Coilover Jack Bolts

[Build-It-Break-it]

I've searched but couldn't find any information on how to set up or select proper jack bolt material (aluminum or steel).

Allstar performance makes jack bolts and for the aluminum jack bolts it states that they're to be used with soft springs and bar. But what's considered a soft spring big bar? When should you switch to a steel jack bolt instead of aluminum?

I've also heard that the jack bolts can't be adjusted with the full weight of the car on the jack bolts and you must raise the car to be able to adjust them? If binding will occur is they're any way to set them up so they won't bind?

I found a company called Bryans racing that also sells jack bolts that they say won't bind under load.

Any info is appreciated. I'm looking to install some on my speed tech torque arm suspension. Maybe Ron Sutton can shed some light on them?

Ahmad

[carbuff]

If you haven't already seen this, check out the pictures in Gerno's thread:

http://www.lateral-g.net/forums/showpost.php4?p=648834&postcount=489

Maybe he can answer some questions for you since he's in the process of installing them...

[Build-It-Break-it]

Thank you Bryan. I couldn't remember everyone's build I saw them in. I know Preston also has them. I pmd Gerno.

[jeds]

Sutton sells weld-in jack bolt kits.

http://shop.ronsuttonracetechnology.com/shopping/productDetails.aspx?i=713586&c=9284

He also sells the individual components.

http://shop.ronsuttonracetechnology.com/shopping/?ic=9284

[Build-It-Break-it]

I've seen those,they're the same allstar performance ones I listed. I'm interested in how to set them up and figure out at what spring rate do you switch from an aluminum jack bolt to a steel jack bolt. Also the torque specs etc. I couldn't find that info anywhere.

[gerno]

A little of the PM I sent to Ahmad and some additional dialog

I went with the Allstar jacking bolt mainly because it seemed to be what Ron was using. I didn't really even think about the need for steel vs alum. I know in Ron's classes he's talked about cars with 1k+ springs and 5-6K sway bars. My assumption is this is what is meant by a heavy spring/bar setup. Or if you were maybe doing offloading you might need the steel. I didn't think my 3600lbs car with a 1300lbs way bar and 500lbs springs would be an issue but now that you bring it up it would be nice to know for sure what they can hold.

I also bought the weld in collars for them as well. I thought about using Antizeize on the collars have a built in grease fitting. I still need to drill a hole thru the 2" DOM I'm using to mount the collar to the hoop so i can add the fitting.

I did talk to Ron about the hoop structure. He said the hoopI built by itself should be enough to hold the weight of the car but highly recommended to integrate bay bars into the structure. When I do the cage I'll be including full bay bars and some additional tube to triangulate them back to the dash bar and also tie them together over the engine. This should help with and lateral forces in the corner.

Overall setup on the car I set the lower shock mount 4.5" from the ball joint centerline for optimum leverage/reaction on the shock. The top hoop was built based on 1-centering on the frame, 2-getting the bolt and shock in line as best as I could, 3-clearance in the middle of the UCA for Caster and camber changes, 4 height of the hoop based on LCA 1" below ride height for extension and jacking bolt in the middle of the adjustment range.

[Ron Sutton]

I've searched but couldn't find any information on how to set up or select proper jack bolt material (aluminum or steel).

Allstar performance makes jack bolts and for the aluminum jack bolts it states that they're to be used with soft springs and bar. But what's considered a soft spring big bar? When should you switch to a steel jack bolt instead of aluminum?

I've also heard that the jack bolts can't be adjusted with the full weight of the car on the jack bolts and you must raise the car to be able to adjust them? If binding will occur is they're any way to set them up so they won't bind?

I found a company called Bryans racing that also sells jack bolts that they say won't bind under load.

Any info is appreciated. I'm looking to install some on my speed tech torque arm suspension. Maybe Ron Sutton can shed some light on them?

Ahmad

Hi Ahmad,

Below I've attached page 21 out of my latest catalog that shows the jack bolt kits I offer. Here are the answers to your questions & other questions I get:
* I only use the aluminum jack bolt for a variety of reasons. The 1-1/8" round stock of 6061 aluminum is more than strong enough to handle any loads generated by modern race cars. If the threads get messed up on the steel jack bolts ... you'll kill the threads in the steel piece welded on your car. If the threads get buggered up on the aluminum jack bolt ... it is dispensable & easily replaced. In the worst case scenario, you can get the aluminum version out much easier than the steel versions.

* Always use some anti-seize on the threads.
* I do not know what you mean by "binding." There is no binding.
* While you can adjust the jack bolt with load on the car, the jack bolts will last longer if you take the most of load off with a jack before adjusting.

* I do not run jam nuts on mine. Some people do & want that extra confidence that the jack bolt won't turn. I've never had one turn. There is too much friction in the threads to turn easily.

* The key to using these is having a steel housing/collar you can weld to the chassis. I had mine made with an angle cut for style & visibility.

* I had laser cut mounts made to attach my collar to 1-3/4" round tubing at just about any angle from 65° to 90°. We use a lot of 85° & 90° mounts in the front. In the rear ... it's 90° minus whatever your shock angle is. So for 20° shock angle, you need 70° mounts.

* I offer them in 6" & 3" length jack bolts. The 6" version is from Allstar. The 3" version I have custom made for me. The 3" fit better in the front engine compartment & offer about 1-3/4" ride height adjustment which is more than plenty. We use 6" versions in the rear space permitting or 3" to be less obtrusive.

* We do use the Allstar shock head mount, but I throw away all their grade 5 hardware crap. My kits come with a chromoly tubular race bolt, aircraft grade nylock half height nut, aircraft washer & special length floating spacers I have made. The hardware we use costs more than the head itself, but I like using the very best.


Page 21 of my catalog below:
My entire Track Warrior catalog can be downloaded as a PDF HERE (http://shop.ronsuttonracetechnology.com/shopping/productDetails.aspx?i=1058349).

[Build-It-Break-it]

Hi Ron,thank you for that post. It cleared up a lot. The binding I'm refereeing to is once the jack bolt is bolted to the billet aluminum cradle (shock head mount) with the single Allen head bolt.

I've heard of there friction between the two causing binding. I also tried to look up the torque for the Allen head bolt but couldn't find any information? I'd also assume no lock tight is to be used on the Allen bolt? Should the two move freely "in your hand" once the Allen bolt is tightened?

I'll have to check my torque arm shock mounts from speed tech torque arm to see what angle they mount them it so I can order the proper laser cut mounts from you.

[Ron Sutton]

Hi Ron,thank you for that post. It cleared up a lot. The binding I'm refereeing to is once the jack bolt is bolted to the billet aluminum cradle (shock head mount) with the single Allen head bolt.

I've heard of there friction between the two causing binding. I also tried to look up the torque for the Allen head bolt but couldn't find any information? I'd also assume no lock tight is to be used on the Allen bolt? Should the two move freely "in your hand" once the Allen bolt is tightened?
Yes.

I'll have to check my torque arm shock mounts from speed tech torque arm to see what angle they mount them it so I can order the proper laser cut mounts from you.

What may not be clear is that we do not lock down the shock head to the jack bolt with the bolt. We use a smidge of blue Loctite on the countersunk allen head bolt & tighten it just far enough so the shock head mount still swivels. Although not required, I typically put a dab of anti-seize in between the end of the jack bolt & the shock head mount. Then it turns easily, even when loaded.


:cheers:

[Build-It-Break-it]

So simple.... Thank you Ron and everyone else who chimed in. :cheers: