Calling all pool experts...

[Code510]

Hey all,

I bought a house a few months back with a pool. Never owned a house with a pool before. It's been quite the learning experience. I'm determined to figure it all out by myself instead of paying for a weekly/monthly service.

While my chemicals have been in check, I can't seem to keep the damn thing clean. There's an excessive amount of dirt that settles/builds up on the bottom of it every week. WAY too much.

I don't know the terminology here, so bear with me...but it has the canister filter, with individual filters in there that are radius in shape. It does take the diatomaceous earth. I've taken the filters out, hosed them off, hosed out the canister, put in new DE, everything. But it's still pumping a lot of dirt back into the pool.

For example. This first shot, I turned on the filter, and swept this half of the pool, the shallow end. The filter ran for a few hours after this. I didn't sweep the deep end, as to not disturb that sediment.
http://i157.photobucket.com/albums/t43/Bad66Chevelle454/0DB5EA6F-5225-4DC7-AEA7-FF91E27E477D_zpsnmi1swxh.jpg (http://s157.photobucket.com/user/Bad66Chevelle454/media/0DB5EA6F-5225-4DC7-AEA7-FF91E27E477D_zpsnmi1swxh.jpg.html)

Came back a few hours later, and this is how it looks:
http://i157.photobucket.com/albums/t43/Bad66Chevelle454/B732F2C6-FB4E-4AF5-8356-53638E6BA70E_zpsyvevbgzg.jpg (http://s157.photobucket.com/user/Bad66Chevelle454/media/B732F2C6-FB4E-4AF5-8356-53638E6BA70E_zpsyvevbgzg.jpg.html)


Obviously, something is wrong with my filter. I'll have to take some pictures of that tonight. Anything popping out to anybody what might be wrong? All the wings of the filter looked like they were in great shape, no tears or rips.

Thanks for the help!

[cluxford]

repeat the process but remove the filter, see what happens.

I replace my filter annually. It gets thoroughly hosed out monthly

I also run a vacuum for 2-3 hours in winter and around 4-5 hours in summer

Pool remains spotless.

BTW is it a concrete or fibreglass pool ?

Reason, fibreglass are much much easier to maintain. Chemical balance is more easily retained and also they tend to stain less and have less mould growth.

Having had both and having fibreglass now, I'll never have another concrete pool.

[dhutton]

It looks like your DE grids are worn out. When they wear out the DE can pass through them. At least that is my guess based on your description. Post up a picture of your filter. How are you adding the DE?

Don

[Code510]

repeat the process but remove the filter, see what happens.

I replace my filter annually. It gets thoroughly hosed out monthly

I also run a vacuum for 2-3 hours in winter and around 4-5 hours in summer

Pool remains spotless.

BTW is it a concrete or fibreglass pool ?

Reason, fibreglass are much much easier to maintain. Chemical balance is more easily retained and also they tend to stain less and have less mould growth.

Having had both and having fibreglass now, I'll never have another concrete pool.

It's fiberglass. Not that I have experience, but I have noticed the chemical end of this is cake. The filter is set to run 6 hours each night. Not sure if that's right. I was researching that it needs to run long enough to cycle the water in the pool two times. Is that correct?

It looks like your DE grids are worn out. When they wear out the DE can pass through them. At least that is my guess based on your description. Post up a picture of your filter. How are you adding the DE?

Don

They very well could be. They look like they are in great shape, but who knows how old they are. I'll get some pictures of that tonight or tomorrow. But that would explain too why I'm seeing a lot of DE in the bottom of the pool.

I added the DE into the skimmer, with the filter running. That's what the instructions said to do on the box. Is that correct?

I did notice that the very first time I took the filters out to hose them out, they had a nice, uniform layer of DE. After I did that, I added DE to the skimmer. Fast forward a few weeks or so, the pool wasn't getting cleaned so I popped the lid off the canister. All the DE seemed like it was at the top of the elements, not very uniform.

Thanks again for the help!!

[dhutton]

Do you have an automatic pool cleaner?

Yep, add it to the skimmer slowly.

Don

[Code510]

Do you have an automatic pool cleaner?

Yep, add it to the skimmer slowly.

Don

I don't, but want to invest in one.

Speaking of cleaners and skimmers....how should I have the water flowing? Whoever cleaned/set up the pool before I moved in had it set to 100% skimmer. It's an older style skimmer where you turn the valve to active the main drain. I put it on 100% main drain while experimenting playing with the cleaning, which didn't work. Had it on 50/50 as well.

Does one setting work better than another?

[dhutton]

I don't, but want to invest in one.

Speaking of cleaners and skimmers....how should I have the water flowing? Whoever cleaned/set up the pool before I moved in had it set to 100% skimmer. It's an older style skimmer where you turn the valve to active the main drain. I put it on 100% main drain while experimenting playing with the cleaning, which didn't work. Had it on 50/50 as well.

Does one setting work better than another?

I run 100% skimmer but I have a pool cleaner. Not sure what is best otherwise.

Pools are a giant PITA in my opinion.... :lol:

Don

[Che70velle]

I built my pool 11 years ago. It's a DE filter kidney shaped money sucking second job, that I hate, and if it weren't for my 10 year old son, I'd have filled in with a bunch of old engine blocks and parts along with some top soil, and started me a vegetable garden. I spent 4K this spring on the pond, for needed repairs.
Having vented, and said that, what you have on your pool bottom in that picture is DE powder. What you need to do now is figure out how it's getting through the filter elements, which I'd guess, is through a tear or two in the elements.
I've threatened twenty five times to sell my house because of my stupid pool, which is a really great thing to have, for me, twice maybe three times a year, when in get to actually jump in it and enjoy it. Been in mine twice this year, both times after dark, due to no time to enjoy life anymore. Man I wish I hadn't seen this thread...

[ErikLS2]

I've always wanted to have a pool at home.............until now

[Vegas69]

A couple other things. I had a diaphragm failure in one of my filter housings and it let some of the water return unfiltered. I believe the filters rest on top of it. Without a automatic pool sweeper, it will get dirty fast with any wind. Your pool should be filtering 8 hours a day this time of year.

I'm with these guys. Pools are a money pit. Wife had to have one...:lol:

[GregWeld]

If you have paper pleated filters (probably 4 of them) inside the filter housing -- that's NOT a diatomaceous filter. Clean them all up and DO NOT add any earth.... and your pool will be fine.

[Yelcamino]

I'm with these guys. Pools are a money pit. Wife had to have one...:lol:

Not trying to hijack the thread, but what about a hot tub? Is it just a smaller money pit or worth the hassle? We don't have any kids so a pool isn't needed but the thought of relaxing in a hot tub is enticing.

[Ron in SoCal]

I worked my way through college running a pool company. As others mentioned, you have DE there on the bottom. This again comes from a tear in the crescent shaped filers or one of the filters is not seated correctly in the manifold. Super simple to take apart inspect and replace bad filters or reinstall if there's a seating issue. Make sure you reinstall the filter lid carefully and completely. Those are under pressure and I've seen them blow 50 feet in the air when the band clamp fails. Typically about a quarter to a half inch separation on the band clamp when tightened will do (don't over tighten). Step back after turning the system on and observe the pump/filter getting primed and pressurized.

The skimmer should be at least 50/50, sometimes more when the wind blows to keep the pool clean and water as healthy as it can be. Chlorine sanitizes, filtration keeps the water nice and clear. Skimming breaks the water tension where bacteria builds up and allows the chlorine to do its job. Keep the chemicals balanced via testing, never too much acid (!) and add conditioner once a year which allows the chlorine to do its job and not dissipate right away. Done right, pool water is more bacteria-free than tap water (assuming all the kids in the neighborhood aren't swimming in it, lol).

Oh, and they are a PITA. :bang:

Happy to help via PM if you have any more questions.

[Vortech404]

Love my pool. My wife is the money pit. Lol


John

[Flash68]

Just got a pool quote last week (yeah, I am an idiot).

Was encouraged to use a saline system vs conventional chlorine.

Carry on. :sieg:

[Blake Foster]

We just finished our new house with a small 15 x 25 x 4 ft deep lounging pool it is a "Saltwater" pool with plaster. I have a retractable cover on it ost of the day to keep vermin and KIDS out but here is the think the dirt gets on top of the cover. I vacuum mine probably 3 times a week takes about 15 mins. I have the paper filters and no DE so no issues. the chemicals that is a different deal. I need to buy Muratic acid by the 5 gal to keep the ph down. and am still figuring out the chlorine generator deal, seems to depend on the weather and sunlight. anyway the wife wanted it so she got it now I have to deal with it. lol :drowninga:

[fleetus macmullitz]

Thoughts while reading about those here who are in the process of, or who have gotten 'pushed into a pool'.

:drowninga:

----------------------------------------------------------

Bill Gates decided to hold a contest for the lawyers.

Whoever wins gets to handle all of Microsoft's business. The day of the event, the Gates' estate is swamped with lawyers, all eager for the nod from the richest man in the world. "Gentlemen," Gates starts, "please follow me." He leads them to an enormous swimming pool filled with piranha.

Then he snaps his fingers. With that, a servant opens the door. A cow rushes out and stumbles into the pool. In no time at all, the cow is nothing but bones.

Gates says, "Any man who can swim the length of that pool shall represent me in all my business and personal dealings." Instantly, a lawyer named Carl pitches into the water. Furiously he swims across the pool, hauls himself out and stands there panting." "Bravo!" shouts Gates. "You have proven to me how much you want my business."



"Actually, I want just one thing." Carl gasps. "What's that?" "The name of the sob that pushed me in."


lol


Here's ours. Yeah it's ancient, but it still works good. :)

BcLadzLodvA

[cluxford]

Ours is saltwater, we run the filter for 4 hours a day in winter 8 hours in summer (summer heat plays havoc with chlorine levels). We have a pool cleaner as said and it runs daily

I actually find the pool to be a breeze. Test chemicals every few days when in heavy use, other than that a bit of filter and skimmer box maintenance that takes about 10-15 mins a week

[califconstruct]

Looks like there's something up with your D.E.... unless its not D.E. sand.. then you could have a leak in the lines, of which your getting dirt in the pool.

Do you have any air bubbles that jet out, when you start it up?... or while its running?.. this would be a sign of a leak.

I tend to set people up with Cartridge type filters.. that you don't backwash.. but wash out and replace every other year.

The pool you have there is a San Juan Fiberglass Pools.. depending on size, either a Dallas, Pacific, Phoenix, Vegas or (Colorado - discontinued). (I am/was a San Juan Pool dealer).

Cleaner -- if you have a separate cleaner connection on the wall.. those lines typically are plumbed with 1.5" pvc.. If your running the cleaner.. each cleaner has a suction level of which they work best at. too much.. may not work well, to little.. same thing.

IMO... Its best to run ...or 70 drain/30 skimmer.. ... since debris tends to settle on the bottom.. you'll have more crap down lower.. However. you'll need to move it.. if your cleaner hooks up to the skimmer.. to give your cleaner more suction. - for a say.. 2-3 hour time period... ( which I do with automation).

Art Correa
California Construction Co
Sun Splash Pools and Outdoor Living
831-902-8551 mbl

http://www.sunsplashpool.com

[ironworks]

I really enjoy our pool. Our 10 month old daughter is gonna swim about the time she walks I'm thinking. Our pool is a salt water pool and the lack of Chlorine taste is great. We have some kind of vacuum the goes on the bottom. And a debris filter on the south side at surface level. My pool guy is 60 bucks a month for chemicals and service. I can make more the 15 bucks an hour at the shop on some days. So I would rather pay for his service. And that includes the salt they put in the pool a few times a year.

http://i616.photobucket.com/albums/tt248/ironworksspeed/Backyard%20photos/10154100_674590972593982_1249250391_n.jpg (http://s616.photobucket.com/user/ironworksspeed/media/Backyard%20photos/10154100_674590972593982_1249250391_n.jpg.html)

[GregWeld]

I have both a pool and a hot tub and there are days I use the hot tub twice a day... I wouldn't have a house without one.

The pool is a social magnet and has created a lot of enjoyable days with friends and family as the pool leads to food and drink etc. It's a great gathering place on nice days. If you have to calculate what it's going to cost... then you're just stupid. Things with water in them or around them - are costly. Doesn't matter how much actual use it gets - the pumps run the heater runs - there's chemicals - there's repairs.... People on a budget should not own one. Sorry... not trying to be an ass -- it's just being factual.

I never look at the water or do anything with the hot tub or the pool -- there's services that do this all for you. It should just be part of the drill. 52 weeks a year - weekly service. In the long run -- it's cheaper because they keep the stuff in tip top shape - and the chemical balance is critical. Get it wrong and it eats stuff up... Working on that stuff would take all the fun out of ownership.

[Vegas69]

Sixty bucks a month for that hotel pool. :headscratch: That's a bro deal! I'm paying $150 a month for my pool and separate water fall which is a debris collector. Worth every stinking penny. Includes filter cleaning twice a year.

Hot tubs are less work due to size.

[Blake Foster]

Sixty bucks a month for that hotel pool. :headscratch: That's a bro deal! I'm paying $150 a month for my pool and separate water fall which is a debris collector. Worth every stinking penny. Includes filter cleaning twice a year.

Hot tubs are less work due to size.

I was thinking the same "all inclusive resort pool" . it sure is nice with all them Palm trees.

[ironworks]

I was thinking the same "all inclusive resort pool" . it sure is nice with all them Palm trees.

It's my back yard boys, don't hate me.

With all those trees come a pretty sore back.

[Blake Foster]

It's my back yard boys, don't hate me.

With all those trees come a pretty sore back.

LOL . I hear ya just finished mine.

[SSLance]

My wife has been after me for 14 years to put a pool in our backyard...I'm pointing her towards this thread for further evidence as to why we still don't have one. :D

[OBeer-WAN-Kenobi]

Personally, I have a creek.........

No maintenance.
I can fish in it.
It attracts wildlife that I can shoot/trap and eat (they don't have a nasty chlorine aftertaste either).
It makes free ice all winter long.

[Che70velle]

Personally, I have a creek.........

No maintenance.
I can fish in it.
It attracts wildlife that I can shoot/trap and eat (they don't have a nasty chlorine aftertaste either).
It makes free ice all winter long.

I'll trade ya'...

[Vegas69]

Personally, I have a creek.........

No maintenance.
I can fish in it.
It attracts wildlife that I can shoot/trap and eat (they don't have a nasty chlorine aftertaste either).
It makes free ice all winter long.

Now we're talkin!

[Code510]

Thanks for all the responses. Unfortunately I have had any free time to mess with this pool. Tomorrow is the day though. I'm going to figure out where its leaking from and get it fixed.

With the amount of sand that's in the pool, it has to be a decent sized rip/break/etc. At least that's what I'm telling myself haha.

[Code510]

Well I'm still fighting the good fight lol...

On Friday I took apart the Hayward filter system, washed all the DE off the filters, and inspected everything very carefully. I didn't see any cracks, tears, splits, or anything that would indicate leaking.

With DE, I then ran the filter and vacuumed up the pool. I then backwashed the filters and let the pump run for a few hours. Vacuumed again, backwashed again. I did it for a third time as well.

Pool is pretty clear. I do notice that I'm getting air in the system. My return jets have a constant bubble stream in it. I just looked that up on youtube and am going to try to figure that out, but I'm thinking its the strainer pot lid seal.

Then I can work on figuring out the DE in the pool issue. I still haven't added any DE back into the filter yet.

[GregWeld]

How about this! -- Try looking your filter model # up on line at Hayward.com and see if you're even supposed to using DE....

[Code510]

How about this! -- Try looking your filter model # up on line at Hayward.com and see if you're even supposed to using DE....

Yessir I am. 6 pounds of it...says it right on the filter/housing :)

I was just reading through a few threads on a pool site and they had a couple of suggestions. One is the multi-valve, on the outside of the filter canister might be leaking. I do know that when my pump is running, the drain pipe for backwashing and such does drip a little bit. Also, the filter manifold inside the canister, there's an o-ring that I could replace.

Guess I'll keep messing with it before I admit defeat haha

[GregWeld]

Okay DE it is then!!


I noticed they sold cartridge filters with and without DE... just wanted to make sure nobody got confused and put DE in a non-DE filtration system.

It's mechanical --- eventually you can and will figure it out.

[Code510]

Okay DE it is then!!


I noticed they sold cartridge filters with and without DE... just wanted to make sure nobody got confused and put DE in a non-DE filtration system.

It's mechanical --- eventually you can and will figure it out.

Yup! I'll figure it out...I just don't want to pay $100 bucks every few weeks for somebody to come and clean my pool, when its something I can do myself. Being new to all this, it's been quite the learning curve.

Thanks for the help!

[Code510]

Well....putting the DE in the water problem aside.

Noticed on Tuesday the pump isn't running anymore. The timer works, pool light works, but when you flip the pump on with the timer, the breaker trips.

Not sure what happened there. Unfortunately I'm out of town all weekend, but I'll have pull the pump out and tear into it.

[GregWeld]

Welcome to owning a pool.



It's also why I don't bother touching the thing - service is cheap... and they take care of stuff while I'm somewhere else. Pools need CONSTANT something. Chemicals - pumps - cleaning - heating...

[Che70velle]

Well said GW, they need constant something. The only thing I haven't bought for my pool is DIAPERS!

[Code510]

I finally threw in the towel. I called up a pool guy to come out and figure the thing out. I was out of town all weekend and just don't have a bunch of hours to sit there and figure this thing out.

I'll post up what he finds though. They are supposed to come by today to inspect/diagnose, tomorrow they will let me know what they found.

[SSLance]

My wife has been after me for 14 years to put a pool in our backyard...I'm pointing her towards this thread for further evidence as to why we still don't have one. :D


:stirthepot:

[Code510]

:stirthepot:

haha hey I will say that yes my pool has been work. But I absolutely love it. There's nothing like jumping in after working on a car, or mowing the yard, and being instantly cooled off.

Once I figure it all out I'm sure that it will be less work. I'm just on a learning curve right now.

[Code510]

So apparently the motor is burnt up and that's getting fixed or replaced. There is also a vacuum leak, which I already knew about, and that's getting fixed. Once the pump and everything is fixed, they will focus on why the DE is getting into the pool.

Happy that I have a home warranty. This all sounds expensive and is costing me $65.

I'll post up when they fix it and give me the results.

[Code510]

Mr. Pool Man came out yesterday. He replaced the motor, as mine was toast. Since this was through insurance, it's just a rebuilt one...not a new one. He also replaced all the conduit.

Then he worked on the air leak I had. I guess all my plumbing was done with black sewer pipe, so he replaced a majority of it with correct white PVC pipe.

He ran the system for a bit, and said that he couldn't see any DE blowing into the pool. I'm not sure how he came to that conclusion as the pool is really green, and its a small leak somewhere. Not a big deal, I'll just call him back out next week. It's all covered, so might as well let an expert figure it out.

[GregWeld]

Sewer pipe might have been kind of appropriate for pool ownership!!! LOL



So it's obvious - or not - that you didn't have a separate pool inspection before buying the house?? Having just sold our house - with the pool - there was a separate inspection just for the pool. Since ours was installed correctly and has been maintained professionally since day one - we passed with flying colors.... rather than with colored water!

I agree with you.... the pump and sewer pipe plumbing DID NOT fix the DE leak... but I'm glad you have the luck to have it covered under your policy! That's a stroke of genius right there. I just replaced a pump in the hot tub and it was about $500 with the labor.... and the pool heater replacement was several thousand (our pool is 38,000 gallons).

We're closing on the house September 19th.... I'm keeping my fingers crossed until then! LOL

[Code510]

Sewer pipe might have been kind of appropriate for pool ownership!!! LOL



So it's obvious - or not - that you didn't have a separate pool inspection before buying the house?? Having just sold our house - with the pool - there was a separate inspection just for the pool. Since ours was installed correctly and has been maintained professionally since day one - we passed with flying colors.... rather than with colored water!

I agree with you.... the pump and sewer pipe plumbing DID NOT fix the DE leak... but I'm glad you have the luck to have it covered under your policy! That's a stroke of genius right there. I just replaced a pump in the hot tub and it was about $500 with the labor.... and the pool heater replacement was several thousand (our pool is 38,000 gallons).

We're closing on the house September 19th.... I'm keeping my fingers crossed until then! LOL

I didn't have the pool inspected when we bought the house. I actually inspected the house myself, along with my buddies who are general contractors. The pool pump was running, water was nice and blue, so I didn't really think much about the pool.

Old "Bill" came out last Friday and got everything going. He replaced the motor for the pump and inspected everything else. I ended up running the pump all weekend long, back flushing and putting in new DE every 12 hours or so. This got my water back to clear.

Still getting air in the system and I'm going to bet DE is still getting into the pool as well. Since I already called and complained, I just have to call and complain again so they will come out and fix under the same ticket.

Sounds like we are lucky we have that policy...it's about $500/year. We got it for free when buying the house. We just paid $65 for the service and that was it. I think I got my monies worth lol

[Code510]

Just another update, in case anybody searches this in the future....my multivalve needs to be rebuilt. Pool company has parts on order and will rebuild sometime next week. I'm guessing that's why I'm getting air in my returns and DE in my pool. We will see.

[camcojb]

Ain't it fun owning a pool!! :lol:

[GregWeld]

WELL.... We're waiting.....

[Code510]

WELL.... We're waiting.....

hahaha well I'm still not 100% sure it's fixed. Last week they came out and put in a brand new multivalve, that big valve on the side of the filter.

I will say that there is way less media in the pool than there use to be. But is there an acceptable amount? I cleaned the pool spotless last Saturday, and have been waiting a few days to see how it looks afterwards. I'm still getting a light dusting.