What suspension w/ DSE Sub frame?

[jcal87]

I have a DSE sub from 2010 and I believe the springs are 450 or so front and 250 rear. My front shock is blown and I am debating getting all new shocks due to age of the current shocks. Shop I am going to recommended going with a custom valved JRI (not the ones straight from DSE) as well as going up to around 800lb spring up front and 450 in rear. He said I could go with single adjustable that would be around 2500 or dual for 5k. To me that sounds a little overkill.

For those of you that use your car for track and everyday driving what are you running?

I should add that this is for an SBC and it has the full DSE bells and whistles front to back

[Flash68]

What is the usage goal for the car?

[jcal87]

What is the usage goal for the car?

In the coming months I plan to add an oil cooler and use it on both track and as a daily driver. However, I beat on it pretty good while daily driving it

[dhutton]

I have a DSE sub from 2010 and I believe the springs are 450 or so front and 250 rear. My front shock is blown and I am debating getting all new shocks due to age of the current shocks. Shop I am going to recommended going with a custom valved JRI (not the ones straight from DSE) as well as going up to around 800lb spring up front and 450 in rear. He said I could go with single adjustable that would be around 2500 or dual for 5k. To me that sounds a little overkill.

For those of you that use your car for track and everyday driving what are you running?

I should add that this is for an SBC and it has the full DSE bells and whistles front to back

Ride will be quite harsh on the street with those spring rates imho. Especially the rear....

If you were happy with the ride I wouldn’t mess with it.

Is this the same shop that rebuilt your SBC?

Don

[jcal87]

Ride will be quite harsh on the street with those spring rates imho. Especially the rear....

If you were happy with the ride I wouldn’t mess with it.

Is this the same shop that rebuilt your SBC?

Don

yes, it is the same shop. They are just about done with it and just finishing up some small details and figuring out the suspension. Car felt more like a boat than a race car when I had it before. then again, the shock was blown so it is hard for me to say either way.

[dontlifttoshift]

That is more spring than I would want for something I was going to drive a lot. It is also more spring than I would want with 275s in the front. The 69 we have with 315/335 is running 650/400 and the tiny 3/4" rear sway bar and it works well. JJ also did the shocks on that car.

Also worth noting, DSE has updated the upper control arms since your subframe was built. There is more caster built into them now.

[dontlifttoshift]

To add on to that, if you trust the shop you are working with, and they have taken the time to know you and understand your goals for the car, then let them do their thing.

If you want more opinions, call JJ at Ultimate and see what he thinks.

[dhutton]

yes, it is the same shop. They are just about done with it and just finishing up some small details and figuring out the suspension. Car felt more like a boat than a race car when I had it before. then again, the shock was blown so it is hard for me to say either way.

I prefer lighter spring rates and heavier sway bar rates on the street. But I am an old man... :lol:

Don

[will69camaro]

That is more spring than I would want for something I was going to drive a lot. It is also more spring than I would want with 275s in the front. The 69 we have with 315/335 is running 650/400 and the tiny 3/4" rear sway bar and it works well. JJ also did the shocks on that car.

Also worth noting, DSE has updated the upper control arms since your subframe was built. There is more caster built into them now.

When did they revise the control arms?

[will69camaro]

For what it's worth, i'd have to dig up what's on the rear of my car, but i know the fronts are 650lb/in. Mine is a 427 LSX block and twin turbo so a LOT of weight on the front. I'd think 800lb/in would be very high for a SBC.

[randy]

I went from my old non adjustable 450lbs to 550 Jr I single and my car handles amazing with that setup. I’m still running the 250lb rear spring. My buddy has a set of non adjustable a laying around that he might sell you for the same subframe and Quadra link. If you want a great ride and handle well just go with the single adjustable 550 and 250 springs. If you want to race it more go with a slightly stiff spring and adjustable with remote canister. Call jri and dse. They are helpful.

Also where are you located?

[jcal87]

I went from my old non adjustable 450lbs to 550 Jr I single and my car handles amazing with that setup. I’m still running the 250lb rear spring. My buddy has a set of non adjustable a laying around that he might sell you for the same subframe and Quadra link. If you want a great ride and handle well just go with the single adjustable 550 and 250 springs. If you want to race it more go with a slightly stiff spring and adjustable with remote canister. Call jri and dse. They are helpful.



Also where are you located?



Well it already has the 450 and 250 in the rear. I called DSE today and they recommended the single adjustable JRI’s that they are putting on there frames now. I am in located in McKinney


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[Musclerodz]

the 450's they were sending with subframes was too soft out of the box. hence the reason you have a blown shock. 550 is plenty and will give a good ride, 250 in the rear is fine as well.

[dhutton]

Curious what shop is recommending those high spring rates. They are pretty hard core.

Don

[572Camaro]

I run 650lbs/in front
And 425lb/in rear

It's a 68 Camaro with a 572BBC so it's nose heavy.
My second set of springs and now springs are perfect for spirited driving!
I autocross the car but don't get crazy
I lean on it pretty hard on the street

[jcal87]

Curious what shop is recommending those high spring rates. They are pretty hard core.

Don

I thought I sent you a DM. Did it not go through?

[dhutton]

I thought I sent you a DM. Did it not go through?

No messages.

Don

[TheJDMan]

I was originally running 550 front and 250 rear springs on Dust Off with my DSE sub and G-Link 4 link rear with AFCO double adjustable shocks all around. I had a problem with the car porpoising at speeds above 110 which the shocks could not control even with maxed out rebound settings. I thought the shocks were the problem but before I did anything I contacted Rod Prouty and after discussing the situation he recommended upping the spring rate to 800 front 300 rear. After installing the new springs I was able to tune out the porpoising without having to max out the current shock settings. I was concerned that street ride quality would suffer but I was pleasantly surprised to find that by using a softer shock setting on the street the ride was surprisingly smooth. Based on my experience I would not hesitate recommending higher rate springs with double adjustable shocks so you can tune for both street and high speed track.



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[Matt@BOS]

I've driven about 30k miles on the street, autocross and track with a full DSE setup and double adjustable JRi shocks under my car with an LS. It weighs about 3500lbs and I've always run between 600-750lb front and 400-500lb rear springs.

With a good set of double adjustable JRis valved by JJ, those spring rates are right in line with what most people with DSE suspension and JRis by JJ are using to autocross these days. 800lb/in is a little bit heavier than normal, but we're also talking about a car with an SBC, and if the shop that spec'd that rate has plenty of experience, I see no reason to go with anything other than their experience.

I can also tell you from my personal experience that the recommended spring and shock combo isn't overly harsh or un-compliant feeling. The front end should ride really, really nicely with the rebound backed out a bit.

Matt

[jcal87]

I've driven about 30k miles on the street, autocross and track with a full DSE setup and double adjustable JRi shocks under my car with an LS. It weighs about 3500lbs and I've always run between 600-750lb front and 400-500lb rear springs.

With a good set of double adjustable JRis valved by JJ, those spring rates are right in line with what most people with DSE suspension and JRis by JJ are using to autocross these days. 800lb/in is a little bit heavier than normal, but we're also talking about a car with an SBC, and if the shop that spec'd that rate has plenty of experience, I see no reason to go with anything other than their experience.

I can also tell you from my personal experience that the recommended spring and shock combo isn't overly harsh or un-compliant feeling. The front end should ride really, really nicely with the rebound backed out a bit.

Matt

Do you think it is worth to go with double versus single adjustable? its double the price so I have been ify about it

[Matt@BOS]

Do you think it is worth to go with double versus single adjustable? its double the price so I have been ify about it

That is a difficult question to answer. It all comes down to what you want to do with the car, and what kind of mindset you have. I'll do my best to explain the differences you're paying for between single and double, and hopefully you can better decide which route is best for you.

Most shocks have a bypass valve, or valves that control the amount of fluid diverted around the shim stack that fluid is forced through, which controls compression and/or rebound. If you close the valve down, more fluid is forced through the shim stack, which stiffens the shock up.

On a JRi, you're typically given several options. The first is a single adjustable shock which has an adjustable bypass valve that can be configured for either compression adjustment, or "bleed" adjustment, which can be thought of as is compression and rebound controlled by one adjustment.

Double adjustable shocks use that same adjustable bypass valve, and add the ability to change the preload on the actual shim stack itself, which gives you a WAY larger range of adjustment than simply using the "bleed" bypass valve.

In other words, a single adjustable JRi is going to work about the same as a single adjustable Ridetech or similar monotube shock, but a double adjustable JRi is going to give you control over the shim stack that you aren't going to get from pretty much any other shock on the market without taking it apart and re-valving it.

We typically spec non adjustable or single adjustable JRis for customers who want a shock with good all around performance, and might drive on track, but aren't worried about being a top competitor, and we normally order double adjustables for the guys who will use the additional range of adjustment dial in their car for the track, and then dial things back out for a more comfortable ride on the street.

If you're someone that likes to tinker and upgrade, and you've bought stuff twice in search of better performance, you might just want to get the doubles now. :G-Dub:

Matt

[jcal87]

That is a difficult question to answer. It all comes down to what you want to do with the car, and what kind of mindset you have. I'll do my best to explain the differences you're paying for between single and double, and hopefully you can better decide which route is best for you.

Most shocks have a bypass valve, or valves that control the amount of fluid diverted around the shim stack that fluid is forced through, which controls compression and/or rebound. If you close the valve down, more fluid is forced through the shim stack, which stiffens the shock up.

On a JRi, you're typically given several options. The first is a single adjustable shock which has an adjustable bypass valve that can be configured for either compression adjustment, or "bleed" adjustment, which can be thought of as is compression and rebound controlled by one adjustment.

Double adjustable shocks use that same adjustable bypass valve, and add the ability to change the preload on the actual shim stack itself, which gives you a WAY larger range of adjustment than simply using the "bleed" bypass valve.

In other words, a single adjustable JRi is going to work about the same as a single adjustable Ridetech or similar monotube shock, but a double adjustable JRi is going to give you control over the shim stack that you aren't going to get from pretty much any other shock on the market without taking it apart and re-valving it.

We typically spec non adjustable or single adjustable JRis for customers who want a shock with good all around performance, and might drive on track, but aren't worried about being a top competitor, and we normally order double adjustables for the guys who will use the additional range of adjustment dial in their car for the track, and then dial things back out for a more comfortable ride on the street.

If you're someone that likes to tinker and upgrade, and you've bought stuff twice in search of better performance, you might just want to get the doubles now. :G-Dub:

Matt

Matt,

Is this something you sell? If so can you price me out?

[Matt@BOS]

Matt,

Is this something you sell? If so can you price me out?

Sure! We're setup with JJ and JRi. I'll get pricing together for you!

[JMitch19]

I will echo what Matt said. I have 650/450's on my 69 Camaro. My car also came with 450's up front. I bought the 650's and moved the 450's to the rear.