" but that 1/4" helps
with fender clearance at the back side of the fender
Verticle height will be opened up with the new flair

Bob

[Panteracer]

Ok back to the car...had to move some things around
in the shop so I now have 6 cars in there.. 4 Panteras
my bird and a mustang.. gave the back to my brother so he would
quit complaining

Missed Pleasanton because I had a short in my lights and finally
got that fixed last weekend.. just finished shortening the uprights
on the new sway bar so it is adjustable and clears the exhaust

So back to making flairs for the front end
Did a quick mockup last night and ordering a
shrinker today so I can start to get this project done
Trying to do a plant on so no repaint etc

Bob

[CJD Automotive]

Looking good! That body just looks right with a flare. How about a wide shot so I can see the whole car?!

[Panteracer]

Will try to remember to shoot a side shot
this weekend... heading out of town the
next couple of days and then back to the shop


Bob

[syborg tt]

Just read this entire thread. This is such a cool thread and the last post makes me want to flare my 70


Marty-MJ

[Doug1]

Make a few extra sets for us poor bastards who can't work metal! I'd be happy to pay for the time and effort :-)

[Panteracer]

Doug
This will be my first try at shaping these
It almost gets there just bending slightly
Will see how it goes when my Shriner shows up

Bob

[Doug1]

Looking forward to it!

[WSSix]

This will be cool. Keep us posted, Bob!

[Panteracer]

So spent some time with the shrinker
and found what I wanted I could just
bend slightly on my knee

This is the mockup piece I did a while
back. Finally bought the new metal and
will clean things up

Bob

[GregWeld]

Leave the lip long so you can roll it around some rod for strength....


Looks great Bob!

[Panteracer]

Thanks Greg

Also bought a new Aeromotive Steath cell
will be getting rid of the Ricks SS tank
Some trunk cutting and supports to be made

Bob

[Panteracer]

Finally got the courage to cut the fenders
Finished one side so far

Bob

[carbuff]

Finally got the courage to cut the fenders
Finished one side so far

Bob

That hurts my eyes!!! :superhack: :weld: :lostmarbles:

[GregWeld]

Bob --- Find your local Snap-On dealer and buy an air driven BODY SAW -- it will do a far nicer job for you.


https://store.snapon.com/Air-Saws-Dual-Chuck-Air-Saw-P758983.aspx


There are others -- and whatever you do - don't cheap out and buy the Blue-Point junk version (they have zero torque)

[glassman]

Thanks Greg

Also bought a new Aeromotive Steath cell
will be getting rid of the Ricks SS tank
Some trunk cutting and supports to be made

Bob

Thats funny looking luggage. Is that the new "retro" style?

Kiddin aside, are you fabbing rails and dropping it into the "tank location"? How many gallons is it? I'm interested in doing this at some point....

[Flash68]

Finally got the courage to cut the fenders
Finished one side so far

Bob

Atta boy Bob! Love it...

That hurts my eyes!!! :superhack: :weld: :lostmarbles:

I can think of something else that hurts my eyes.....

it starts with "shak" and ends with "er"

:twak:

:action-smiley-027:

[Track Junky]

Bob, can u post more pics. Looks like the back of the flare should go a bit longer.

[Panteracer]

Mike

Fuel cell will go thru the trunk
and sit on an alum frame I will
make. It is 20 gallon with an A1000
in tank pump (i have an external A1000)
so replacing it. 24" wide vs stock at 36"
20" deep and 10" tall vs 6-8" stock
It has -10 outlet and -8 return for the 1150 carb
Will also brace the frame with the supports
So more room for exhaust. Thinking of
running them in the middle like the Pantera

Track junky
The intent is to leave the back of the flair
Short. I want to match the rear flair and keep
the trans am look that has a flair in front but
not the back

Yes I have been putting off cutting the fender
but with one cut tire already and now going to 285/30 shorter
Tires -RE-71rs it will also be wider so the need for Flairs
Best of both worlds

Bob

[FETorino]

Finally got the courage to cut the fenders
Finished one side so far

Bob

Taking big risks is the only way to make big gains.:thumbsup:

Bob --- Find your local Snap-On dealer and buy an air driven BODY SAW -- it will do a far nicer job for you.


https://store.snapon.com/Air-Saws-Dual-Chuck-Air-Saw-P758983.aspx


There are others -- and whatever you do - don't cheap out and buy the Blue-Point junk version (they have zero torque)

That is a fact. A few dollars spent up front can save a bunch of time and $$ on the back end.:G-Dub:


That hurts my eyes!!! :superhack: :weld: :lostmarbles:

It's not like looking at rust bubbles appearing from under paint. It's just the start of some enhancements. Cut to cure.

[rustomatic]

You're a brave man, Bob. You're treating that pretty Fireibird like it's a Falcon . . .

[Panteracer]

Not a falcon?? but with an $1100 dollar paint job done over
25 years ago it makes it somewhat easier to
cut but I know to fix it will cost way more than that
Thinking of wrapping the flairs, hood etc

Not really a body man so trying to make this less painful
and stay out of Paint Jail

Hows your Vette/Falcon coming along??

Bob

[rustomatic]

Thanks for asking about my mess, Bob. It's actually coming along pretty decently as of late (see update). I thought writing books sapped the brain's creativity generator, but the sheetmetal job I cut out for myself is really kicking me.

As for an ugly state of wheelhousing, I submit the following (car will drop about another inch still, if not more--I will eventually apply a flare):

[Panteracer]

Finally spent a day fabbing up the alum
Flairs. Will more than likely wrap them later
in carbon fiber. Four link showing up Wednesday
I will do the tank at the same time

Bob

[Panteracer]

Ridetech four link showed up today
So time to fab the new fuel cell supports
and install the new suspension

Will have the old SS ricks tank to sell now

Bob

[Panteracer]

Cut out almost all of the bad spots
in the trunk prepping for the new
Fuel cell. Fab time next

Bob

[Josh@Ridetech]

Looks great, Bob! You're making me want a Firebird even worse now...

[Panteracer]

So the ridetech 4 link is almost done
Decided to ditch the rear seats as they
weigh 20.5lbs and will more than likely place
the battery in the back seat area

Weight savings so far
SS tank vs alum 25.5lbs
rear deck lid 23lbs
fuel pump (new one is in tank) plus battery tray 14lbs-have alum box very light
rear seats 20.5lbs

Gives me 83 lbs savings so far and that is not counting
the insulation I removed under the seats and behind,
the rubber trunk liner (that thing was heavy)
old steel cut out of the trunk-doing alum panels and alum framing

Car started a few years back without a 5 point bar or subframe connectors
at 3710 now down to 3355 and betting less once I am done with fab etc
Trying for 3200lb range... 355 lbs off the car so far

Bob

[WSSix]

Nice work, Bob!

[Panteracer]

I finally got motivated and finished the Ridetech 4 link
installation..

Bob

[fleet]

Looks good Bob. :thumbsup:

Keep us 'Bird fans posted going forward.

[glassman]

Sweet. What u crossin- with this summer? that? or that mid-engine thingy?

[Panteracer]

Mike,
Hoping to get the Firebird done before Goodguys
and then try to dial it in this summer.. the Mid engine
thingy is always the backup... will be at Crows for the
Park Memorial on the fourth of July weekend
I also may try to do Fresno SCCA events a few times
as they run 5 times in the morning and then tweak and
fun runs in the afternoon so 10 runs in a day help you
figure the changes you make on the car

Now trying to figure out how to fit the Sway bar as
it needs to be modified

Bob

[WSSix]

Looks good, Bob. Would it be easier to reroute the exhaust instead of build a new sway bar?

[Panteracer]

Trey,
Yes I may reroute the exhaust but was hoping to deal with
that later.. tips are just a bolt on right now

Might have to just shorten the bar

Bob

[Panteracer]

So I've been laying low unti I get my hip replaced
So finally spent some time looking for my Farm Truck
Took a trip down to Bakersfield and made the deal on a
1963 GMC truck. Full of patina with a rebuilt 350 and gear drive
Plans are to lower, disc brakes and shorten the bed
Just want a cruiser instead of all the go fast stuff

Bob

[WSSix]

Nice score, Bob! Good luck with the new hip. When does it go in?

[Panteracer]

Trey,
Thanks... going to see the surgeon tomorrow and will see how soon
I can get things going

I figure while recovering I can figure out a lot of things on
what to do on the truck, watch videos, get parts ordered etc
My wife is going to be watching me so I don't start working
on things too early:)

Shop down the street from mine is Slabsides and they have
a couple of these old trucks slammed etc... got me wanting one
even more every time I drove by... They have the logo on the
side of the truck.... I am thinking of doing one for mine Benz Sidezzz
Lots of my friends called me Benz or Benny

Bob

[WSSix]

Sounds like a good plan to me. Good luck, Bob!

[Panteracer]

So after almost 13 years it was time to pull the Pantera
Engine... it is a dart block, brodix headed 400" motor
Might use my Bryant crank and destroke it to 366" or
just up the size slightly from the 400"... not sure I want
to give up the torque although my buddy says an 8500 rpm
short stoke engine is killer... still on the fence

It will get a compression bump to 11/1 and a solid roller instead
of the flat tappet and finally go to shaft rockers... will see what
it looks like in the tear down

The Green Pantera in the background is my buddies that will be
receiving an SVO alum 427 short block with Afr heads so it was
time to keep up with the Jones:)

Bob

[GregWeld]

I have had MANY engines - small block big inch strokers.... big blocks.... high revving and everything in between.


What I look for in a STREET motor is torque at Low RPMS.....


What I look for in my track cars -- QUICK REVVING (meaning lightweight internals and flywheel/clutch etc) -- and they don't start running until 3500 RPM and smooth out about 4000 RPMS..... Race gas/high compression.... but they don't have to rev that high. I shift the Mustang at 7,000 RPM's even though it makes power to 7,400. I also rebuild it after every season. It's a 355 cubic inch Ford R block.... and makes 590 hp and makes 486 TQ at 5300.... and is still making 434 TQ at 7,000


My dyno pulls START at 4,000 RPMs



Talk to Tony Borello at Borello Race Engines - (530) 333-4752 - He's in the bay area

[Panteracer]

Thanks Greg
Would love to make it a race/track engine only... problem
is I do drive it a lot on the street so that is telling me keep
the torque with the stroker... my buddy back east who builds
a lot of cars and runs them put a destroked motor in his Pantera
and loves it....We ran together briefly at Texas world speedway
until he had a clutch line blow.. He does street drive it but not
sure how much

Bob

[GregWeld]

Thanks Greg
Would love to make it a race/track engine only... problem
is I do drive it a lot on the street so that is telling me keep
the torque with the stroker... my buddy back east who builds
a lot of cars and runs them put a destroked motor in his Pantera
and loves it....We ran together briefly at Texas world speedway
until he had a clutch line blow.. He does street drive it but not
sure how much

Bob




That was my point ---- if you want to enjoy it at all on the street -- stick with low end torque - because that's what's FUN to drive....


I would absolutely HATE my high strung race motor on the street.... it would be AWFUL. But on that track -- sings....

[WSSix]

Build for a broad power band, Bob. There's no reason you can't build an engine that pulls from about 2000 to 6500 with 400 cu inches on hand. Now, you may have to lower your power goals overall to achieve this but you'll still make plenty of power for the street.

I love the power band on my 383 LT1. Pulls great everywhere yet cruises no problem at 2000 rpm on the highway. Even pulls up hills in sixth gear from 55 mph without issues. It rips to 6500, too. Constantly having to ring out the engine to go is no fun.

On a side note, damn does your car look good.

[Panteracer]

Trey,
The 400 that I pulled has been one of the best engines
I have ever had... I run it to 7500, it has low end, top end
and with the 5 speed that the Pantera came with I just slightly
bumped up the top gear. The car cruising at 165 in the SilverState
still was only 5700 rpm. My biggest problem has been trying to make
my firebird close to this car... not an easy thing as they were at
one time 700 lbs in weight difference... Bird has been on a diet again
so will see how much I shaved this time

Bob

[WSSix]

Sounds like it's a hell of a motor then. I'd just refresh it and call it good.

[Panteracer]

I went by the engine builders shop on my way home today
He was pulling the last of the pistons. Good news is the bearings were
so good he said he could almost reinstall them. Cylinders are good,
going to send the crank out to double check for cracks and straightness
Rods will be checked but are lightweight La Billit kyrptonite so bomb proof
Pistons are good but dished and I want to kick the compression up from 9.5/1 to 11/1. He is talking to Kasse about another engine and will discuss mine next
regarding the solid roller cam
180 Headers dropped off at Sanderson today... Next to Brizzo's shop

Good news so far. Also going to run an O2 sensor as things were a little rich and giving up some HP

Bob

[Panteracer]

So finally got the motor dropped in yesterday
Had to do some cleanup in the engine bay, etc

I installed some DEI Lava rock vinyl at my chassis brace
area (gold color material in the pic) due to cracking of the
bondo etc that was done around the braces... so instead
of repainting the engine bay will give this a shot.. hopefully
it holds up under the 180 headers.. my buddy has some on
the underside of his fiberglass deck and around his fuel cells
that are really close to the headers

Now to hook up all the misc hoses etc... good thing it was
run and the cam is broken in

Bob

[GregWeld]

Break-in is not required for roller cams..... Just sayin'


Looks good Bob.

[Panteracer]

We decided to stay with a flat tappet... worked for 10 years
on the old engine...

We upped the compression by a point plus, flowed the heads and had George
at Clay Smith spec a new cam after talking to me a bit
Cam is a little less lift but 10 degrees more duration
I wanted a little more on the top end and really could lose a
little on the bottom end-trying not to blow the tires of the thing
Pistons are Racetech lighter units with a light wrist pin
Just honed it .005 and reconditioned the Kryptonight rods,
Polished the crank, new oil pump, rockers and all new exhaust valves
and that was it

We will see if it does what I want
I also fixed the problem I had with the clutch hanging
up.... The shaft that the throw out bearing was riding on
was buggered up and then it would scrape up the throwout
All new pieces and I cut a relieve in the throw out for grease
so it won't happen again

Bob

[WSSix]

That's a gorgeous picture, Bob. Congrats on getting it back in the car. Now, don't be shy. What kind of numbers did the engine make?

[Panteracer]

Trey,

Only run on a Test stand to break in the cam
and make sure there were no issues
Old motor had a twin that dynoed out at 587hp
Mine has a better carb and the 180 exhaust helps
a lot... I was looking for something similar but with
a little more at the top to keep up with those damn
GT3's that just recently started pulling away slightly


Bob

[WSSix]

Ah, ok. I thought it had been dynoed already. Thanks Bob.

[Panteracer]

Pantera engine all installed.. sounds pretty
good but did not drive yet as it was raining.. maybe tonight

Thunder Hill test in three weeks with Checkered Flag Racing

Bob

[WSSix]

No mufflers or resonators? Good luck, Bob!

[Panteracer]

Trey,
The exhaust actually has a 10" glass pack..3" straight thru with a
megaphone on the end.. it used to be 104/105 so I could run Laguna
on their 105 days...
With the compression bump and new cam it is now louder and deeper
so have a set of 18" glass packs... again 3" straight thru showing up today
but will dump into a 4" turn down.. hopefully that will get to 103 db

Going to Road America to run with a few other Panteras at a Shelby Event
this summer and they have a sound limit of 103 db... never have had an
issue at Thunderhill with the 105 exhaust but I do not run with the Shelby
group up there.. they seem to monitor it more..103 requirement

My straight thru exhaust actually hit 109.7 db at a Laguna open exhaust day

Bob

[WSSix]

OK, I see them in the picture now. I was thinking there's no way you didn't have mufflers but I didn't make them out the first time through.

Thanks Bob

[NOT A TA]

Engine bay looks really nice!

[Panteracer]

Posting a picture for Lexus Tech of my
1970 firebird seat tracks

Bob

[WSSix]

Wedge Engineering?

That's who I have in my car holding my Recaros down.

How's the TA coming along, Bob.

[Panteracer]

Trey
Not much work on the Ta lately
Hoping to get back on it soon

Bob

[WSSix]

I know that feeling. I'm slowing making progress on mine. I guess a snail's pace is still faster than nothing. Can't wait to see what you have in store for the car.

[Panteracer]

So I am checking out the cars the other day since
I have not been at the shop for a week or so due to the holidays
and found this Matchbox in my Display case.. one of my buddies
builds Model Airplanes along with doing a bunch of other fabrication

It has my wing, graphics and is sealed in a Matchbox plastic case
I thought it was pretty cool.. some guys have too much time:)

Bob

[Tinker]

Very cool!

[WSSix]

That's really neat, Bob.

[Panteracer]

I finally have been spending some time on the firebird lately
Ridetech rear suspension is complete and I braced things
up. Finally installed the fuel cell, almost done with the
plumbing.. just a little wiring to do and hope to get it
back on the road again and off the Jackstand Racing Team:)

Bob

[WSSix]

I bet you'll beat me at getting the car back on the ground, Bob. Glad you're moving forward again.

[Panteracer]

Finished up my wiring... had to shorten the battery cables
They are 30 year old real braided copper double ott.. not sure
you can but this good stuff any more

Bob

[glassman]

Nice to see it coming together. You coming out to GG in March with this hopefully?

[Panteracer]

Glassman
Yes I finally got it running again
Ordered a new containment seat
today. Might do Crowslanding in early
March to try to dial things in

It will be good to see you again

Bob

[Panteracer]

Installing my new birthday present
I lowered the seating position along with
moving it back for better leg position

Bob

[Panteracer]

So I have been missing the old Muncie
2nd gear so finally pulled the tko 600
and ordered not a M-22 or 23 they are now
making a M-24. Better cooling and gear angles
with a bunch of other goodies including
Gearing with better ratios

Midwest Muncies. Can't wait to see it arrive

Bob

[andrewb70]

So I have been missing the old Muncie
2nd gear so finally pulled the tko 600
and ordered not a M-22 or 23 they are now
making a M-24. Better cooling and gear angles
with a bunch of other goodies including
Gearing with better ratios

Midwest Muncies. Can't wait to see it arrive

Bob

Bob,

Any more info on this trans? Midwest doesn't have it on their website.

Andrew

[Panteracer]

Andrew
Jeff at Midwest did not get it on the website yet
So I have 755 hp and his m-23 is good for 800 hp
I might tweak things later so his m-24 is good for more
It is an ultra case. Sealed bearings both ends better cooling
Dipstick 2 drain plugs and better gear angles
It still has all the good stuff as the m-23 lightened main shaft
Upgraded shift shafts and synchros etc. I am also getting the polished
Gears with ratios of 2.20, 1.50, 1.17 and 1.1 a lot better for
my engine with a .750 roller cam. The Engine did not like the Tko
Gearing at all. Give him a call if you want all the details
I almost bought a reconditioned Jerico but decided not to go that route

[andrewb70]

Back in the Stone age, I had a 2.20 first gear M22 in my GTO. I realize that different engine like different things, but it seems like that gearing is really close. A T56 has a 2.66 first gear typically and a M21 had a 2.48 (as I recall).

Just something to think about.

Andrew

[rustomatic]

Nice seat, Bob! What are you doing for a back brace? When it comes to a Kirkey, the back brace definitely seems to make the seat (that and the cover).

Your trunk space is very CP car now--mine looks pretty similar, with all the extra airflow and whatnot.

I'll have to make a point of getting down to a Crows Landing event this year, if only to watch. It's tough to give a day to an SCCA event where you only drive for like four minutes, but Crows Landing at least seems a bit more on par with the Marina course.

Installing my new birthday present
I lowered the seating position along with
moving it back for better leg position

Bob

[Panteracer]

Seat brace is the one kirky sells for that seat
I did have to make a couple of shims so it would
bolt into the cross bar of of my 5 point setup.. it
was hitting in the middle of the bar so just a little
shimming out with some tube alum

Hope to get it up and running again soon then off
to Crows for a few events
I just need to stop changing things

Would love to see your Falcon/corvette creation:)

Bob

[Flash68]

Andrew
Jeff at Midwest did not get it on the website yet
So I have 755 hp and his m-23 is good for 800 hp
I might tweak things later so his m-24 is good for more
It is an ultra case. Sealed bearings both ends better cooling
Dipstick 2 drain plugs and better gear angles
It still has all the good stuff as the m-23 lightened main shaft
Upgraded shift shafts and synchros etc. I am also getting the polished
Gears with ratios of 2.20, 1.50, 1.17 and 1.1 a lot better for
my engine with a .750 roller cam. The Engine did not like the Tko
Gearing at all. Give him a call if you want all the details
I almost bought a reconditioned Jerico but decided not to go that route

That trans sounds great Bob. Nearly identical to my G Force / Tex T101A ratios. And that 2-3-4 is outstanding for road course duty. :thumbsup:

Good luck with it.

[Panteracer]

Flash
I have been trying to get a ratio close
to my Pantera but we changed the rear gear
many years back and no one remembers. So
I have been playing with the speed calculators
and trying to get close to that combo

Bob

[Panteracer]

The new N-24 trans showed up today
Time to get it installed

Bob

[Panteracer]

Transmission is installed.. made the rear 4 link
uppers easier to adjust so I can get the pinion angle
right

Bob

[Panteracer]

Been driving the Pantera a lot lately
and it finally just turned over 100,000 miles
Not bad for an old car with a lot of new parts
Missed the Zero setting but caught it at 1,000 miles

Bob

[WSSix]

Congrats, Bob! That's fantastic.

[Panteracer]

Finally getting this Transmission thing
done after my Mini Bike racing at Eagle field
and seeing Greggs beast last weekend

Install the exhaust tonight and off for a break-in
on Saturday Morning

Also just ordered up some glass flairs-Motion Iroc type
Took another 14 lbs out of the floor by removing sound
deadener... hope to throw it on the scales this weekend
to see how much weight I have reduced this time around

Bob

[Panteracer]

So I finished up the trans install, tweaked the pinion
angle and the rear end still makes a bunch of gear noise
I think I damaged it with the bad angles before so off
to the rearend shop to see what is going on

Good news is I finally weighed the car after all the
changes made and it was way less than I ever calculated
3019 lbs now... Front to back not the best at 55% vs 45%
but will have to deal with it unless I want to get rid of my
big inch aftermarket Pontiac block

Still have some door bars and door lightening to do so more
weight to shed.. not sure if the cam class is 3000 Lbs with
me in the car or not

Bob

[WSSix]

Nice work, Bob! That's impressive that you were able to get so much weight out of the car.

[carbuff]

Agreed! TOW is about 3550 or so depending on the fluid levels and that is with the LS engine and the fiberglass hood. I do have a carbon front bumper that would drop close to 100# if I could get it installed. And I probably have 100# or more of Dynamat in the car too. Oh well, creature comforts. ;)

[Panteracer]

So got a call from Gearmasters and the 12 bolt
Posi gears look like they had a meltdown. Best news
I have had in a while as I was thinking I could not get
a proper pinion angle with my new 4 link. Learned a lot about a
adjusting and made it easy to do now

So I had that 12 bolt built 30 years back and broke one
Axel, blew up the spider gears and destroyed the piñon bushing
but never replaced the gears. I had to laugh as the guy said it looks
Like it wasn't broken in properly. Break in really !!!...the car started lfe with
me autocrossing the hell out of it. Not sure if I should listen to him
about break in as this one will never last as long

[Panteracer]

Picked the car up from Gearmasters
and he gave me the old Gear set
I guess 30 odd years finally took a toll
This is the worse gear another one is
almost the same with a few others chipped

Hopefully I can now Race this thing at Crows

Bob

[Panteracer]

Filled the bumper recess with
1/16" ABS and a little Aluminum
Saving weight

Bob

[Panteracer]

Fixed the broken rear spoiler extension and
installed the Dreamin Ta's decal that my wife and her
friend made up for me two years back
Finished the new harness belts Car is almost
ready for Crow's this weekend

Bob

[jarhead]

don't know how I've missed this for 4 years.

Great looking cars Bob! Nice work you've done as well!

[SSLance]

Have fun out there Bob...not sure how you can not with that car on a course like should be up there.

[rustomatic]

Hey Bob,

I just wanted to say sorry for leaving you hanging for the course work on Saturday. It honestly didn't even occur to me until I'd left the base--the sun took away some brain cells, plus I had the whole birthday excuse . . .

Hope it was not too much torture--it was a decent day of autocross, even with an automatic. It was great cookin' in the sun with you and Ron and the romance of race gas exhaust.

The whole course work thing is definitely a mark in favor of the track day . . .:bang:

[Panteracer]

Paul
It was great hanging with you Paul
Great seeing your creation
The work group at the end of the day was brutal
Very hot almost felt like a couple of us got heat stroke
Went back today and 10 degrees cooler. Staring to figure
the car out with all the changes. Driver still needs to get
the rust off. Ride tech four link really hooks up
American Autocross guys really know how to set up a great
Course. Will be going back to Crows Landing in a few weeks
Bob

[rustomatic]

Agreed, Bob, both on the point of getting some driving skills back in shape and how awesome the American Auto-x Series track setup was. Most would not believe the speed levels the fast guys/gals are hitting out there. I definitely plan to get out to another one of their events!

Oh, and all of those kids in Subarus and Toyotas (and super-loud modern Mustangs) really need to see more old American iron. We were a bit of a minority out there, which is of course cool . . .

[c4racer2]

What rear gear ratio are you running Bob?

I am in the SF Bay Area too - south bay. Would like to come join you guys and beef up the quantity of old school muscle out there.

I just finished a refresh on a 71 Camaro I bought last year - all Hotchkis suspension, bilsteins, DSE UCA's, T56, StopTech manual brakes, 520hp 406 carb motor. It's a street car that I plan to do some autox and track events with from time to time. Nothing too serious. I used to do that - ran a 3rd gen in FS and ESP with SCCA 15-20 years ago, then got into HPDE and ended up racing in the NASA CMC class for a few years. Gave all that up 10 years ago to put the kids through schooling.

Would love to get together some time to chat about cars and events where we can have some fun with them here in northern CA.

https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/48020653962_3eba8d70d9_b.jpg

[Panteracer]

Would love to have you join us... very nice car you have
I am just getting back into autocrossing regularly myself
as been tracking my Pantera for many years

My car has a 4:11 rear gear... Muncie 4 speed now with
a 2:20 first and 1:70 second... lets the horsepower work
better... I am very happy I changed the transmission
... ran this car hard 25-30 years back

I will be at Cars N Coffee this Saturday at Starbucks
1815 hillsdale ave.... near target... then heading
to my shop in Campbell close by... we are dropping
in an engine in my buddies mustang... you can tag along
if you want to see our Cave

Come by and we can meet
Also doing Crows Landing again July 27,28th
American Autocross Series

Bob

[c4racer2]

Would love to have you join us... very nice car you have
I am just getting back into autocrossing regularly myself
as been tracking my Pantera for many years

My car has a 4:11 rear gear... Muncie 4 speed now with
a 2:20 first and 1:70 second... lets the horsepower work
better... I am very happy I changed the transmission
... ran this car hard 25-30 years back

I will be at Cars N Coffee this Saturday at Starbucks
1815 hillsdale ave.... near target... then heading
to my shop in Campbell close by... we are dropping
in an engine in my buddies mustang... you can tag along
if you want to see our Cave

Come by and we can meet
Also doing Crows Landing again July 27,28th
American Autocross Series

Bob

Cool. I was strongly considering 3.89 - my ratios are 2.66/1.78/1.34/1 so almost identical to your set-up in 2-3-4 anyway.

Sure this Sat AM looks good for me - pretty much in my back yard too - I am in SJ.

what time? I'll bring the 71

If you guys are out on the town Friday night, my band is playing a Number One Broadway in downtown Los Gatos. Classic rock band. I play keyboards

- Scott

[Panteracer]

Cars n coffee starts at 7am but I usually don't
The get there until around 7:45. Usually goes to
10-11am

Will check our calendar for Friday
I do live in Los Gatos

Bob

[c4racer2]

Cars n coffee starts at 7am but I usually don't
The get there until around 7:45. Usually goes to
10-11am

Will check our calendar for Friday
I do live in Los Gatos

Bob

Cool. Normally I'm an early riser even on the weekends, but after that gig I get home maybe 2:30AM! I'll probably still be up by 8. I will need copious amounts of coffee - good call holding this in a location that can help with that!

9:30PM start time at #1 btw. It's a great venue and great crowd on a Friday night. We play a lot of fun party tunes everybody remembers from the 70's, 80's and a few from the 90's and current day too.

[c4racer2]

Do you run in CAM-T class btw?

[Panteracer]

Scott,
Yes I ran in Cam T... Still learning the car
and getting the rust off me as really I have not
run for 2 years and then only a few times
Seat time is the best thing.. trying to get some now
and not change the car too much

Bob

[c4racer2]

Scott,
Yes I ran in Cam T... Still learning the car
and getting the rust off me as really I have not
run for 2 years and then only a few times
Seat time is the best thing.. trying to get some now
and not change the car too much

Bob

I have lots of rust. Have't done an autox for 10 years+, and haven't been on a road course for at least 8 years myself. Was racing w/ NASA up until about 10 years ago I think. Maybe longer.

Lots of rust.... Hopefully it's like riding a bike!! :thumbsup:

[chetly]

Bob, if you're on facebook, hopefully you're a member of the AAS page. Alvin Cheng downloaded a lot of pictures from the LPM and got some good pictures of you in the Firebird.

[Panteracer]

Chet
Did not realize they were taking pictures
Thank you so much

Were you there?

Bob

[chetly]

I'm always there. I'm one of the core group that helps setup and tear down the site every event. Currently driving a friends C4 in CAM-S being my C5 is still down being I blew the motor last year.

[rustomatic]

Thanks for the tip, Chet--the pics are great! I was in the weird white Falcon, by the way . . .

I'm always there. I'm one of the core group that helps setup and tear down the site every event. Currently driving a friends C4 in CAM-S being my C5 is still down being I blew the motor last year.

[chetly]

Thanks for the tip, Chet--the pics are great! I was in the weird white Falcon, by the way . . .

Cool, I saw that falcon. I didn't get a chance to really check anything out. We were running around, setting up practice course and getting ready for the BBQ that night.

Glad to see you guys had fun.

[Panteracer]

So Frank Stagnaro and Jesus were eyeing Rustomatic's
car and talking and admiring the home made flairs.... I introduced
Paul to them and his first comment was they were a
couple of legends.. big smiles came up on both of them
I always like to watch those two guys drive a car and
wonder how the hell they make it look so easy... they are
so smooth like floating on the track.. so many championships
between them

Bob

[WSSix]

Nice action shot, Bob!

[Panteracer]

Guess it has been some time since I have posted
anything about my car... still need to install the valve springs
but someone asked to see a picture of the Last of the Breed
sticker I have on the car... Trans am group had some made
up years back and I bought a couple of sets

Need to get back on the Ta.. been doing a restroom, laundry
room remodel and still working on my old C10

Bob

[Panteracer]

Sorry to say I sold my 1970 Firebird of over 30 years yesterday
Been a great journey and hope the new owner enjoys
it as much as I have over the years.

Working on the new GT-1 Racecar with the Hendricks cup engine
Should be a wild ride.. and of course I still have my trusty
#3 Black Winged Pantera

Bob

[jarhead]

Bob that's a long time to own a car, best of luck in your endeavors!

[WSSix]

I'd had my TA for 21 years when I sold it earlier this year. Felt very weird deciding to sell it, but I made the right choice. I'm sure you'll feel the same way. Good luck, Bob!

[Tinker]

Bob, selling a car after that long is no easy decision. I have owned my Firebird for coming up on 33 years and it is just a part of who I am. (Putting it in words sounds superficial, but it's true) I haven't driven it in 10 years now due to "updates", but I enjoy the thrill of the chase to get it where I want it. Glad I am fortunate enough to not need to sell it, and at the same time not in a position to buy any new toys so to avoid any tough decisions.
Keep enjoying your Pantera and I'll keep tuned in on your GT1 adventure. It sure looks like it's gonna be a blast!

[Panteracer]

So finally found another car to replace my
Firebird... actually a 74 Camaro. Restoration guy
was working on his track car but it has been sitting
for over 10 years.. he put a 70 tail and front end... I talked
him into taking off the front end so I can do a 70 trans am
front end in fiberglass... it has C4 front and rear clip suspension
.. still needs some fab work.. cage started etc Has a title so I will
make it a street legal Race Car... minimum interior... try to keep
it as light as possible

Might take a while as my Race Car engine is almost done
The Journey begins

Bob

[68454RS]

Nice, looking forward to progress pics

[carbuff]

That big hole in the firewall feels quite familiar. When I built the red Camaro way back in 99-02, I started with a car that my father had done the same thing to. Had to cut a patch from another car as well as drill out the whole cowl area on both cars to put it back together.

If you plan an engine setback, then at least the hole is already cut for you. ;)

Good luck with the project!

[Panteracer]

Yes thinking of setting the engine back
I think the vette suspension is out... looking
at several options for a frame or maybe Alson
rear end with the mid chassis bracing and Speed tech
extreme front end

Nascar engine and barely street legal

Bob

[WSSix]

Oh, this sounds awesome. Good luck, Bob. Keep us posted with lots of pictures.

[Panteracer]

So I decided to tweak the Pantera and start racing it again
Back end of the car is twisting so I am having Down bars
added to the rear of the car attaching to the Cage inside
It is a pain as I have to remove the rear window and then
fab a Lexan piece to fit around the new tubes. We decided
to make a plate bolted thru the nice painted wheel well and
tie to the shock below. Attached is the brackets being fabbed
for the shock attachment... tubes will weld to the plate above
and we will also attach to the truss we already have between
the wheel wells... This should brace things up nice

Bob

[Panteracer]

Rear bars are almost complete. Drill a couple of holes
in one bracket and weld it in. Then I need to fit a new
Lexan window around the tubes as they pass thru to the cage

Bob

[Panteracer]

Pantera Slicks showed up. Took them to
my Buddy Juan down the street at his Ferrari shop
and had them mounted up... waiting on the car to
come back from fab guy working on rear window piece

Bob

[WSSix]

Those are meaty!