Best shifter for t56 Magnum into a 69 Camaro

[Greg from Aus]

Hi guy's,

Looking for choices.

Thanks
Greg

[Sieg]

I have the Hurst Blackjack on my Magnum, it aligns in the stock console well and shifts great but it's leaking out of the top ball, the issue IMO is assossicated with cutting out and reusing the internal Tremec rubber boot per their instructions. They say there may be an internal drain in the upper shifter housing that's clogged but I haven't had time to tear it apart and verify if thats the case.

Unless they've addressed the seal design I'd probably suggest a different design.

[ErikLS2]

This is the one I'm going with: http://www.mgwltd.com/

[Blake Foster]

I used the shock shifter with a long hurst handle and LOVE it. it is mostly an arm rest when driving, stifts as fast as you want.

http://i1235.photobucket.com/albums/ff425/killer72nova/SpeedTech15.jpg

[Greg from Aus]

Thanks guy's I will have a look at them.

Greg

[EBMC]

I used the shock shifter with a long hurst handle and LOVE it. it is mostly an arm rest when driving, stifts as fast as you want.

http://i1235.photobucket.com/albums/ff425/killer72nova/SpeedTech15.jpg

Is that a lineloc button on your pro touring car? Once a drag racer, always a drag racer....

[Blake Foster]

lol
no it is for engaging the SUPERCHARGER !!! DUHHH

Come on Steve




actually it is the reverse lock out.

[67ragtp]

Check out White lightning, adjustable spring rate, handle can be clocked in all kinds of different directions, short throw. Nice piece of hardware, I like it! :thumbsup:

http://www.americanpowertrain.com/Shifter-Mechanisms.html

Rich

[EBMC]

Just making sure! No problems activating it during aggresive driving?

[Matt@BOS]

I've just been using the stock one. I actually prefer it the the pro 5.0 I had in my old T56.

Matt

[Blake Foster]

Just making sure! No problems activating it during aggresive driving?

only problem i encounter is the CRAZY wheel spin at about 150 mph.
you know mad max kind of power.

all kidding aside, no problems not very often you are slamming the shifter into 5th and could miss and hit "R"
plus where the button is it is between your thumb and palm.
works great.

[parsonsj]

Will any of these shifters work in the stock console? (I'm new to Camaros).

[Sieg]

Here's the one I've got: http://www.hurst-drivelines.com/?page_id=25

I'd say it's close to perfect with the exception of the leak/weaping issue which may be a one-off issue. I did shorten the plastic tunnel about 1" for additional shift-boot clearance. A stock rubber shift-boot won't work IMO, I sewed up my own naugahide boot.

Here's a pic without the shift-boot:
http://sieg.smugmug.com/Cars/69-Camaro/i-snMKkVV/0/L/IMAG1315-L.jpg

With the boot:
http://sieg.smugmug.com/Cars/69-Camaro/i-b8JSKz5/0/L/IMGP0001-L.jpg

[6D9 Matt]

I use the Hurst Blackjack as well (with stock console), and have had no issues whatsoever. :thumbsup:

[Sieg]

I use the Hurst Blackjack as well (with stock console), and have had no issues whatsoever. :thumbsup:
Matt - Did you cut out the Tremec shifter seal and install it on the Blackjack?
I wondering if I have a unit with a manufacturing defect, Jim at Hurst DL's has been great and offered a new unit at N/C. I just haven't had time to tear the console, cut the carpet and access the shifter.

[Vegas69]

I've seen a minimum of 4 people already with the shifter leaking issue.

[Sieg]

I've seen a minimum of 4 people already with the shifter leaking issue. Specifically the Blackjack? :_paranoid

[Vegas69]

Not sure... All 56 mags though.

[BBPanel]

Check out White lightning, adjustable spring rate, handle can be clocked in all kinds of different directions, short throw. Nice piece of hardware, I like it! :thumbsup:
http://www.americanpowertrain.com/Shifter-Mechanisms.html
Rich

That sure does look like Red Roberts (McLeod) shifter, the one on the Vette TKO - wonder if they are re-branding it or copying it? I have one of Red's shifters in my 66 Nova (T56) and even though I haven't driven it yet it feels great. The 2 x 2 offset put the shifter exactly where it needed to be.

[6D9 Matt]

Matt - Did you cut out the Tremec shifter seal and install it on the Blackjack?
I wondering if I have a unit with a manufacturing defect, Jim at Hurst DL's has been great and offered a new unit at N/C. I just haven't had time to tear the console, cut the carpet and access the shifter.

I have a good friend that has a shop here, so he did all the work. He didnt say anything about any of that though, seemed to be a pretty smooth conversion with the console, etc.

Will you only notice the leaking if you take off the boot, etc? Now Im worried about my mine leaking. :_paranoid Havent noticed anything though...

[DFRESH]

My Hurst Black Jack shifter leaked, same as yours. It was a terrible setup on my T56 Magnum. When asked about how to stop the leak, it was recommend to repack it with heavy grease. Cleary, that ain't the way to really fix it. I went back to the stock shifter for the time being and it feels much better, just don't like the longer throw.

I'm going to go with the White Lighning setup----I was able to get in the drivers seat in Brett's 48 hour Camaro at Del Mar. That shifter with the Magnum trans is a very sweet setup---the feel of it is perfect, and a very, very short throw. You really can't miss a shift with it. I've got other irons in the fire, but when I have some space, this will be my purchase.

Doug

[454SSguy]

Does AP make the white lightning for the standard T-56. If so, how much $$ is it. I haven't seen a price yet.

[Sieg]

Will you only notice the leaking if you take off the boot, etc? Now Im worried about my mine leaking. :_paranoid Havent noticed anything though...
Mine is weaping out the top of the ball and drizzles down the low side of the case. Not major but...........I Hate Leaks! :D

[Sieg]

My Hurst Black Jack shifter leaked, same as yours. It was a terrible setup on my T56 Magnum. When asked about how to stop the leak, it was recommend to repack it with heavy grease. Cleary, that ain't the way to really fix it. I went back to the stock shifter for the time being and it feels much better, just don't like the longer throw.

I'm going to go with the White Lighning setup----I was able to get in the drivers seat in Brett's 48 hour Camaro at Del Mar. That shifter with the Magnum trans is a very sweet setup---the feel of it is perfect, and a very, very short throw. You really can't miss a shift with it. I've got other irons in the fire, but when I have some space, this will be my purchase.

Doug

Thanks Doug. I hesitantly tried the grease recommendation.........no worky, no surprise. The Stock Tremec shifter isn't an option as the integral seal is now cut out of it.

Who's the source for the White Lightening setup?

And more importantly.......how's the wife doing?

[DFRESH]

Thanks Doug. I hesitantly tried the grease recommendation.........no worky, no surprise. The Stock Tremec shifter isn't an option as the integral seal is now cut out of it.

Who's the source for the White Lightening setup?

And more importantly.......how's the wife doing?

It's American Power Train (americanpowertrain.com). Do a search, I believe in this forum---Brett (Air Ride) had a video about the shifter. After using it in person, I will say it is vastly superior than the Black Jack.

Cassie is doing fine bro--thanks for asking. We just went through another scare this past weekend as she had to be readmitted. She stayed about 3 days, but fortunately no surgery required.

Let us know what you decide to do----would love to hear your feedback if you end up with the White Lightning setup.

D

[Sieg]

Just emailed American to confirm fitment, internal seal, and pricing. :thumbsup:
Their website lists the WL as TKO application and the Driveline Components shifter for T56's

Sorry to hear about a setback, fingers crossed. :thumbsup:

[6D9 Matt]

Interested to hear the pricing info on the white lightning setup, etc.

Post up if you would... or PM me just to let me know for future reference.

[boostin05blacks]

I have the white lightening from american powertrain. Talk to Josh over there, all around a great company. (931) 646-4836 x107 Really a nice piece all the way around. Has a ton of adjustment and feels really nice shifting it with the springs set all the way to hard. My cars not on the road yet so no input on driving impression yet. Heres some quick pictures..

http://i18.photobucket.com/albums/b128/storm1112885/muscle%20cars/333588d9.jpg
http://i18.photobucket.com/albums/b128/storm1112885/muscle%20cars/3faca20c.jpg

[Greg from Aus]

Thanks guy's a White lightning it is.


Greg

[Sieg]

Accessed the trans and Blackjack shifter to inspect the leakage this morning. It appears the factory Tremec seal I was instructed to cut and fit has enlarged and deformed from when it was originally fit causing it to pucker at two sides.

Here's a photo sequence of the disassembly:
http://sieg.smugmug.com/Cars/Hurst-Blackjack-Shifter/22201289_T3Lcqh

My guess is without a properly engineered seal it appears it will continue to be an issue. :question:

[DFRESH]

Accessed the trans and Blackjack shifter to inspect the leakage this morning. It appears the factory Tremec seal I was instructed to cut and fit has enlarged and deformed from when it was originally fit causing it to pucker at two sides.

Here's a photo sequence of the disassembly:
http://sieg.smugmug.com/Cars/Hurst-Blackjack-Shifter/22201289_T3Lcqh

My guess is without a properly engineered seal it appears it will continue to be an issue. :question:

Yes, would agree. You'd have to design a new seal and probably redesign the whole bushing in the hopes of making it stop leaking. It's a shame isn't it? I was really hoping it would work---I am still rockin the original---no issues. Looking forward to the White Lightning---

D

[Sieg]

Thanks for the response Doug.

I'm hoping to get a replacement seal from Tremec to replace the one I butchered for no reason so I have a backup.

It appears Hurst might have been able to seal the unit similar to the stock Tremec. Production cost of the seals must have been an issue?

I've requested info on the White Lightning from APT on their website twice now..........no contact, no surprise. I wish vendors wouldn't put contact info on their site if they just choose to ignore it. :rolleyes:

I'll Be talking with Jim Goodlad at Hurst tomorrow to see what my stop-leak options are.

[DFRESH]

Thanks for the response Doug.

I'm hoping to get a replacement seal from Tremec to replace the one I butchered for no reason so I have a backup.

It appears Hurst might have been able to seal the unit similar to the stock Tremec. Production cost of the seals must have been an issue?

I've requested info on the White Lightning from APT on their website twice now..........no contact, no surprise. I wish vendors wouldn't put contact info on their site if they just choose to ignore it. :rolleyes:

I'll Be talking with Jim Goodlad at Hurst tomorrow to see what my stop-leak options are.

If you come up with a solution, please let me know--I'd be interested in trying it myself since I have a brand new Blackjack shifter with less than about 5 miles on it---

D

[Sieg]

If you come up with a solution, please let me know--I'd be interested in trying it myself since I have a brand new Blackjack shifter with less than about 5 miles on it---

D
Mine has about 800 miles on it, but all it's moving components have been thoroughly lubricated with Mobil 1 AFT the entire time. :D

After a phone call today I have a better understanding of possible causes. They are related to the amount of internal air pressure the transmission is developing. The oneway check valve at the end of Tremec's vent line is supposedly calibrated to open at 10 psi. As to whether that valve is part of the cause, I don't know. Another theory is the yoke seal is acting like a pump. My car sits low with stiff rear springs and a level drive shaft so I don't think the yoke is acting like much of a pump.

I did learn the White Lightning incorporates a seal system and it has been successful.

The simple assumption would be why not remove the check valve or reduce the opening PSI? I'll assume the trans needs a certain amount of internal pressure.

I hoping to get a few more answers, one from Tremec. I'm uncertain of how Hurst is going to handle my shifter and others it at this point.

[Vegas69]

Another protouring part that wasn't properly tested. Imagine that. I'd say a refund is in order.

The vent location is likely the cause of the 10psi blow off valve. A little pressure is good to help the tailshaft/input shaft seals.

I wonder if you could decrease the orfice size that feeds the shifter mechanism with oil? Some type of a rubber plug with a small hole would probably work.

[Sieg]

Another protouring part that wasn't properly tested. Imagine that. I'd say a refund is in order.

The vent location is likely the cause of the 10psi blow off valve. A little pressure is good to help the tailshaft/input shaft seals.

I wonder if you could decrease the orfice size that feeds the shifter mechanism with oil? Some type of a rubber plug with a small hole would probably work.
There's probably a logical engineering reason for Tremec isolating the shift mechanism from the case.

I cut out a piece of UniFilter filter foam and fit it to see if that would be an effective baffle that would still wick lubricant but the shift-pin's range of movement pulls the dense foam away from the perimeter. An open fuel cell type foam compressed into the area might work. Needs to be a material that won't disintegrate and fall into the grinder below though.

I just got off the phone with Jim Goodlad and he is very genuine and has extended options that already leave me 100% satisfied.......you can't ask for more than that from a supplier. :thumbsup:

It could be something as simple as a defective vent cap on the vent line. Maybe an old skool fix like tossing the vent cap and zip-tying some filter foam on the end of the line is the simple fix?

Appears they've only had a few with leak issues out of approximately 2000 on the market.

I might devise some a hook up for a radiator pressure tester as see what happens on the line and trans case. :question:

[Sieg]

Built this setup tonight with a Schrader valve behind the guage and put air to the case to check venting. The case would only allow about 2.5 psi of pressure at a peak and the vent sounded like it was flowing fine. 10 psi doesn't appear to be accurate info.

http://sieg.smugmug.com/Cars/69-Camaro/i-9cXPkN4/0/L/IMAG1955-L.jpg

http://sieg.smugmug.com/Cars/69-Camaro/i-cLRjSJ7/0/M/IMAG1951-M.jpg

[DFRESH]

Built this setup tonight with a Schrader valve behind the guage and put air to the case to check venting. The case would only allow about 2.5 psi of pressure at a peak and the vent sounded like it was flowing fine. 10 psi doesn't appear to be accurate info.

http://sieg.smugmug.com/Cars/69-Camaro/i-9cXPkN4/0/L/IMAG1955-L.jpg

http://sieg.smugmug.com/Cars/69-Camaro/i-cLRjSJ7/0/M/IMAG1951-M.jpg

That's gonna make it tough to shift brother. That does take care of the leak though. :lol:

[Roberts68]

4I haven't made any purchase yet but have been talking to American Powertrain and Hurst quite a bit lately. Unfortunately the AP website had to change rather abruptly as the heresay I got was that their old website was being "held hostage" in a manner of speaking by a prior webmaster. Needless to say the new one is incomplete.

The White Lightning from AP is listed at $269-299 depending on offset options.

As an upgrade it is $150-200 more than the stock shifter depending upon what the rest of your kit includes.

[Sieg]

That's gonna make it tough to shift brother. That does take care of the leak though. :lol:
So you don't like the new air-shifter huh? :(

[Sieg]

I haven't made any purchase yet but have been talking to American Powertrain and Hurst quite a bit lately. Unfortunately their website had to change rather abruptly as the heresay I got was that their old website was being "held hostage" in a manner of speaking by a prior webmaster. Needless to say the new one is incomplete.

The White Lightning from AP is listed at $269-299 depending on offset options.

As an upgrade it is $150-200 more than the stock shifter depending upon what the rest of your kit includes.

I have a White Lightning ordered should be here end of next week (I believe retail is $349 w/ 1" offset). Steering box is in transit from Lee and the Kore3 front brake system is waiting to be bled. I'll give some feedback on the shifter as soon as possible. :thumbsup:

[Roberts68]

I have a White Lightning ordered should be here end of next week (I believe retail is $349 w/ 1" offset). Steering box is in transit from Lee and the Kore3 front brake system is waiting to be bled. I'll give some feedback on the shifter as soon as possible. :thumbsup:

Sweet! You have got to be looking forward to the results of that batch of upgrades.:thumbsup:

Here is the page where I saw those price rangesWhite Lighting for T56 Magnum (http://americanpowertrain.com/c-314504-shop-by-category-shifter-t-56-magnum-white-lightning.html)

The cost of upgrade I mentioned was verbal and varies based on kit value.

Across the board I have been impressed with American Powertrain although I agree their responses have been sluggish. It seems some recent ad campaigns, media exposure and commercials run on Powerblock tv have swamped the sales and tech teams. Which is both good and bad depending on your mindset.

[67ragtp]

Road tested my new t56 magnum this weekend, with the white lightning shifter, never touched the shifter adjustment settings from the factory setting. Its awesome!!! very tight pattern and short throws, my shifter is only 5 inches tall, facilitates very quick shifts. I only ripped off one 2nd to 3rd shift at 7000rpm, Im still grinning ear to ear:wow: . Didnt want to kill it to hard, also installed the new centerforce DYAD dual disk. Shifted like butter. I think its close to bulletproof for a 500+hp@rearwheel car. BTW - I purchased all the hardware through American power train and Grey was extremely helpful, he's a talker, real car guy! Clutch purchased through centerforce, it seems everyone has a dual disk they want to sell these days. The shifter is very nice, I think you guys will really like it, the stick is clockable in all kinds of directions so the console guys should be happy too.

Rich

[Roberts68]

That is one tantalizing testimonial right there. Enjoy Rich, sounds like a reoccuring dream I've had for 23 years or so.:hail: :thumbsup:

[Vegas69]

Road tested my new t56 magnum this weekend, with the white lightning shifter, never touched the shifter adjustment settings from the factory setting. Its awesome!!! very tight pattern and short throws, my shifter is only 5 inches tall, facilitates very quick shifts. I only ripped off one 2nd to 3rd shift at 7000rpm, Im still grinning ear to ear:wow: . Didnt want to kill it to hard, also installed the new centerforce DYAD dual disk. Shifted like butter. I think its close to bulletproof for a 500+hp@rearwheel car. BTW - I purchased all the hardware through American power train and Grey was extremely helpful, he's a talker, real car guy! Clutch purchased through centerforce, it seems everyone has a dual disk they want to sell these days. The shifter is very nice, I think you guys will really like it, the stick is clockable in all kinds of directions so the console guys should be happy too.

Rich

Great feedback, now get out there and shift it at high rpm a few more times. :unibrow: :thumbsup:

[rsimons]

Anyone know which handle works best on the stock Tremec shifter in a 67?

[Nwl3_21]

Has anyone tried or heard anything about mal wood shifters?