Towing

[carkrazy1987]

What determines what towing capacity of a vehicle is?

i currently own a 02 s10 crewcab 4x4, with a tired 4.3. ive towed plenty with it before, with no issues, but i think its time to do a few upgrades.

i will be blowing the truck apart soon, ls swapping it, rebuilding the trans, adding aux coolers for oil and trans. also most likely big brakes, with trailer brake controller. i will be upgrading the rear springs at the same time to a bit heavier duty springs. i currently have a load leveler trailer hitch also.

so i guess the question again is, what says how much i can tow, besides my tow hitch, and owners manual.

in a hypothetical world, would i be able to have a fifth wheel with say a 2 car trailer? or would my truck just buckle under the pressure.

i know i could easily go buy a truck to tow. but i like my big lil truck. i can park anywhere, its comfortable, paid for.

what are your thoughts?

[DBasher]

[QUOTE=carkrazy1987
in a hypothetical world, would i be able to have a fifth wheel with say a 2 car trailer? or would my truck just buckle under the pressure.

what are your thoughts?[/QUOTE]

Hypothetical or not, that’s scary as hell to even think about. I’m wondering if the hypothetical trailer is a converted travel trailer :confused59:
Do the upgrades you want with the lil S-10 and go out and find yourself a 3/4 ton Suburban or truck for 5k to tow with.

[carkrazy1987]

i expect alot of people to say just buy another truck i know that would be the easiest solution.

what i want to know is why/what is stopping my truck from being a capable hauler? wheel base, width, weight, truck too small, frame too weak.

[DBasher]

what i want to know is why/what is stopping my truck from being a capable hauler? wheel base, width, weight, truck too small, frame too weak.

Yes, all of that.

[carkrazy1987]

now not trying to be arrogant or start a fight, just trying to educate myself.

where do these specs or requirements come from. or is it just general consensus that bigger is just better in this case.

obviously a 2 car hauler is a gross exaggeration. i feel that big of a trailer would just drag me around.

i would just like to be educated in the upgrades on my truck so it can be a good capable hauler for when i do pull a trailer.

[DBasher]

When towing, bigger is better. The frame, axles, hubs, bearings, brakes...everything needs to be up to the task. On a 1/2 ton or 1/4 ton everything is smaller, lighter and was never designed or engineered to sustain the loads you’d be asking of them.

I’d stick to, or close to, the manufactures recommendations for the S-10.
:thumbsup:

[JKnight]

Wheelbase, track width, frame strength, axle bearings are all good reasons why the S10 would be a little scary with any significant weight in tow. The brakes, power, wheel/tire Load capacity, etc. can be addressed to match that of a heavier duty pickup, but you’d have to do significantly more to get the suspension links, mounts (including the front) and frame up to the task. The wheelbase issue will always remain, but may not be that much worse than some older platforms.

[JKnight]

With all that in mind, you could probably setup the truck to tow an open 1 car trailer pretty well, maybe even a small enclosed trailer, but I’d avoid the 5th wheel idea, even if for no other reason than the short bed your truck likely has.

[carkrazy1987]

5th wheel was just a pipe dream, i know that would never happen. i pull a open 1 car with it now, and it pulls fine. could use more power and better brakes. my truck is tired and it shows. i did not think for 1 sec a 5th wheel would be an option, i was just being hypothetical.

[Vegas69]

Physics, an S10 is a tiny truck which means it will handle things appropriate sizes. Think of a full size truck and what it tows and a semi, etc.. A 5th wheel could literally push you right off the road.

[Scratch]

Light suspension and poorly balanced bumper hitch will end up with the tail wagging the dog (YouTube towing fails). Your load leveler is effectively doing the same thing a fifth wheel hitch does which is put the load over or in front of the rear axle. The problem with load levelers is they are trying to buckle the hitch/frame behind the axle, so as to say pushing the front of the truck down by using the hitch to lift the rear. Within limits all is fine and the rig drives nicely. To put a number on what a modified truck can safely tow would be hard to do. In my opinion the manufacturer numbers are probably not too overly cautious. Remember every manufacturer spends millions of $$$ on r&d to make the trucks we use do what they are supposed to, deviate from that and it's a crap shoot. (Of course by that logic we shoul all scrap our latg cars and buy c7 vettes, vipers or ford gts)
All that said if you want to maximize your load capacity fifth wheel is best and be very cautious (again towing fails)

[TheJDMan]

I owned a 2003 S-10 ZR-2 and while it was a fun truck to drive around town and off road, it was simply too small and light weight to make a safe tow vehicle. I would never have tried to pull an open deck car trailer with it. It was simply too small. When it comes to a tow vehicle bigger and heavier is better and there is nothing you can do to an S-10 that will make it safe to tow even an open trailer and car! Don't waste your money trying to make it work because it will never be safe. Be smart, do yourself and everyone around you on the road a favor and buy a 3/4 ton truck. Don't be that guy!

[DBasher]

So the other issue with using your S10...insurance. Insurance companies don’t like to pay out on claims (duh). If you’ve altered a vehicle and are involved in an incident, they’ll look at it and most likely deny and kind of coverage for you. Not so bad if you jack knife and wrinkle your bed side, not so good if you hit another vehicle and injuries are involved.

Just sayin :thumbsup::flag2:

[rustomatic]

Magic words: Gross Vehicle Weight. Pull into a truck scale some time and ask why this matters (or use the Google for some quick research). You could be fined for endangering yourself and others . . .

The same logic applies to not framing a house with roofing nails or "welding" steel tubes with rosin-based solder.

[carkrazy1987]

all good information i was looking for. i would never use a fifth wheel on my s10 or an enclosed trailer. ive towed an open car trailer a few times with it, and the truck handles it just fine, minus the slight lack of power. i just cant justify buying another truck to tow the few times i do.

[raustinss]

Does a 5th wheel even fit in the box of a s10? let alone any of the other 3000 things that wouldn't be right with that situation.

[carkrazy1987]

no it wouldnt, and i never intended to ever. it was just a hypothetical question. i know it wouldnt work, i was just more curious about the other aspects that were pointed out.

[Blake Foster]

i think it is amazing how many STUPID things and ways you see people towing stuff on the highway. unbalanced trailers, trailers that are not set at the correct height and all the weigh is on the front axle. but to even think you could tow a 2 car trailer with an S10 has got to be up there.
a 2 car trailer would be 5000 to 7000 lb and then another 7000 ish pounds for 2 cars!
I had a 1500 gmc 2015 with a 5.3 in it and a 24ft enclosed with 1 car that was a total of about 8000 lb the truck was rated to tow 12000. THAT is a total JOKE that truck could hardly tow my trailer i mean if it was windy it was all over the road. and trying to go up hills it was foot on the valve covers 5000 rpm to go 55 mph.
if your think about it just let us all know where and when you will be on the road so we can avoid it
if that was harsh sorry but it is just stupid and dangerous

[Tinker]

i think it is amazing how many STUPID things and ways you see people towing stuff on the highway.

I just have to tell this story. We all probably have them, but someone doing something STUPID, almost cost me a couple friends a couple years ago.
My friends were on a motorcycle ride going down the freeway at 70mph when they came up on a person hauling an old pos trailer full of large rocks. This trailer was so overloaded that he hit a bump and one of the trailers leafsprings broke. The loose piece of leafspring hit the road, bounced up underneath my friends bike, and put a hole in his crankcase. Luckily it did not jam up in a wheel or hit his leg, bit imagine the fun of going 70 mph while spraying your rear wheel with oil!
They got the driver to pull over and he had the balls to try and deny it until my friends showed him his broken leafspring. It all got resolved but I believe someone was watching over him that day, because the were a hundred other ways that have gone, and none were better.
Please people don't just think can I get away with it, use your heads and think about the consequences of your actions.

[raustinss]

It's one thing to overload a vehicle and or trailer that is actually meant to tow/haul heavy loads ... it's a whole new ball game to do it with another that was for all intents and purposes wasnt meant to tow or haul

[carkrazy1987]

ive towed a few cars with my s10, and the loads have been less then 4500lbs with trailer. towing capacity shows at 5500lbs. i dont think i will ever exceed that. i know how my truck handles with that load, so i try and keep it there.

[JKnight]

No matter what vehicle I’ve towed with, even my 06 F350 Dually, I’ve always felt that the braking could always be better. Whether the solution is better trailer brakes, better service brakes, or an exhaust brake, I’ve never felt like I couldnt use more braking. That’s where I would focus anytime I’m trying to improve the the towing performance of any platform.

Don’t ya just love the guy that says “ it tows like there’s nothing back there”? I have NEVER had a truck capable enough to feel like a trailer over 2500lbs “isn’t there”, including the aforementioned F350 diesel dually. NEVER! And it always scares me when I hear it.

Ok, maybe Weld’s old sport chassis could feel that way with a 1 car open trailer, but even then...

[Vegas69]

People embellish a little... Forget it, they are a bunch of fricking liars. :lol:

[GregWeld]

Good discussion --- and not much to add.

I'm a guy that wants a truck and trailer combination that is properly balanced. I prefer to have a nice margin of safety. Big brakes -- tow vehicle weight appropriate to the load.... bearings and axles and tires that are overrated for the intended load etc.

To use the words "will it tow my "X" --- yeah --- it might tow it - meaning move it down the road.... but there's so much more to it. Stopping distances -- load rating - GVWR and GCWR..... so.... the vehicles designed gross weight - and the Gross COMBINED weight of both the tow vehicle and loaded trailer...

We're talking spring ratings -- braking capacities - bearing and axle designed load ratings - tire load ratings....

A 2002 GM S-10 has a capacity of 5,500 to 6,000 pounds (probably an optional trailer towing package with load distributing hitch).

SO an average open steel car trailer weighs about 1,800 pounds -- add a 3,400 car -- and you're right at your MAXIMUM..... now --- find your GCWR.... you need to know that number and not exceed it.

The GCWR is a function of the torque output of the engine, the capacity and ratios of the transmission, the capacity of the driving axles and tires, the capacity of the radiator, and the ability of the chassis to withstand that powertrain torque.


As you can see --- you'd have to be an engineer and know every spec of all those parts and pieces --- then you'd have to upgrade all those items and somehow manage to prove yourself in court if you ended up there for some reason.

I'd say -- like the others have -- figure out what you want to tow -- but something appropriate for the load.

[carkrazy1987]

Sooo.... this is a no then...

[Che70velle]

Sooo.... this is a no then...

That’s an SVO. No problem...

[Zspoiler]

An S-10 is not large enough to tow a car safely. You need at least a 3/4 ton pickup and a 1 ton dually with a big block and or a diesel would be the best of all .Ans gives to you more options of a 5th wheel and or a trailer hitch. I have a CDL for over 20 years and driven in the Marine Corps for 6. And I have too many accidents because of people not having the right vehicle for the job. Because it not you controlling the trailer.Its the trailer controlling you.