LS2 accessory drive help

[rich-allen]

I was talking with Steve Rupp in PM and his box got full so I thought I would try here.

I have a crate LS2 and need the entire front accessory drive. Steve, you mentioned you were running the stock GM brackets. I thought the Alternator was on top of the engine not below? Are you running the GTO drive system?
I looked at Synister and there stuff is wicked but really expensive. I prefer the GM stuff but still don't know which ones to buy.

Thanks for the help,

Rich

[ironworks]

All of the after market systems are gonna stick out a lot further than the stock Gm stuff. The synister is the one that sticks out the furthest. You can get the GM ones from the dealer. I have a new AC compressor that I wound up going another direction on an LS7 if your interested. We decided to make our own system since we were unable to find anything on the market that we liked. The Gm system with all the parts should cost about 2200.

Rodger

[Steve1968LS2]

On an f-body bracket arrangement the alternator sits low and tight. On a vette application it sits high and outside.

You can't mix the two.

Also, with an f-body pulley system you have more of a challenge running an AC compressor.

I like the GM brackets due to their low cost and proven performance. They look pretty good if worked on as well.

DSE, ATS, Billet Specialties, Street&Performance, Turn Key and Sinister all make aftermarket pulley systems of various prices.

It sort of depends and what accesories you want to run. Oh, my PM box is emptier now :)

[Steve1968LS2]

The Gm system with all the parts should cost about 2200.

Rodger

That must be including the PS pump, Alt, AC compressor and everything.. I certainly don't have near that in mine.

An alt bracket (for an f-bod) is around $30.. cheaper used.

[ironworks]

I have bought used ones that were bent. If it is used it must not be in the car for a reason, like an accident. So 2 used ones, one bent and one straight are more money than 1 new straight one. So call me snotty But I like new parts.

The aftermarket systems all depend on what the application is. Sometimes the lower mount alternator will get in the way of the steering shaft. Or the factory AC will not clear the crossmember, or You make the engine to long for the engine compartment. These are just some of the problems we have run into on the different systems out there on the market. Just cuz the product is for sale or you get a good deal does not mean it is not JUNK.

If I'm not mistaken, you need alt, PS, AC, So the bracket system are not the $800 special that everyone thinks. The brackets are not much good without that stuff.

[Steve1968LS2]

I have bought used ones that were bent. If it is used it must not be in the car for a reason, like an accident. So 2 used ones, one bent and one straight are more money than 1 new straight one.

The aftermarket systems all depend on what the application is. Sometimes the lower mount alternator will get in the way of the steering shaft. Or the factory AC will not clear the crossmember, or You make the engine to long for the engine compartment. These are just some of the problems we have run into on the different systems out there on the market. Just cuz the product is for sale or you get a good deal does not mean it is not JUNK.

True.. I guess you just need to be careful where you buy stuff. Had the same issue with "new or used" vette suspension parts. I get great deals on GM brackets at www.smcperformance.com


The low/tight mounting of the f-body alternator caused clearance issues with my steering rack that I have to fix.

There's little chance that an f-body pulley arrangement will make the engine "to long". However it might have other issues with fitment in the space.

[camcojb]

All of the after market systems are gonna stick out a lot further than the stock Gm stuff. The synister is the one that sticks out the furthest. You can get the GM ones from the dealer. I have a new AC compressor that I wound up going another direction on an LS7 if your interested. We decided to make our own system since we were unable to find anything on the market that we liked. The Gm system with all the parts should cost about 2200.

Rodger

EVERY GM system I saw that included a/c stuck out much further than the Synister system. The GTO setup isn't bad, but I didn't want to mod the frame and must have a/c. Not sure what you mean here, unless by sticking out further you mean more towards the radiator. I was looking for something tight, inside the valve covers. This doesn't look stuck out to me:

http://www.camcojb.com/malitude%20093.jpg



Jody

[ironworks]

Your 100% right that the F-body alone will not make a pulley system to long except in a Vette or GTO. But an aftermarket system that bolts another pulley to the front of an Fbody dampener, is gonna be really long. Like almost 7 inches. The billet specialties kit is the shortest on the market except factory. Most everybody has to have that bolt on pulley which is what I'm saying about being too long.

[ironworks]

EVERY GM system I saw that included a/c stuck out much further than the Synister system. The GTO setup isn't bad, but I didn't want to mod the frame and must have a/c. Not sure what you mean here, unless by sticking out further you mean more towards the radiator. I was looking for something tight, inside the valve covers. This doesn't look stuck out to me:

http://www.camcojb.com/malitude%20093.jpg



Jody


Towards the radiator.

[camcojb]

Towards the radiator.

Gotcha. When I think "too far out" I think as viewed from the front, sticking up and out further from the crank centerline. I don't think there's much of an issue with front clearance with these old cars and the LSX engines, at least there isn't on mine.

Jody

[Steve1968LS2]

Your 100% right that the F-body alone will not make a pulley system to long except in a Vette or GTO. But an aftermarket system that bolts another pulley to the front of an Fbody dampener, is gonna be really long. Like almost 7 inches. The billet specialties kit is the shortest on the market except factory. Most everybody has to have that bolt on pulley which is what I'm saying about being too long.

Hmmm.. my fbody pulley system just uses the dapner as the pulley. The AC is the biggest issue using an f-body system but that's not a problem for me. lol

Let's not confuse WIDTH with LENGTH .. The AC issue is one of width.. the extended pulley is one of length..

http://www.z069.us/68/New_LS2/_MG_4019.JPG

Every AFTERMARKET needs a pulley bolted to the dampner. The factory stuff doesn't generally need it.

I think systems like the DSE, Sinister, ATS and such are much better looking. I just like my accesories as low and tight as possible.

[rich-allen]

EVERY GM system I saw that included a/c stuck out much further than the Synister system. The GTO setup isn't bad, but I didn't want to mod the frame and must have a/c. Not sure what you mean here, unless by sticking out further you mean more towards the radiator. I was looking for something tight, inside the valve covers. This doesn't look stuck out to me:

http://www.camcojb.com/malitude%20093.jpg



Jody

Damn that system looks sweet! I called synister this afternoon, the guy told me that the system required you run and F-body water pump and aftermarket dampner.

I forgot to ask if the system was complete including WP and Dampner. I do remeber the price though. $2300.

Did the PS pump & reservoir come from Synister?

[rich-allen]

That must be including the PS pump, Alt, AC compressor and everything.. I certainly don't have near that in mine.

An alt bracket (for an f-bod) is around $30.. cheaper used.

Acually GMPP has a complete kit Part# 19155067 including all the brackets, bolts, AC, PS W/Reservoir, Alt, idler, and all pulleys for $775.00

It's in the new performance catalog and will be availible 6/1/07.
I was going to order it but if I run AC I have to notch my frame and I'm not crazy about that.

[ironworks]

We build all kind of cars Muscle cars, street rods, pick ups, and racecars We have had lots of problems in quite a few cars.

[camcojb]

Damn that system looks sweet! I called synister this afternoon, the guy told me that the system required you run and F-body water pump and aftermarket dampner.

I forgot to ask if the system was complete including WP and Dampner. I do remeber the price though. $2300.

Did the PS pump & reservoir come from Synister?

comes with everything; ATI balancer, water pump, ps pump, etc.

Jody

[Steve1968LS2]

We build all kind of cars Muscle cars, street rods, pick ups, and racecars We have had lots of problems in quite a few cars.

With what?

[pushrod243]

https://secure19.nexternal.com/ats/images/SidewinderLarge.jpg

what about ATS? It looks pretty nice too...

[camcojb]

https://secure19.nexternal.com/ats/images/SidewinderLarge.jpg

what about ATS? It looks pretty nice too...


ATS is great, just not available yet.

Jody

[va72mlibu]

Billet Specialties says that their's works with LS2 but requires "Drivers Side ETC" (electronic throttle body). I'm not aware of GM making one of these, so do you just run the ETC "upside down"?

[camcojb]

Billet Specialties says that their's works with LS2 but requires "Drivers Side ETC" (electronic throttle body). I'm not aware of GM making one of these, so do you just run the ETC "upside down"?


I know that's what Magnacharger does on the 05/6 LS2's, flips the throttle body over.

Jody

[Bowtieracing]

This is intresting. As i have said before i really like the stock Fbody system and Fbody acc bracket can be upgrade to take Sanden ac compressor with VA parts. But i would like to put Fbody brackets on LS7. What needs to be done to make that work?

[rich-allen]

I decided to buy the Synister setup since it comes complete. I called Billet Specialties to see what their system had to offer and it was the least complete of all.
It didn't included the dampener, water pump or steering reservoir. It was just as expensive as the Synister product.

Thanks for all the input guys.

Rich

[shanekennedy]

can the alternator be moved w/o moving other accessories. i have 5.3 in 68 camaro & alt. is too tall for hood.

[XcYZ]

I decided to buy the Synister setup since it comes complete. I called Billet Specialties to see what their system had to offer and it was the least complete of all.
It didn't included the dampener, water pump or steering reservoir. It was just as expensive as the Synister product.

Thanks for all the input guys.

Rich

I love my Synister setup. Pics don't do it justice. When you call Mark, be sure to tell him we sent you. :thumbsup:

I need to get some better pics now that I have the balancer hub pressed on.

http://www.lateral-g.net/g69/project/motor/0097.jpg

[rich-allen]

No problem Scott, I talked to Mark yesterday. Nice guy.
I will have everything ordered this morning.


Rich

[rich-allen]

Spoke with Ken and got eveything ordered up :woot:

You guys are a good influence on me :yes:

My next question is in the engine dept.

Rich

[Bowtieracing]

And now back to lowbuck theme...

Was LS7 waterpump longer than LS1 fbody ?

[Steve1968LS2]

And now back to lowbuck theme...

Was LS7 waterpump longer than LS1 fbody ?

My guess is that it's shorter and is more like an LS2 water pump. Nonetheless, you can run an LS1 waterpump on an LS2 so you "should" be able to run one on an LS7.

I also seem to remember that you can run an ls1 waterpump on an LS2/7 pulley arrangement, but you can run an LS2/7 waterpump on an LS1/6 pulley arrangement.

Most of this is because of the size (length) of the bell. It's longer on the LS1 compared to the 2/7.

[Bowtieracing]

Thank you Steve!

So if i got it right; i can run Fbody system on LS7 by changing LS1 style pulley in LS7 waterpump ?

If so i aaam happy!

[rich-allen]

And now back to lowbuck theme...

Was LS7 waterpump longer than LS1 fbody ?

I was considering an LS7 but with the engine costs and everything else I think I priced it right around $20K
I pulled these part numbers from LS1tech. Hope it helps.

LS1/LS6 water pump (now same as LS2) (98-02) (AC-D #251-690) = 89017593 (f. 12458934)

LS2 water pump = 89017457

Looks like their all the same.

[Steve1968LS2]

Thank you Steve!

So if i got it right; i can run Fbody system on LS7 by changing LS1 style pulley in LS7 waterpump ?

If so i aaam happy!

Yes, You would need to swap out the LS7 balancer.

[Bowtieracing]

Yes, You would need to swap out the LS7 balancer.


Well thats not a problem,i want to set the ac as Mark did so i need new one anyway? Well i guess its not so low buck anymore:unibrow: