Greg Weld's 65 Mustang fastback track car

[Vegas69]

If you're not first, you're last. :lmao:

Sounds like you have that Mustang and the driver working well...

[Panteracer]

I saw Greg run at laguna last year
and yes he had it running well
He has some time in the car and that
with a well sorted car makes it look easy

He is having fun which is the important thing
I have had days where the car and you click well
When you have car issues it also messes with your driving
Unless you are a real race car driver there will always be
someone faster. That is when you try to follow them and
try and learn something. Real drivers can blow past you
in a bucket of bolts and you wonder what the hell happened

I have been faster than Gt3 porches. Mclarens, Vipers,Z06's
and then some Lola blows by you and you wonder who is driving that thing

Bob-wife has me on jack stands until my new hip heals up

[GregWeld]

If you're not first, you're last. :lmao:

Sounds like you have that Mustang and the driver working well...



Lap times can only be used for COMPARISON for that track that day ---- which is why the only comparison is that NASA time sheet (I linked) for that days times.

I don't really care about lap times per se --- but it's the only way you can see if your car is set up well --- and it's simply a comparison to see if you're awful or just a little bit awful -- or you're back of the pack.

The goal is to just have some fun -- but as Todd infers -- and he's right -- it's more fun if you're somewhat competitive to be at or near the top. When I compare a leaf spring car - with zero aero - against race prepped porsches -- and big aero cars etc -- I think -- Hmmmmmm old yeller is holding her own (thanks to Suttons set up!).

If you toss out UNLIMITED in TT (TTU) -- the times we put down are even more comparable (hard to run against a Norma). I'm happy with that -- and it tells me the adjustment (track bar) helped etc rather than making an adjustment and running harder (fighting the car) and going slower. Other than that -- comparisons for what we do are just useless. Like I've always said about these track days -- I pass some guys -- some guys pass me..... But we ALL want to do our best and have fun at the same time. That's what we did.

If you'd have been in on the conversation with the Porsche driver and his wife (also a driver in a lower group) ---- SHE was so excited that she could tell we were having a blast -- and the driver (Jim) was THRILLED (as I was) that he (and I) could find someone to go on track and dice it up..... not be afraid of the others crappy driving -- but being able to trust each other - and just concentrate on the drive.

There's only been a couple times when I've come off track knowing I just had the time of my life -- one was in the Lotus on the 5 mile Thill -- running with a Porsche GT2 that (the car) won Watkins Glen -- and a buddy (Barrett) in his Panoz.... we went nose to tail for 10 laps -- and we were all exhausted from the buzz and the fun. And running with Rob at Sonoma where my rear tires were just absolute toast -- so I had front grip and the sloppiest rear "EVER"..... I had to drive for everything I was worth.... while my mirror was filled with AO Mustang.... Damn that was fun and it's what makes you want to keep doing this !

[Flash68]

Sounds like you have that Mustang and the driver working well...

Yep. Almost as fast as an aluminum BBC 69 Camaro....

[Vegas69]

Let's not get crazy here...:lol:

[Panteracer]

I have been running my Pantera the last couple
of years with Checkered Flag Less cars and everyone has
to have at least 8 track days before they can run

My viper buddy and I run nose to tail all the time
Sometimes he is faster and other times I am
We push each other and Dice it up all day long
We have a blast

No one gets any trophies just a big smile each time

Bob

[FETorino]

Yep. Almost as fast as an aluminum BBC 69 Camaro....

As fast as a 69 BBC Camaro? That sounds more like a Fox or Miata Pace. Maybe prior to the Sutton mods the car ran that slow

[fleetus macmullitz]

In other cultures whichever man has the most 'speedracers' is declared the winner.

:D

https://s20.postimg.org/tdvux9rml/IMG_6885.jpg (https://postimages.org/)

[Flash68]

I have been running my Pantera the last couple
of years with Checkered Flag Less cars and everyone has
to have at least 8 track days before they can run

My viper buddy and I run nose to tail all the time
Sometimes he is faster and other times I am
We push each other and Dice it up all day long
We have a blast

No one gets any trophies just a big smile each time

Bob

Nailed it.

Don't think I've heard of Checkered Flag, Bob. What tracks they run around here?

[SSLance]

and the driver (Jim) was THRILLED (as I was) that he (and I) could find someone to go on track and dice it up..... not be afraid of the others crappy driving -- but being able to trust each other - and just concentrate on the drive.

There's only been a couple times when I've come off track knowing I just had the time of my life -- one was in the Lotus on the 5 mile Thill -- running with a Porsche GT2 that (the car) won Watkins Glen -- and a buddy (Barrett) in his Panoz.... we went nose to tail for 10 laps -- and we were all exhausted from the buzz and the fun. And running with Rob at Sonoma where my rear tires were just absolute toast -- so I had front grip and the sloppiest rear "EVER"..... I had to drive for everything I was worth.... while my mirror was filled with AO Mustang.... Damn that was fun and it's what makes you want to keep doing this !


I'm only 10 or 12 track days into my young track career and I've only had maybe 3 sessions total where I have been on a track the whole session with someone running similar speeds and a clear track otherwise. I remember almost every turn of those times... SO much fun...

It makes up a bit for those times when you are stuck in traffic the whole session or even when you have a clear track but are running out all by yourself. It's kind of like golf or snow skiing I guess, it's best when you are doing it with others of like skill and experience...whatever level that is.

[Panteracer]

Checkered flag racing was started over 20'years
ago by a group of Pantera racers. They run at thunderhill
Sears and laguna. There is actually a race class where all the
Classes run a race each time they run. Points, championships etc
Viper buddy and I have been asked to move up by we are good just
having fun. We run in A group with open passing everywhere
Group B is point byes at certain areas. Great group of guys with
Safety and fun the main focus. They have only have had one accident
in the last 20 years

Costs are down with smaller groups. Best track events that I have been
Involved with

Bob

[GregWeld]

Checkered flag racing was started over 20'years
ago by a group of Pantera racers. They run at thunderhill
Sears and laguna. There is actually a race class where all the
Classes run a race each time they run. Points, championships etc
Viper buddy and I have been asked to move up by we are good just
having fun. We run in A group with open passing everywhere
Group B is point byes at certain areas. Great group of guys with
Safety and fun the main focus. They have only have had one accident
in the last 20 years

Costs are down with smaller groups. Best track events that I have been
Involved with

Bob




I'll bet we had 6 or 7 wrecks at Sonoma mini Nats this year. Most in turn 7. And I know two of them were totaled late models.

[FETorino]

Checkered flag racing was started over 20'years
ago by a group of Pantera racers. They run at thunderhill
Sears and laguna. There is actually a race class where all the
Classes run a race each time they run. Points, championships etc
Viper buddy and I have been asked to move up by we are good just
having fun. We run in A group with open passing everywhere
Group B is point byes at certain areas. Great group of guys with
Safety and fun the main focus. They have only have had one accident
in the last 20 years

Costs are down with smaller groups. Best track events that I have been
Involved with

Bob

Bob. Is that a membership only group or open to new participants?

I'll bet we had 6 or 7 wrecks at Sonoma mini Nats this year. Most in turn 7. And I know two of them were totaled late models.

None of the wrecks involved Orange cars.

[FETorino]

I'm only 10 or 12 track days into my young track career and I've only had maybe 3 sessions total where I have been on a track the whole session with someone running similar speeds and a clear track otherwise. I remember almost every turn of those times... SO much fun...

It makes up a bit for those times when you are stuck in traffic the whole session or even when you have a clear track but are running out all by yourself. It's kind of like golf or snow skiing I guess, it's best when you are doing it with others of like skill and experience...whatever level that is.

Choosing the right organization to run with is a big deal.

You want an organization that polices its members and keeps people in the right group.

I like running with NASA because their focus is on you preparing yourself for competition. They don't do point by passing. They expect you to hold your line and be aware. If you don't they bump you back down to the lower groups. The end result when you run the upper groups is full course passing as in a race with other predictable drivers.

[GregWeld]

Choosing the right organization to run with is a big deal.

You want an organization that polices its members and keeps people in the right group.

I like running with NASA because their focus is on you preparing yourself for competition. They don't do point by passing. They expect you to hold your line and be aware. If you don't they bump you back down to the lower groups. The end result when you run the upper groups is full course passing as in a race with other predictable drivers.




I would agree with Rob -- I really liked running NASA. They have many groups - so just about any level from beginner to full on racer is welcome.

After each of our Group 4 sessions - it was required to attend a debriefing - took just 3 or 4 minutes - they called people out for doing stuff they shouldn't - asked why you did what you did.... and I watched as they moved two drivers out of 4 and down to 3. They were very serious - and I liked how they did what they did. You felt like the others belonged on track "together"

Funny -- first thing in the drivers meeting - first day - they asked each person they didn't know - to explain to the group (just your group) why you thought you belonged. One guy spouts off that he'd run Lime Rock and VIR and blah blah blah.....

HE spun THREE TIMES - and ran the crows nest - when we weren't running the crows nest we were running the bypass! (DOH!) --- at debrief they called him out and asked why he spun three times. He responded that he was in a rented car and didn't know the track.... That brought swift condemnation and he was told point blank that not only was he sitting out the next session - he was going down a group or two. I wanted to clap.

I know Rob is working towards or on - his Comp license - and after running with this group - I think I will join his effort. With the new car being built - I could run in TTU (it won't be built to run in any other class - so that group is wide open to run anything)..... and I loved their organization and how they handled everything.

[fleetus macmullitz]

Excellent info Greg. :thumbsup:

Thanks for sharing...and caring.

:D

[Panteracer]

Checkered flag racing requires you
to have someone invite you. After you run
there is a survey sent out to all members to
see if the driver was safe, courteous etc
If approved then you can become a member
Then you can earn a race license if you want

Similar to Nasa but in a smaller sense. One of my Pantera
buddies runs with Nasa but in his supercharged very fast Nsx
out of Arizona. He is an instructor, class winner and really likes the group

When I ran in Texas with our Pantera group we combined with Drivers edge on the
Texas World Speedway track. I was not allowed to run at first in the top group
and required to have an instructor for a couple of sessions. At first I was a little pissed but when I went out with the instructor he showed me a few lines I would not have used. Next secession on my own I worked on what I learned
Third session he helped me tune a few areas. With over 50 track days and
multiple years of Autocrossing I found out you can learn something new
every time you run
Next session I was one of the fastest in the group They came to me the next day saying I could move to the top group. Problem was it started raining and never quit. Still a great memory running the big banked track

Bob

[GregWeld]

Checkered flag racing requires you
to have someone invite you. After you run
there is a survey sent out to all members to
see if the driver was safe, courteous etc
If approved then you can become a member
Then you can earn a race license if you want

Similar to Nasa but in a smaller sense. One of my Pantera
buddies runs with Nasa but in his supercharged very fast Nsx
out of Arizona. He is an instructor, class winner and really likes the group

When I ran in Texas with our Pantera group we combined with Drivers edge on the
Texas World Speedway track. I was not allowed to run at first in the top group
and required to have an instructor for a couple of sessions. At first I was a little pissed but when I went out with the instructor he showed me a few lines I would not have used. Next secession on my own I worked on what I learned
Third session he helped me tune a few areas. With over 50 track days and
multiple years of Autocrossing I found out you can learn something new
every time you run
Next session I was one of the fastest in the group They came to me the next day saying I could move to the top group. Problem was it started raining and never quit. Still a great memory running the big banked track

Bob



Funny how that works huh......


After dicing with this Porsche -- I gave him a point by - he didn't take it (was front straight and I pointed him by and LIFTED at the beginning of it) -- next lap -- I WAVED him by.... Why? Because I wanted to follow him for a couple laps -- to see if I was holding him up -- and maybe he was a little bit faster and I could go to school on him. As figured - he could carry a bit more average speed in a couple sections - T2/3/4 - but the edge went to the horsepower whenever it was available....

His wife had gotten a great tip about running the off camber T4 (where I had spun once during a session trying to late brake it over the blind rise in an effort to find a line that worked). She shared it with us and damned if it didn't work! You were immediately rewarded with more speed thru the turn. And it just FELT like you owned the lousy SOB. Made me think about hiring an instructor - now that I have quite a few laps around these tracks (Sonoma and Thunderhill) - to see what I DON'T KNOW! You don't know what you don't know sometimes! LOL

[Panteracer]

I used to run the Pantera in 2nd and 3rd at laguna and
Thunderhill revving the hell out of the car. It was great in the
turns but I later found I could go faster in 3rd and 4th as it was
less motor on the edge so you could go through the turns faster
and more smoothly
I am too comfortable in the car but would love to tweak a few things
to make it faster. I am too set on leaving it alone which I think is
leaving some speed on the table

My big problem has been trying to make my Firebird like my Pantera
It has a long ways to go but I am slowing bringing that car in the right direction

One of my Pantera buddies has been tweaking his wide body car heading for
2500 lbs. I told him I am going to take it to an autocross one day since he just works on it an rarely drives it

I believe seat time, trying different lines and finally changing things on your
car are they keys to going fast. Finally follow someone who is close to your speed and the next time let him follow you. You will both learn something
Bob

[GregWeld]

I try different things all the time -- late apex - late brake - different gears -- sometimes I'm not good enough to recover!

:bang: :bitchslap: <------- Myself

[Sieg]

None of the wrecks involved Orange cars.

https://photos.smugmug.com/photos/i-QtW3dnZ/1/57e8041d/XL/i-QtW3dnZ-XL.jpg

Not the case in 2014 :sieg:

Not enough wing?

[GregWeld]

Not the case in 2014 :sieg:

Not enough wing?


Or talent? LOL

[SSLance]

Choosing the right organization to run with is a big deal.

You want an organization that polices its members and keeps people in the right group.

I like running with NASA because their focus is on you preparing yourself for competition. They don't do point by passing. They expect you to hold your line and be aware. If you don't they bump you back down to the lower groups. The end result when you run the upper groups is full course passing as in a race with other predictable drivers.

My second ever track day weekend was with NASA...and I agree. The debrief is perhaps the most important part. Knowing you'll have to face and own up to your actions on track immediately after makes for a much better session overall.

I was passed up to run group 3 right when I ran out of tires but have never had the chance to run with them again. Hope to rectify that soon...

[GregWeld]

My second ever track day weekend was with NASA...and I agree. The debrief is perhaps the most important part. Knowing you'll have to face and own up to your actions on track immediately after makes for a much better session overall.

I was passed up to run group 3 right when I ran out of tires but have never had the chance to run with them again. Hope to rectify that soon...



Right on Lance! The debrief was awesome.... and there's no way you wanted to be "that guy". I can tell you - I did not feel bad for the triple spinner (spun right in front of me on the first lap!).... That guy couldn't even run the right track layout! Was happy to see him booted.

Will you be in Scottsdale by January??? That's my next trip down for my Mayo roto rooter.

[SSLance]

Yeah, we'll be there then. Moving around the first of Nov. Hopefully we'll have some walls up by then to show you... :D

[FETorino]

https://photos.smugmug.com/photos/i-QtW3dnZ/1/57e8041d/XL/i-QtW3dnZ-XL.jpg

Not the case in 2014 :sieg:

Not enough wing?

Not everyone is qualified to pilot an Orange car. :relax:

[Flash68]

Not everyone is qualified to pilot an Orange car. :relax:

http://i63.tinypic.com/23w45lj.jpg

[rustomatic]

Jeez, I was there that day. Wasn't this in the wall in like the first five minutes of the first session?

Take time, Grasshopper--the non-race is not non-won in the first laps on a wet track . . .

https://photos.smugmug.com/photos/i-QtW3dnZ/1/57e8041d/XL/i-QtW3dnZ-XL.jpg

Not the case in 2014 :sieg:

Not enough wing?

[Ron in SoCal]

Jeez, I was there that day. Wasn't this in the wall in like the first five minutes of the first session?

Take time, Grasshopper--the non-race is not non-won in the first laps on a wet track . . .

Yep, early morning for sure!

[GregWeld]

Yep, early morning for sure!



It's really just a driver talent issue...... they remind everyone at the drivers meetings about "cold track" - "cold tires" - "cold you". About warming up the car - warming up the driver.... getting back in the saddle so to speak. There's no excuses for this kind of driving on a track day.

In the NASA drivers meeting -- Group 4 that Rob and I drove in -- they tell you straight up -- "you spin in this first session -- you're sitting out the next session". That's a warning to TAKE IT EASY and get in to the day without being "that guy".

[Panteracer]

When I went to Texas World Speedway it rained all night
so at the Drivers meeting they said go easy as it was wet in places
and if you go off track it will be an effort to get you out

First session was the instructors and 3 minutes in one of them
buried his car deep in the mud. Then next session our local
Pantera guy runs out of gas on the high bank. What a way to start out

Bob

[GregWeld]

cJ223Yc9ac4

[Flash68]

https://photos.smugmug.com/photos/i-9h8QSK8/0/2c9bf9fa/X3/i-9h8QSK8-X3.png (https://davidgordon.smugmug.com/Misc/n-Pp9jSk/i-9h8QSK8/A)

[Track Junky]

cJ223Yc9ac4

I'm confused. That '70 laid down some solid lap times. From what I gather there were some over heating, and oil leak issues but what's wrong with the body?

[carbuff]

She was still climbing at 7000 rpm. Why'd ya stop the pull? :poke:

[Flash68]

She was still climbing at 7000 rpm. Why'd ya stop the pull? :poke:

cuz he's yeller

[GregWeld]

I'm confused. That '70 laid down some solid lap times. From what I gather there were some over heating, and oil leak issues but what's wrong with the body?





VwPCd1Io3CI

[GregWeld]

She was still climbing at 7000 rpm. Why'd ya stop the pull? :poke:

Last time I checked -- there's no trophies being handed out, or checks cu,t or sponsorship deals being offered --

Who gives a damn about another 3 or 400 rpm.... Car is already faster than all the other stuff on track with me.

[Track Junky]

VwPCd1Io3CI

Huh...Definitely a rush job...

[Tinker]

Gregg,


With respect to you and all others involved in the most recent debacle (myself included...8 mos for springs?),

Let's try to put this past weeks diversion behind us and get back to joking and talking cars.

A while back after wildwood's master cylinder recall, I believe you ended up putting in a 1" master with bp20 pads and you had liked it. Which did you stick with on the car and which do you prefer? Have you noticed any more wear on the rotors with the bp20 vs bp10 with .8750master cylinder? I have a 1" on the car now with bp10's and also have a .875 on the shelf. I haven't run the car yet (will be next year at the soonest) and was wondering if I should change it first or try the 1". I do have the same aero 6p front and 4p superlites on the rear as your car.

[Track Junky]

Gregg,


With respect to you and all others involved in the most recent debacle (myself included...8 mos for springs?),

Let's try to put this past weeks diversion behind us and get back to joking and talking cars.

A while back after wildwood's master cylinder recall, I believe you ended up putting in a 1" master with bp20 pads and you had liked it. Which did you stick with on the car and which do you prefer? Have you noticed any more wear on the rotors with the bp20 vs bp10 with .8750master cylinder? I have a 1" on the car now with bp10's and also have a .875 on the shelf. I haven't run the car yet (will be next year at the soonest) and was wondering if I should change it first or try the 1". I do have the same aero 6p front and 4p superlites on the rear as your car.

BP40's definitely show rotor wear on the Spec 37's but rotors and pads are a wear item especially when road racing.
I can't speak for Greg as I know the '65 was lighter than my car in addition to the difference in pad compound

[GregWeld]

I like the car MUCH better with the way firmer pedal the 1" MC gives.... and while I liked modulating the small diameter MC - the 1" is the right one for this car/brake combo.

I've been thru a couple sets of pads -- no wear showing on the Spec 37 rotors. Car brakes exceptionally well - and has no added cost over initial so I'm happy with that. Sutton does a lot of stuff right and OY is done right and was all him.... so I have to give credit where credit is due.







Gregg,


With respect to you and all others involved in the most recent debacle (myself included...8 mos for springs?),

Let's try to put this past weeks diversion behind us and get back to joking and talking cars.

A while back after wildwood's master cylinder recall, I believe you ended up putting in a 1" master with bp20 pads and you had liked it. Which did you stick with on the car and which do you prefer? Have you noticed any more wear on the rotors with the bp20 vs bp10 with .8750master cylinder? I have a 1" on the car now with bp10's and also have a .875 on the shelf. I haven't run the car yet (will be next year at the soonest) and was wondering if I should change it first or try the 1". I do have the same aero 6p front and 4p superlites on the rear as your car.

[FETorino]

Last time I checked -- there's no trophies being handed out, or checks cu,t or sponsorship deals being offered --

Who gives a damn about another 3 or 400 rpm.... Car is already faster than all the other stuff on track with me.

Hmmm Debatable :popcorn2:

[Track Junky]

Hmmm Debatable :popcorn2:

Makes for a great sales pitch ��

[jarhead]

maybe I missed it? But what MPH are you all doing on these tracks?

I'd probably **** myself...

[GregWeld]

maybe I missed it? But what MPH are you all doing on these tracks?

I'd probably **** myself...



Joe --- Old Yeller with it's 511 RWHP and 4 speed is hitting right at 125/130 down the front straight at Thunderhill..... and I slow to about 85 ish on Turn 1 corner entry -- and exit at maybe 95/100ish....


The NEW Yellow POS Dirty Misled Missile with 700+ HP and big aero -- would be hitting about 160 on the same straight --- and I would "expect" to see mid to high 90's on corner entry and probably 100+ on exit easily...

[WSSix]

Those are really solid power numbers, Greg. Has a nice, fat torque curve too. Enjoy the drive :thumbsup: