Placement of dry sump tank?

[mistblue]

Hello. I have a chevelle -66 with ls1 engine.
LS1 engine should now be replaced with a LS3 Corvette Grand Sport dry sump engine.
Because of lack of space in the engine compartment, I had thoughts about installing dry sump tank in the trunk.

Is it doable?
Is there anything I need to consider?, .... i.e. placement of the tank, length of hoses, etc.

Hope You can help me out.

Pether.

[Blake Foster]

My personal thought is No on the tank in the trunk, it would be a lot harder on the pump to transfer the oil that far I would think.
why not call one of the dry sump companies like Peterson Fluid?
I know the NASCAR guys mount them in behind the driver but they are using 4-6 stage belt drive pumps.
just my .02 worth.
Is there no room to move the battery to the trunk and mount the take there? that is where the ATS dry sump tank mounts on the first gen Camaro

[71RS/SS396]

You can put it in the trunk but you need to increase the line size to a -16 or better yet -20 to reduce the restriction, but I bet you won't like the price of the hose and fittings -20 hose ends are like $75 + each. Do not use any forged elbows, use only high flow formed tube elbows, the forged ones are very restrictive. I would also highly recommend that you vent the trunk somehow to exhaust heat that will be generated by the tank, The vent for the tank should also exhaust outside of the trunk and a sealed firewall behind the back seat would be a very good idea should something bad happen you don't want hot oil catching on fire behind the seat. What's the capacity of the tank in the picture? It looks pretty small to me, 2 gallons is the absolute minimum imo, more is better.

[Flash68]

I know the NASCAR guys mount them in behind the driver but they are using 4-6 stage belt drive pumps.


They are also turning only LEFT. :twak:

Run large lines like Tim said and get enough capacity. Your tank looks like 3 gallons to me. I would use no less than 4.

I am putting mine in the area behind the passenger seat and running lines on the passenger frame rail up to the engine. 3 total lines of 16AN (1 supply and 2 return). Nascar used to run dual 16AN return now most are using single 20AN)

[Blake Foster]

They are also turning only LEFT. :twak:

Run large lines like Tim said and get enough capacity. Your tank looks like 3 gallons to me. I would use no less than 4.

I am putting mine in the area behind the passenger seat and running lines on the passenger frame rail up to the engine. 3 total lines of 16AN (1 supply and 2 return). Nascar used to run dual 16AN return now most are using single 20AN)

REALLY? only Left you say!
what about Watkins glen and Sonoma?

:bigun2: :bigun2:

[Flash68]

REALLY? only Left you say!
what about Watkins glen and Sonoma?

:bigun2: :bigun2:

Knew you were gonna say that. :lol:

If I had to guess, I'd say they make up for it somehow to balance the car on the road course.

If they drove 13 out of 15 events on the road course don't you think it might be different tank placement?

Of all the people you see putting tanks in the trunk, how many put them on the driver side? I've seen 1 out of 50 and that's because it was more of a show car.

Just my observations from the cheap seats here.....

[mikespeed95]

Post a pic of your engine bay, I have seen some very creative solutions involving custom or notched oil tanks. What all is along the firewall, and what type of dry sump system are you actually using? If it's the stock LS3 "dry sump" out of the grand sports, that is just a scavenging pump, feeding a tank, to a stock oil pump. There are some very easy solutions for this in the engine bay, but you'll need a different tank than the off the shelf Petersen unit everyone loves to use.

A lot of people aren't aware of how simple the OEM GM ''dry sump'' system is, it's a neat design but kind of comedic simplicity when you think of how a dry sump typically works.

http://www.camarohomepage.com/ls7/images/784.43.jpg

Most people that hide these things put it along the firewall with an oddly shaped or notched tank, or on the radiator support area, along with some other things and just build a bulkhead or cover or something.

[mistblue]

Thanks for the info.

The tank is a 3gallon Howe Racing Enterprises.
As you can see it gets tight with the tank mounted in the engine compartment.

I will still use the original oil pump, so I´ll try to make it fit in the front.(see pic.)

One more question about placement of the tank.
How important is it that the connections between the oil pan and tank is at the same level?

Pether.

[mikespeed95]

As long as the lines feed down towards the pan you're good.

[Flash68]

Here is a 2.5 gallon tank in the engine bay of a 1st gen Camaro. Dang tight in there.

http://i236.photobucket.com/albums/ff245/flash68/IMG_2345_zps6648f432.jpg (http://s236.photobucket.com/user/flash68/media/IMG_2345_zps6648f432.jpg.html)

[71RS/SS396]

Here's where mine is mounted


http://i1009.photobucket.com/albums/af219/tmackg71/Track%20Car/trackcar020.jpg (http://s1009.photobucket.com/user/tmackg71/media/Track%20Car/trackcar020.jpg.html)

[DaleTx]

Because of lack of space in the engine compartment, I had thoughts about installing dry sump tank in the trunk.

Is it doable?
Is there anything I need to consider?, .... i.e. placement of the tank, length of hoses, etc.

Hope You can help me out.

Pether.

I have an LS engine in my 69 Camaro with a dry sump set up. I used a 4 stage dry sump pump and a 3.5 gallon capacity oil tank in the trunk. The engine builder recommended to use a tank with 3 gallon capacity minimum for the trunk installation. For the pressure line I used 20AN part way, then reduced to 16AN. The scavenge (return) line is 20AN for the full run.

I mounted the outlet on the tank up above the inlet to the pump so the pump always has a head of oil (gravity feed). Here are some pictures of the oil tank installed in the trunk.

http://i1048.photobucket.com/albums/s364/daltol/2012-12-15132619-1-1_zps14570e95.jpg (http://s1048.photobucket.com/user/daltol/media/2012-12-15132619-1-1_zps14570e95.jpg.html)

The trunk install works great as long as you have the pump and lines sized correctly. My engine builder had lots of experience with dry sump system and provided instructions and a schematic for the plumbing. Also... make sure to vent the tank outside the trunk.

It was more work and expense to do the plumbing... but it's nice to have the extra space and clean look under the hood.

[gnx7]

I would install a bung for a heater element that plugs in. Preheat the oil before driving or else the oil pressure is sky high for a while. That's what's in my LS7 RX7. I have a 3 gallon Peterson tank behind the passenger seat. Doesn't get too toasty ;). The factory LS7/GS/LS9 dry sump is kind of a joke compared to a real aftermarket system. If you have the $ and will seriously track the car... Go that route!

[Solid LT1]

I would install a bung for a heater element that plugs in. Preheat the oil before driving or else the oil pressure is sky high for a while. That's what's in my LS7 RX7. I have a 3 gallon Peterson tank behind the passenger seat. Doesn't get too toasty ;). The factory LS7/GS/LS9 dry sump is kind of a joke compared to a real aftermarket system. If you have the $ and will seriously track the car... Go that route!

I agree the factory dry sump isn't 100% optimum but! it's still a hell of a lot better than any wet sump/accusump band-aided system. Not anywhere as good as something like a Dailey Engineering set up but, still should perform well at any task a set of DOT200 tires could subject it to. The only late model GS/C6Z owners I have known to have scavenge problems were running sticky track tires on a trailered dedicated track car.

GM never required me to preheat the oil in my C6 Z06 but I did witness my buddies brother Jim Herlinger go through a 3 hour ordeal to start his ALMS Pratt&Miller C5R Vette. The guy from Pratt&Miller told him that a different spec motor could be built to allow starts with ambient temprature oil/water temps. That C5R was docked to a pre start cart the likes of which I had only observed being used by the Toyota F-1 team at Laguna Seca.....I don't want to have anything to do with any car that requires the employment of a "Race Engineer" to get it onto the track.

[Che70velle]

I agree the factory dry sump isn't 100% optimum but! it's still a hell of a lot better than any wet sump/accusump band-aided system. Not anywhere as good as something like a Dailey Engineering set up but, still should perform well at any task a set of DOT200 tires could subject it to. The only late model GS/C6Z owners I have known to have scavenge problems were running sticky track tires on a trailered dedicated track car.

GM never required me to preheat the oil in my C6 Z06 but I did witness my buddies brother Jim Herlinger go through a 3 hour ordeal to start his ALMS Pratt&Miller C5R Vette. The guy from Pratt&Miller told him that a different spec motor could be built to allow starts with ambient temprature oil/water temps. That C5R was docked to a pre start cart the likes of which I had only observed being used by the Toyota F-1 team at Laguna Seca.....I don't want to have anything to do with any car that requires the employment of a "Race Engineer" to get it onto the track.


Guys, be careful when selecting your heating elements for these tanks. You have options of wattages, and the higher wattage ones will actually scorch the oil in the tank, and turn it a dark color. I bought a tank for my late model once from Ernie Irvin, and he had a large element in it which scorched mine.
I ran a 15 quart tank, and could safely preheat my oil to 100 degrees. We always did this at the track, for qualifying, and pre-race.
With both corvettes that I've owned, I never got on the car until I saw my oil temp reach 170 degrees, but I'm anal about how to treat a cold engine vs. a warm engine.

[Flash68]

Guys, be careful when selecting your heating elements for these tanks. You have options of wattages, and the higher wattage ones will actually scorch the oil in the tank, and turn it a dark color. I bought a tank for my late model once from Ernie Irvin, and he had a large element in it which scorched mine.
I ran a 15 quart tank, and could safely preheat my oil to 100 degrees. We always did this at the track, for qualifying, and pre-race.
With both corvettes that I've owned, I never got on the car until I saw my oil temp reach 170 degrees, but I'm anal about how to treat a cold engine vs. a warm engine.

Good call there. I need to check the wattage on the probe heaters that came with my tank. I think it has 2 heaters with plug-ins ready to go.