Speedtech New First / Second Gen Subframes

[Blake Foster]

SPEEDTECH PERFORMANCE
Monday, March 15, 2015


You may already know Speedtech Performance has acquired the rights and production of the Ironworks CAD designed full chassis for 67-72 C10 Trucks, 55-57 Chevys & 68-72 Chevelles/GM A-Bodies. What you may not know is we also currently have NEW Front Subframe & Suspension packages in the works for 67-69 F-Bodies, 68-74 X-Bodies & 70-81 F-Bodies.

Here is the juicy part. Speedtech Performance contracted Ron Sutton to optimize the front suspension & steering geometry, the way only he can, on all the new Speedtech Performance chassis and front subframes. For the first time, you can bolt in a chassis or front subframe with Ron Sutton Race Technology optimized geometry.

Ron said, “This was a tough project, because we needed to achieve the optimum front dynamic roll center for any suspension strategy the customer wants to run ... and we did it ... it turned out perfect. This combined with the best Ackerman of any available front end, optimum camber gain and minimal jacking effect ... makes these the best handling, steering & driving chassis and subframes available. They are an upgrade from Speedtech’s current product offerings and frankly any full chassis or front subframe in the Pro Touring market today.”

The front suspension is based around the NEXT Generation of the ATS Forged 7075 Aluminum Spindle design that now makes it possible to have what Ron calls, “The best possible multi use suspension package available.” Ron stated the Next-Gen ATS spindle in its new configuration offers “Better geometry than any Corvette or Corvette copy spindle.”

Some of the many technical advantages of the new ATS Spindle & Speedtech Chassis/Subframe Geometry:

• Reduced KPI/SAI angle
• Requires less caster to achieve optimum full tire contact patch
• Significantly less scrub radius for improved grip in tight turns
• HD C7 hubs & bearings standard
• Improved design steering arm with max Ackerman
• Optimum rack & pinion location
• Amazing 95% Ackerman achieves optimum tire slip angle, significantly increasing front tire grip
• Virtually Zero Bump Steer (.005”)
• Up to 30 degree turn angle (tire size dependant)
• Roll center achieves optimum dynamic location for low, mid & high travel suspension strategies
• Increased shock length allowing higher suspension travel
• Excellent .76 motion ratio for improved shock response & control
• 3-Piece splined Speedway Engineering sway bar standard – Wide range of rates available
• Excellent for Autocross, Road Course and Street Driving

The other exciting part is that we have arranged for Ron Sutton to provide our competitive clients custom Autocross/Track Day suspension combinations & tuning support on an individualized basis (for a small flat fee) for the full line of full chassis & front subframes. Ron Sutton Race Technology is an authorized dealer for the entire Speedtech product line.

We are REALLY excited about this game changing chassis and front subframe/suspension line and although it is a couple months from being ready to ship we just felt we should let you know. We are taking pre-orders through Speedtech Performance and Ron Sutton Race Technology starting March 15th. Once the chassis & subframes are in production, they will be available through all Speedtech dealers. Stay tuned for pricing and other options.


Contact Speedtech Performance at:
Phone: (435) 628-4300
Shop: 3884 S. River Road, Bldg. A, St. George, Utah 84790
Email: [email protected]
Website: SpeedtechPerformance.com

Contact Ron Sutton Race Technology at:
Phone: (916) 834-8051
Email: [email protected]
Website: RonSuttonRaceTechnology.com

[Rick D]

Very cool Blake!! Sounds like a winning combination SpeedTech and Ron Sutton!!

Any idea on price for a 2nd gen sub frame?? Or if you need a test dummy?? :peepwall:

[DBasher]

Smart move!
:clap: :clap: :clap:

[68LS1]

Sounds exciting Blake

Will your sub frames be designed to clear a low mount a/c compressor for a LS engine? This item would be a decision maker for me.

Any plan to have 1st gen Camaro available as Right Hand Drive?

[Track Junky]

Great news Blake. SpeedTech and Ron Sutton Race Technology will make a great team!! :thumbsup:

[Ron Sutton]

Hey Guys! Thanks for the kind words.

This was a fun project for me & the results turned out excellent. The first goal was make it perform mean on the track with no side effects on the street. This was one of the easier goals. In addition to the new geometry providing full tire contact patch for performance handling when autocrossing or tracking the vehicle, the higher 7.0° caster & low static camber actually makes the street manners tamer & the tire wear less. Frankly, this new package is safer on the street if you need to make evasive maneuvers.

The upper control arms are slugged with precision, laser etched slugs marked 7°, 8° & 9° ... allowing you to make easy, simple & confident caster changes if desired.

The tough goal ... which no other factory or aftermarket front subframe or full chassis I have measurements on achieves ... is putting the dynamic roll center in the optimum spot for all of the common suspension strategies. The new Speedtech chassis & front subframes have an excellent 3" static roll center at ride height & achieves the optimum roll center with any of the three common suspension strategies.
#1 For conventional suspension set-ups with low front end travel during dive (1" ±) & higher roll angle during cornering (3° ±) ... the dynamic roll center is an optimum 2".

#2 For modern suspension set-ups with high front end travel during dive (3" ±) & lower roll angle during cornering (1° ±) ... the dynamic roll center is an optimum 0".

#3 For suspension set-ups with moderate front end travel during dive (2" ±) & moderate roll angle (2° ±) ... the dynamic roll center is an optimum 1".

This required a change to the ATS spindle & Speedtech stepped up and got'er done. This "Next Gen ATS" spindle & new framework allowed me to achieve the optimum roll centers, camber gain, caster gain ... with low angle upper control arms for reduced "jacking effect". That means the car runs flatter than other set-ups with the same spring & sway bar rates. :)

The bump steer for typical travel ranges is practically zero (.005"). For serious competitors, Speedtech performance is offering a bump steer kit, making it easy to add some "bump out" to fine tune the slip angle of the inside tire ... to the optimum degree for the tires you choose to run. All the serious competitors know the BFG Rival & Falken RT615 have different sidewall construction, and therefore different slip angles provide maximum grip. In years to come, other tires will be introduced that vary from these. All these new Speedtech chassis & front subframes will need for maximum grip is a little bump steer fine tuning.

I use the term "fine tuning" for a very key reason. We worked at this & worked at this. And by we, I mean Speedtech & I both worked to make this happen. We achieved 100% Ackerman ... with a rack & pinion. At this point all the other chassis designers jaws just dropped, because that is challenging to achieve with any steering system & extremely challenging with a R&P.

What that means to the car owner is:
* Absolute better grip from the inside front tire
* Increased total front grip
* Higher corner speed capability for autocross & track days
* Closer side to side tire temps
* Improved tire wear
* Better street manners
* No squealing from inside tire on tight parking lot turns

I know Speedtech said 95% Ackerman in their original posting. They are being conservative & legally correct. If a person runs no toe-out, it has 95% Ackerman. But the suggested set-up (by me) is 1/16" toe out on each side (1/8" total toe out) ... which makes the Ackerman 100% when turned. The 100% Ackerman & zero bump steer required a new design steering arm. Again, Speedtech showed their commitment to making this the best package & created new steering arms to go with their new ATS spindles. The standard package runs a traditional tapered tie rod end. The optional "bump steer kit" allows owners to fine tune their bump steer for optimum front tire grip & turn in responsiveness.

Other key features are:
* The lower 7.45° KPI
* Low scrub radius (exact amount depends on wheels)
* Longer front shock mounting for higher travel capacity
* Higher .76 motion ratio
* 3-Piece splined Speedway Engineering sway bar standard

The higher motion ratio doesn't provide a performance gain as far as springs are concerned. You end up ordering softer spring rates to get to the same target wheel rate, so there is no performance gain there. The grip gain is because the shocks respond quicker with a higher motion ratio. This provides more control of the tire & wheel ... keeping it in contact with the road/track surface better ... providing more grip. This is not a "theory." This provides a measurable increase in grip. A .76 motion ratio provides over 50% better response time than the typical .50 motion ratio in most production cars. How much more grip this provides is track surface dependent. If the track surface is glass smooth, there could be zero gain in grip. If the track is typical with small rolling undulations, the grip increase can be in the 10-30% range. If the track is rough ... or portions of the track are rough ... in those areas the grip difference is huge because the shock & suspension are responding quicker ... keeping the tire contact patch on the track more.

Love the 3-piece splined bar. Kudos for Speedtech using the top supplier in the industry, Speedway Engineering ... and it's standard. Now you can choose whatever size bar & rates you desire ... and change it quickly (and inexpensively) if you want a different rate.

In my experience, this is the best suspension & steering geometry available today in full chassis and front subframes.


:trophy-1302:

[Mizzouri]

What is the largest wheel I can run without cutting on the fender? I'm not concerned about modifying the inner.

[1965_SS]

Will you be making a 64-67 Chevelle chassis?

[ironworks]

Sounds exciting Blake

Will your sub frames be designed to clear a low mount a/c compressor for a LS engine? This item would be a decision maker for me.

Any plan to have 1st gen Camaro available as Right Hand Drive?

Yes it will. And can.

[68LS1]

Yes it will. And can.

Sounds like I have some decision making to do shortly :confused18:

[MoparCar]

Is this also available in your universal weld in clip?

[Build-It-Break-it]

We are REALLY excited about this game changing chassis and front subframe/suspension line and although it is a couple months from being ready to ship we just felt we should let you know. We are taking pre-orders through Speedtech Performance and Ron Sutton Race Technology starting March 15th.

Were you guys going to post up pictures of the new frame design and details for the pre order today? I'm sure you have one built already:gitrdun:

[Ron Sutton]

Is this also available in your universal weld in clip?

Howdy!

I don't offer a universal weld in clip. I think you may be thinking about my Track-Star & AutoX-Star front frame & suspensions ... but they're not universal. Each one is custom designed by me for the client's car application.

I custom design:
* Overall Frame Length
* Overall Frame Width
* Frame Rail Width
* Frame Rail Height
* Track Width
* Tire Size (Width & Diameter)
* Ride Height
* Car Rake Angle
* Engine Height & Set back
* Upper Control Arm Length, Shape & Offset
* Lower Control Arms Length, Shape & Offset
* Spindle Heights
* Suspension Travel
* Roll Angle
* Upper Shock Mount Heights
* Shock Mounting Point, Angle & Motion Ratio
* Geometry for Primary Use
* Spring & Sway Bar Rates
* Suspension & Geometry Set-ups for Different Uses/Tracks

The reason I don't offer a universal version, is because there are always performance compromises when you make one version ... or even a few versions ... to fit all applications. When I custom design each one for the application, there are no performance compromises, because everything ... and I literally mean everything ... is tailored to that car & application. This is one reason they are so much more expensive than mass produced front frame & suspension packages. The other reason is every part on it was chosen, designed & built for ultimate track performance. I didn't design them to hit a price point. I designed them to be the absolute track killers.

The Track-Star ($10,200) & AutoX-Star ($8,200) front frame & suspensions are really cutting edge Trans Am/GT true race car front suspension designs, except with no rules holding me back. Because of the grip, tire loading & G-forces they see ... they need to be installed in a rigid chassis with full frame & cage structure to my specs. For this reason, I do not offer them (nor do I plan to) for bolt in applications, nor daily street drivers. I see my Track-Star & AutoX-Star front frame & suspensions as a fit for a very small audience of dedicated Autocross, Track Cars, Race Cars with no front end rules & hard core PT/G-Machine cars competing in "street car" competitions.

Separate from these ... I really wanted to develop a high performing street package that had great steering geometry (most range from ok to horrible), optimum dynamic roll centers & suspension geometry that optimized the grip of both front tires.

This package would also need to:
* Bolt in as a full chassis or front subframe
* Use heavy duty suspension components that could withstand street driving
* Allow for all street accessories
* Not require the engine to be shoved back under the firewall
* Be affordable

So when Speedtech approached me about doing the geometry on the new full chassis designs they were acquiring from Roger at Ironworks ... I was smiling. :)
Not only did they give me free range to design them optimum, they went out of their way to redesign anything I needed to achieve that goal, including the spindle, rack, rack location, steering arm, suspension mounts, etc, etc.

After the geometry turned out so well on the three full chassis designs (each one was tailored to the application) ... we added the front frame & suspensions for first & second generation F-bodies. For all these reasons, the new cutting edge, bolt-in street/autox/track front frame & suspension packages won't be cheap either. But they will handle excellent, have great street manners & outperform other designs at the track.


:trophy-1302:

[Gambit]

Sounds like I have some decision making to do shortly :confused18:

I'm thinking the same mate

[Blake Foster]

What is the largest wheel I can run without cutting on the fender? I'm not concerned about modifying the inner.

it will be a 315 on a first gen camaro

[Blake Foster]

Is this also available in your universal weld in clip?

YES we will have a version of a universal Clip some time this year.
but as Ron said above there will be some compromises that will need to be made.

[BOWLER]

Any updates on pricing and release dates?
What shocks will it include?

[Build-It-Break-it]

It's top secret :secret:

[Ron Sutton]

New Speedtech Front Subframe & Suspension Package
New Cutting Edge Design Includes:

Strong Box type laser cut and jig welded construction - reduced weight over factory subframe.
Special subframe width & shape allowing 315 front tires.
Factory alignment holes offer ease of aligning frame to body and bumpers.
Mounting hardware, instructions, and custom alignment specs.
Ron Sutton Race Technology geometry built-in.
Upper control arms feature additional caster adjustability.
Speedtech high clearance upper & lower tubular control arms
Control arms powder coated gloss black and fully assembled with Delrin bushings.
3-piece Speedway Engineering sway bar – Wide choice of rates.
Unisteer power rack & pinion steering.
Next-Gen ATS 7075 Forged Aluminum Spindles.
ATS high-Ackerman steering arms for ATS spindles.
C7 heavy duty bearings & hubs.
Increased header and exhaust clearance.
Motor stands accept small block engines with OEM style mounts.
Accepts LSX engines with Speedtech fabricated oil pan and motor mounts.
Adjustable engine frame stands allows 3/4" fore & aft range.
Fully adjustable rear cross member fits all GM transmissions as well as T-56 and TKO.
Built-in tow/tie down hooks eliminate strapping around painted frames.
Comes bare. Powder coat options available.


From Speedtech Performance, the base package includes:
Viking double adjustable twin tube coil-over shocks, including delrin thrust washers & adjusting wrench.
Viking coil-over springs – Wide choice of rates.
Base Price for complete subframe & suspension is $6899 + $200 crating fee


From Ron Sutton Race Technology, the base package includes:
Ridetech single adjustable mono-tube gas coil-over shocks, including delrin thrust washers & adjusting wrench.
Hypercoil coil-over springs – Wide choice of rates.
Base Price is $7099 + $200 crating fee



OPTIONS:
• Powder Coat Subframe – Flat Black
• Powder Coat Subframe – Semi-Gloss Black
• Powder Coat Subframe – Gloss Black
• Powder Coat Subframe – Gun Metal Grey
• Powder Coat Subframe – Silver
• Billet Aluminum Body Mount Set
• Engine Bay Round Tube Chassis Down Bar Supports
• Double Joint Steering Shaft Kit
• GM Steering Column Adapter .
• LSx Engine Adapter Plates
• Speedtech 1 3/4" LSx Headers, Mill Finish
• Speedtech LSx 1 3/4" Headers, Show Polished Finish
• Speedtech 2" LSx Headers, Mill finish
• Ron Sutton Tailored Suspension Tech Service #40STP
• Ron Sutton Tailored Brake Tech Service #29
• Ridetech Digressive Triple Adj Shocks w/AutoX-Star Valving
• JRI Digressive Triple Adj Shocks w/AutoX-Star Valving or Track-Star Valving

We have a growing list of orders & expect the first ones to be ready to ship in May.
If you'd like to spec one out for your car project, contact either:

Speedtech Performance at:
Phone: (435) 628-4300
Shop: 3884 S. River Road, Bldg. A, St. George, Utah 84790
Email: [email protected]
Website: SpeedtechPerformance.com

Contact Ron Sutton Race Technology at:
Phone: (916) 834-8051
Email: [email protected]
Website: RonSuttonRaceTechnology.com


:cheers:

[Ketzer]

Is the track width (WMS to WMS) the same as a stock sub?





Jeff-

[Ron Sutton]

Is the track width (WMS to WMS) the same as a stock sub?



Jeff-

Hi Jeff,

Correction:

I misspoke earlier about the WMS-to-WMS dimension on the new Speedtech 1st-gen subframe. I did start with a clean sheet of paper to design the geometry, so I didn't think the WMS-to-WMS dimension was the same. But it is. Not intentional to keep them the same. Just worked out that way.

[Twinspool]

So, it's been a while. Updates?

[98ssnova]

So if I have the Grand Touring suspension package will any of this transfer over to the new subframe?

[Build-It-Break-it]

So if I have the Grand Touring suspension package will any of this transfer over to the new subframe?

I think someone asked them before and they said no. Its an all new design and everything is different. I'm still dying to see some pictures of the new subframe. I'm ready to pull the trigger but want to see a completed subframe. :ttiwop:

[Ron Sutton]

You guys are funny. Blake told me if we make an announcement of what is coming & take pre-orders ... guys will expect it to be ready in 2 weeks. He was right. :lol:

I said "naw" (southern accent) "surely they understand building completely new suspensions and frames takes a lot of time & effort." I was wrong. :headspin:

Speedtech is building 6 new designs ... 4 full chassis ... and 2 front clips. The first full chassis for the 68-72 C10 trucks is almost done. Several Truck chassis are already in production. The 1st-gen F-body clip for 67-69 Camaros & Firebirds is in the prototype stage. They're checking fitment, working up headers, checking trans tunnel clearance requirements. We've pre-sold 6 or 7 I think.

I'm glad you guys are interested. We appreciate it. We're not going to post photos until it's done. Cause sure as heck if we post photos before it's done, something will change. Murphy's law you know. :)

[Ron Sutton]

So if I have the Grand Touring suspension package will any of this transfer over to the new subframe?

No, sorry it will not. When Speedtech commissioned me to do this project ... we discussed using some existing parts ... but it would have limited what this new package is capable of. So we agreed to start from a clean sheet of paper and build the best geometry, best steering, highest grip front suspension available to the Pro-Touring community. I even modified the spindle.

Everything is optimum ... from the low scrub radius, ackerman, roll center locations, camber gain, caster capability, caster gain, jacking effect, anti-dive, etc, etc, etc. This thing is spot on. The front end grip will be the best you can bolt on your car. To get better, we'd have to shove your engine back 6-8" under the firewall & build a long arm GT race car front suspension.

But the new Speedtech stuff will drive excellent on the street, have great manners around town, be tough enough for city streets & with the right shocks be a smooth riding cruiser. Until you turn the knobs & adjust the sway bar links. Then it will be a mean handling autocross & road course machine.

:cheers:

[Ron Sutton]

Correction:

I misspoke earlier about the WMS-to-WMS dimension on the new Speedtech 1st-gen subframe. I did start with a clean sheet of paper to design the geometry, so I didn't think the WMS-to-WMS dimension was the same. But it is. Not intentional to keep them the same. Just worked out that way.

[Vince@Meanstreets]

It's always two weeks Ron.


Can't wait to see this thing.

[Rod P]

:ttiwop: :thumbsup: :ttiwop: :ttiwop: :ttiwop: :ttiwop:

[Jr]

Speed tech did post pics of the C10 suspension
http://www.lateral-g.net/forums/showthread.php4?t=47726&page=8

[Blake Foster]

:ttiwop: :thumbsup: :ttiwop: :ttiwop: :ttiwop: :ttiwop:

Yea I KNOW. but you want to see a finished part. you know what prototype and test parts are like............ RIGHT!!!

I will post some C10 Frame pics tomorrow and that will give you some idea.

[Build-It-Break-it]

:popcorn2:

[Blake Foster]

This is the front suspension on the C10. the front cross member will be just about identical. the control arms will change in width to narrow the WMS to the required Camaro width of 60" (plus brake hats) we did this because it makes the suspension work a bit better. So at least you can see roughly what it will look like.

http://i1235.photobucket.com/albums/ff425/killer72nova/C10%20Front%203_zpswja66shc.jpg

The Camaro will probably use a Sweet MFG rack (waiting for a sample to test fit) which will be WAY better than most others available. This will handle 315 front tires in any application and last.
The splined sway bar will be available in multiple rates from 570lb for the street to 1250lb for a big road course.

obviously the sway bar is not installed on this frame yet. Monday.

[Build-It-Break-it]

Holy crap that looks nice. :clap:

[Rod P]

Yea I KNOW. but you want to see a finished part. you know what prototype and test parts are like............ RIGHT!!!


:catfight:





http://i1235.photobucket.com/albums/ff425/killer72nova/C10%20Front%203_zpswja66shc.jpg



:confused59:
DAMN!!!i like that~!!!!


oh man thats looks great! cant wait to drive one, and look it over :warning:

[Vince@Meanstreets]

I see a prototyping adjustable steering arm for ackerman testing. :secret:


I like the Sweet stuff too......now are you doing that so you can more room for the oil pan to drop the engine or ackerman?

[Ron Sutton]

I see a prototyping adjustable steering arm for ackerman testing. :secret:


I like the Sweet stuff too......now are you doing that so you can more room for the oil pan to drop the engine or ackerman?

We're testing to see if the Sweet Box will fit for three reasons, but the motivation is to lower the engine, while maintaining all the excellent geometry we have in it.

[Mizzouri]

if you guys would just work in shifts around the clock then I could get this in my car early June!!! :idea:

[Ketzer]

We're testing to see if the Sweet Box will fit for three reasons, but the motivation is to lower the engine, while maintaining all the excellent geometry we have in it.




So back to a box and away from rack and pinion?

[Ron Sutton]

So back to a box and away from rack and pinion?

It will be a rack & pinion ... just working to make this the best it can possibly be. We'll know next week.

:cheers:

[214Chevy]

[/B] We're not going to post photos until it's done.

As an owner of a C10, I'm just anxious to see pics Ron cuz I know it'll be awesome if your name is attached to it. But, I do understand the theory of it needing to be tested, tested some more and even then...retested. LOL!! A manufacturer most definitely doesn't want to put out a product that's a failure or doesn't work as planned and moreover, me as a customer doesn't want to spend my hard earned money on something that doesn't work as intended. Keep up the good work guys. From what I see so far it looks nice.

[Build-It-Break-it]

Any updates? Did you guys end up going with the sweets steering rack?

[eric1967]

We need some pics. Very interesting.

[Blake Foster]

Any updates? Did you guys end up going with the sweets steering rack?

Yes we will be using the Sweet Rack, cool thing is it can be custom ordered with almost any ratio. we will have it standard at 1.8" per rotation so roughly 2.25 turns lock to lock. plus it is going to allow us to maintain the perfect geometry and lower the engine about 1.5 inches.
The LS engine will still sit about 1" higher than it does in the stock sub frame. (A Big Block will NOT fit so far and I am not going to try very hard to make it fit.) but that actually HELPS some other inherent issues. by raising the engine a bit with the car at ride height the trans output is 1.5" higher than the pinion on a 9" with 335/30/18 tires. this means the drive shaft is running down hill. which makes it easy to set the pinion angle and reduce vibration.
Also we have it set so the bottom of the sub frame rails are a 4" and the rockers are at 4" (with no body mounts), we may need to use oval exhaust tubing to really maximize the clearance. but this is all out performance. I am going to make everything work at this height with no body mounts. if you want to add body mounts then it will make the fitment a bit easier.

We have decided to NOT COMPROMISE on the suspension design. the compromises will come in other areas. like the trans tunnel.

[98ssnova]

Man I cant wait to see this beast. Blake making me want to sell my set I already have..........:G-Dub: :hairpullout:

[Blake Foster]

Man I cant wait to see this beast. Blake making me want to sell my set I already have..........:G-Dub: :hairpullout:

Well then we must be doing our JOB!!.

[98ssnova]

Well then get us some pictures already.....:ttiwop:

[Blake Foster]

Well then get us some pictures already.....:ttiwop:

I would LOVE to, I have some more adjustments to make to the drawings and then I will have one cut to assemble and test fit........... SOON

[98ssnova]

I would LOVE to, I have some more adjustments to make to the drawings and then I will have one cut to assemble and test fit........... SOON
No worries just giving you a hard time.

[Blake Foster]

No worries just giving you a hard time.

Why yes............... Yes you ARE!! :thumbsup:

[Build-It-Break-it]

Just pre ordered my subframe today! I can't wait! :ups:

[Blake Foster]

Thanks Ahmad

[eric1967]

Blake do you have one of the sub frames in a first gen yet?

[Build-It-Break-it]

I forgot to ask you guys when I ordered my subframe but do the control arms come powder coated black standard like your previous subframe?

[Blake Foster]

I forgot to ask you guys when I ordered my subframe but do the control arms come powder coated black standard like your previous subframe?

WE are undecided on that right now. but probably.
The big issue I have with not PC them it that then we really can't assemble them, if you wanted to
PC them you would have to disassemble and reassemble

[Build-It-Break-it]

.
The big issue I have with not PC them it that then we really can't assemble them, if you wanted to
PC them you would have to disassemble and reassemble

Yeah that be a little backwards.

[Blake Foster]

Blake do you have one of the sub frames in a first gen yet?

We will in the next 2 weeks.

[Build-It-Break-it]

Updates? :bump:

[Campbellshotrods]

I was looking at the new exhibitor list for SEMA, and I see Speedtech is now going to be there. So I'm guessing we'll be able to see some of these new products out there in 1.5 months?

[Blake Foster]

I was looking at the new exhibitor list for SEMA, and I see Speedtech is now going to be there. So I'm guessing we'll be able to see some of these new products out there in 1.5 months?

YOU WILL!!

[Ben@SpeedTech]

Hey everyone, your F body just called and said it wants a new heart transplant...

http://i1299.photobucket.com/albums/ag70/SpeedTechPerformance/2ndgen%20pair%20copy_zpsu3zukj3a.jpg

[Blake Foster]

WELL. it has been an interesting road. first sub frame is shipping tomorrow to Roger at Ironworks. production run will start later this week. :gitrdun:

Want to thank all those who have placed orders and been patient. We will have some fully assembled pictures for you late this week.

If driving the C10 (which has all the same geometry is any indication it is going to be a GREAT part. The steering will be the most anticipated part. having the Sweet Race Rack that Ron and I have completely customized and specked out for maximum steering and effort as well as rate. it will be 2 turns lock to lock 5 " of rack travel.
Ron has also come up with a KILLER Ridetech single adjustable double digressive piston/ valve package tailored to the geometry. We will have a set to try on the C10 in a week or so. I think this will be the best combination for a lot of setups.

[Build-It-Break-it]

We will have some fully assembled pictures for you late this week.

:ttiwop:

[Ben@SpeedTech]

More pics...

The 1st Gen Camaro (& 68-74 Nova) and 2nd gen Camaro frames are near identical, big differences are in the trans, bumper and body mount positioning.

1st gen...

http://i1299.photobucket.com/albums/ag70/SpeedTechPerformance/Complete%201st%20gen%20sf%2012%2072_zpslonaqpzl.jp g

2nd gen...

http://i1299.photobucket.com/albums/ag70/SpeedTechPerformance/Complete%202nd%20gen%20sf%2012%2072_zpsziwkmezk.jp g

[gerno]

Ben/Blake,

The subframe looks great and based on discussions I've had with Ron has some awesome features. Looking at the pics I'm curious about one thing. Given the amount of welding to build the frame structure itself, since its not welded or bent tubing, how do you ensure there is no warping and each is perfectly aligned?

I'm of course only an amateur but warpage always kicks my but when welding.

[98ssnova]

Ben/Blake,

The subframe looks great and based on discussions I've had with Ron has some awesome features. Looking at the pics I'm curious about one thing. Given the amount of welding to build the frame structure itself, since its not welded or bent tubing, how do you ensure there is no warping and each is perfectly aligned?

I'm of course only an amateur but warpage always kicks my but when welding.

I would imagine a frame jig of some sorts. There is no way you can make them in a production style that is the only way to have the same every time.

[Mizzouri]

Good to know my new subframe is very close to being in my hands. Having said that, what is the status of the headers?

[Blake Foster]

Ben/Blake,

The subframe looks great and based on discussions I've had with Ron has some awesome features. Looking at the pics I'm curious about one thing. Given the amount of welding to build the frame structure itself, since its not welded or bent tubing, how do you ensure there is no warping and each is perfectly aligned?

I'm of course only an amateur but warpage always kicks my but when welding.

They are welded in a fixture. but the design is also part of it. all the parts are tabbed/ slotted and located to each other. so that is really the key to it.
there is some movement as with ALL welded parts, we have a process for the welding that keeps everything with in spec. the critical locations for the control arms and rack do not move during welding the body mount locations all end up with in a 1/16. when finished. for instance the C10 frame when cross measured over 16 ft was out by 1/8"

[Blake Foster]

Good to know my new subframe is very close to being in my hands. Having said that, what is the status of the headers?

It has been a couple weeks since I spoke to Ultimate but the design work is done and they were building Jigs. I think we need a confirmation from any customers that have frames on order if they want to order headers now and send a po.

[Blake Foster]

It has been a couple weeks since I spoke to Ultimate but the design work is done and they were building Jigs. I think we need a confirmation from any customers that have frames on order if they want to order headers now and send a po.

Header update Ultimate is building a production set this week and will send them to check fitment one more time, then they can begin production.

There are 15 sub frames in production now, all are sold! we are trying to have the all shipped before SEMA.

[Mizzouri]

Thanks for the update Blake! My credit card is standing by for the green light on the headers. :G-Dub:

[Dave95z28]

Header update Ultimate is building a production set this week and will send them to check fitment one more time, then they can begin production.

There are 15 sub frames in production now, all are sold! we are trying to have the all shipped before SEMA.

Will the new headers be exclusive to the new frames or will they work with your previous 1st Gen subframe as well?

[Blake Foster]

Will the new headers be exclusive to the new frames or will they work with your previous 1st Gen subframe as well?

I do not know. I will try them once we get the production set here. there is no reason the shouldn't but we will see.

[Build-It-Break-it]

Do you guys have any pictures of the subframe complete with the motor installed,headers and engine accessories?

Just curious of the space around everything. I know you said it was a tight fit.

[Track Junky]

Blake, you guys try a first gen block mock up yet?

[Blake Foster]

Do you guys have any pictures of the subframe complete with the motor installed,headers and engine accessories?

Just curious of the space around everything. I know you said it was a tight fit.

I do not yet waiting on the production headers to do final pics.

[Blake Foster]

Blake, you guys try a first gen block mock up yet?

We have not, we have concentrated on the LS to start. once the rush is over an we are caught up we will be able to go down that road.

I know the second gen that Roger is building will be getting an LT1 (old style) but he will be building his own headers as I think it will be a turbo deal.
first and second gen headers are not compatible.

I think the SBC will fit just need the time to do it. a BBC WILL NOT FIT, it will sit too high

[Track Junky]

Thanks. One more question. What is measurement from floor to fender lip at optimum ride height?

[Blake Foster]

Thanks. One more question. What is measurement from floor to fender lip at optimum ride height?

DAMN YOU!!.
It has been a while since we had one fully mocked up. If I remember correctly the bottom of the rocker was as about 5" maybe 6.
We started to go down the road of making everything fit with out body mounts to get a really low ride height but is limited front end travel. It made the trans/engine to high in the body. In other words it was a PITA, so after some consideration we decided to raise the body using the standard .800 thick mounts it also helped tire to fender clearance. There are SOOOOO many clearance issues that had to be worked out. A first Gen is still tight on the tire to fender clearance because this thing has so much steering angle. 31-32 deg on the inside tire. That is 6-7 more than Ron puts into his track star front suspension.

[Ron Sutton]

Yup, yup. I only set my Track-Star Front suspensions to have 25* steering radius. The Speedtech has 31*+.

Designing the new Speedtech suspension was challenging, fun & rewarding. We had so many goals ... optimum roll center regardless of travel ... zero bumpsteer ... 100% Ackerman ... optimum camber & caster gain ... 7, 8 & 9* static camber ... up to 3" travel ... fit 315 front tires AND have over 30* steering ... and we hit them all.

Sweet !

[Track Junky]

LOL.Sorry Blake. Had to ask. Rear of my car already sits low (23" to panel lip) so i just needed to know. I imagine the clearance issues up front are mostly due to the inner fender well and thats not an issue on my car. I'm running 295's up front on 17x9.5's with 5.5" back space right now with a stock subframe and rubbing is not an issue unless I want to make a 3 point turn.
Regardless, with a little fabrication work anything is possible.
I wont be ordering anytime soon but it's definitely on the list. :thumbsup:

[1965_SS]

Any updates for doing a 64-67 Chevelle frame?

[Blake Foster]

Any updates for doing a 64-67 Chevelle frame?

NEXT WEEK we will start on the 68-72 frame. I have a 66 here for fit up. but is will probably be later in the year till we can get to it, I have some solid commitments for 567 Chevy and the square body Chevy trucks.
so many models to cover so little time

[Build-It-Break-it]

Can you guys post up some pics of the steering column/shaft fitment, header clearance etc on the first Gen camaro extreme frame.

[Blake Foster]

http://i1235.photobucket.com/albums/ff425/killer72nova/DSC_0072_zpsw9wylgzh.jpg (http://s1235.photobucket.com/user/killer72nova/media/DSC_0072_zpsw9wylgzh.jpg.html)

this should help

[Build-It-Break-it]

Thank you Blake. I shortened my GM steering column and wanted to see if it would work and it will.

How long to the new updated rear upper torque arm cross member is released/pics?

[Blake Foster]

Thank you Blake. I shortened my GM steering column and wanted to see if it would work and it will.

How long to the new updated rear upper torque arm cross member is released/pics?

the new Torque arm cross member is in stock. if you are interested I can sell you the plates to install/retrofit into an existing car.

I will try and find a good pic

[98ssnova]

the new Torque arm cross member is in stock. if you are interested I can sell you the plates to install/retrofit into an existing car.

I will try and find a good pic
Blake can you PM me a price for the (modification kit?) Please. Thanks

[Build-It-Break-it]

Hey Blake, can you PM pricing as well.

If your able to get pics up as well that be great.

I already welded in the original torque arm upper cross member design but want to see if it would be worth the trouble to cut it out to weld in the newer design.

Thanks

[Blake Foster]

http://i1235.photobucket.com/albums/ff425/killer72nova/Brace%2012x9%2072%20005_zpsqffs6byv.jpg (http://s1235.photobucket.com/user/killer72nova/media/Brace%2012x9%2072%20005_zpsqffs6byv.jpg.html)

here you can kind of see how it mounts to the floor.

http://i1235.photobucket.com/albums/ff425/killer72nova/Brace%2012x9%2072%20002_zps0h0wk4cn.jpg (http://s1235.photobucket.com/user/killer72nova/media/Brace%2012x9%2072%20002_zps0h0wk4cn.jpg.html)