About Vendors, and the pwr of Google

[XLexusTech]

What i learned today from this site and a Google search...


Use caution and credit cards when making a large orders.
Follow up with distributors directly on orders.
Insist on refund policy and delivery estimates before paying for anything..
Their is a site that I love (other than this one) that i cannot use for vendor recommendations.. they filter information and their appears to be a bias..
Maybe spending 10 to 20 K on one order with one vendor is a bad idea without a contract..

[JustinB]

Ok, ok, ok we get it. It has been well covered over the last few days. If you don't have a direct outstanding issue with a vendor, leave it alone. Not all vendors are crooks and out the steal your money.

[cencalc6]

Buy Directly from the source and you should not have this problem :D

[brans72]

Some times you can not find there soruce very easy. I want a certain radiator but the vendor or no other vendor will tell me who the source is that makes it. Thinking Northeren radiators as I am on a budget and truth be told I sometimes wanna see my Chevelle but can't due to my wife,will loose $$$ and feel like if I let it go I failed myself.

[XLexusTech]

I agree with you 100%.
I don't disagree with this approach.. but if their was a vendor that carries several line items, a discount for a 10+k order would be expected..
Personaly that the position I am in... i need over 10K worth of parts and want to order form one source and expect a deal... now if i will get the shaft then I will have to go to the sources...

[XLexusTech]

i ordered 13.5 k worth of parts from one of the advertisers here. i bought a full sub frame and four link and tons of other stuff, the maker of my chassis parts will only sell at full list not to under cut its distributors i got a 15% discount on my entire order... it was a great transaction for all involved...

exactly my point :thumbsup:

[cencalc6]

I don't disagree with this approach.. but if their was a vendor that carries several line items, a discount for a 10+k order would be expected..
Personaly that the position I am in... i need over 10K worth of parts and want to order form one source and expect a deal... now if i will get the shaft then I will have to go to the sources...


Give them a call! $10K will definetly get you a discount :thumbsup:

If your looking for Suspension,like DSE,Speetech and etc..Those companies will work with you......My initial post was to try and avoid smaller companies (middle man) that dont even carry a single part in their hand.

[John510]

I don't disagree with this approach.. but if their was a vendor that carries several line items, a discount for a 10+k order would be expected..
Personaly that the position I am in... i need over 10K worth of parts and want to order form one source and expect a deal... now if i will get the shaft then I will have to go to the sources...

Id recommend ordering from Matts Classic Bowties. Ive ordered over 40K worth of parts from Kim and Matt and they are awesome. They are also a site sponsor.

[Nine Ball]

Sometimes people focus on being cheapskates and trying to save every last penny on a purchase. Personally, I'd rather pay a little more for the same product and deal with a reputable company or vendor. Peace of mind and security DO have a huge value. You guys take care of the shops and individuals that take care of you, don't always settle for the lowest pricing. That sometimes means the lowest customer service, or lowest amount in the business account, too.

Tony

[Flash68]

Sometimes people focus on being cheapskates and trying to save every last penny on a purchase. Personally, I'd rather pay a little more for the same product and deal with a reputable company or vendor. Peace of mind and security DO have a huge value. You guys take care of the shops and individuals that take care of you, don't always settle for the lowest pricing. That sometimes means the lowest customer service, or lowest amount in the business account, too.

Tony

I tend to agree with you, Tony. But these types of comments always come from people with MONEY. You notice that? And usually the ones with not a lot of disposable income feel they have to seek out that best deal because their money needs to stretch farther. Or, maybe some people are just cheap. :lol:

And to be honest, most people who spend their money on these car parts should not actually be buying them (think: financial priorities in life)... but hey that's a whole 'nuther story.... :)

[214Chevy]

.....And to be honest, most people who spend their money on these car parts should not actually be buying them (think: financial priorities in life)... but hey that's a whole 'nuther story.... :)

Totally agree 1000%. :yes: :yes: But, I am nobody to be questioning anyone financial statue. But, that is so true of a statement. Not only should some not be buying the parts, but shouldn't be restoring a car either. That's why at times so many projects get abandoned due to guys jumping in head first to buy a car without thinking and not knowing that this is not a hobby for just anyone. It takes alot of time and even more money.

[Matt@BOS]

My two cents..

People want the best price, (and who can blame them) and dealers have been bending over to give them the best price and trying to trade profit margin for sales volume. I almost laughed at the post Frank made when he wrote that a competitor of Prodigy Customs was undercutting him and selling at a loss. Frank had basically been out Franked! And, we've reached the end of uncutting when someone is selling at a loss. I wondered how long that would take to happen. For years Frank has been trying to operate like the Walmart of pro touring, despite being a little operation, and our hobby being a small market. I know other dealers here hate what Frank and the like have done because 99 percent of the outfits sponsoring here are small shops that aren't cut out to sell volume. basically everyone is forced to lower profit margins to try and make the same amount of money these days. It is a sad state of affairs, but who can you blame? Do you blame the consumer for trying save a little money. Do you blame the dealer for trying to get a sale? Do you blame the vendor for not policing dealer pricing?

One thing is for certain. I think this latest trend is forcing people to be more realistic about the cost of doing business...

[ironworks]

In alot of instances if you buy a product from a vendor who also installs the part your buying they might know more about the the products actual install. Have you ever called a MFG who makes a bolt in product that does not fit. I guarantee they will tell you it does. But the vendor may have dealt with the issue your talking about and know what you have to do to get that bolt in product to fit. So your paying for the expertise they have as an installer or builder. That has to be worth something.

I got an email last week from a guy who had shopped everyone for the lowest price on a subframe. He emailed me with his lowest bid. I emailed the subframe builder and he told me he had quoted shipping to the address from every vendor on the West Coast. He told me the margin and I emailed the guy back and told him at the price he currently had as the winning vendor I could not make enough money to give him the customer service his sales deserves.

I'm also not sure that buying directly from the MFG solves the problem. I have had plenty of suppliers either lie or not know they cannot live up to there estimated delivery time. I think it is better to buy from someone you know and have good luck with who spends the time in giving someone the follow through they want and deserve with their purchase.

[Vegas69]

You blame it on the internet and this new way of life. It's been driven/forced into our brains to continue to be more productive and efficient and it sucks. The internet has taken information beyond where it needs to be.

It's not only the parts industry but most businesses that have succeeded the economy collapse. You either get more efficient or you don't make any money. My job is 3 times the work it was 10 years ago. I really think we are at a point now where we can't get much more efficient. That leads me down the next road. Once you learn to be a government drone you then realize that you have it alright and start living more within your means. Paying down debt, saving money, etc.

This is just my view... :lol:

[64pontiac]

Not trying to beat the horse anymore, but as a vendor and parts retailer, I like to see customers support their local distributors. HPI is a labour based business, and we like to make our parts sales to maintain our distributor price points but retail is not a focus. I can totally see how hard it can be for a purely parts retailer to survive off the small margins in this specialty stuff. (not condoning the poor decisions some make). What I CAN tell you is that companies like us use the brands and parts we sell on a daily basis and sometimes are a better source of support than the larger manufacturers! We typically sell to local customers, and take on the costs and responsibility of shipping, damage, mistakes etc in exchange for retail pricing. Add our knowledge support and it's a pretty good deal!

All I am saying is that I feel it is still important to support local distributors as well as vendors on this site, as buying direct is not always the best thing for the industry as a whole, but just pay attention to feedback etc. an honest distributor will disclose as much info as possible, especially about lead times on orders. Us distributors even run into the non-shipment or delays just like the consumers, trust me!

[ironworks]

I think it's funny how you get what you pay for in most instances.

Tattoos - Ever seen a nice jail house tattoo
Hookers - How much beer would you need to consume to even consider getting near a $20 Hooker?
Hamburgers - The 10 dollar burger is better then a .39 burger anyday
Wheels for your car - Ever heard of HRE, Ask the guys at Pep boys about them.
Welders - Do you really think the $100 buzz box will lay down a stack of dime?
Casters - The kind on your tool box Just buy the Harbor Freight Caster once you will know what I mean
New York Steaks - Sizzler Sells a New York steak and so does the Outback. And so does that fancy steak house in the Wynn at Las vegas that won't allow you to wear short in there restaurant.
Attorneys - Would you ever trust a cheap attorney to get you off the hook if you were innocent?
Bicycles - You ever had a $100 huffy that weighs about a 1000lbs.

I believe preceived value is more important then actual cost.

[Flash68]

Yep - do your best to buy from someone you know or have at least met if possible. If not, buy from Summit or Jegs.

[cencalc6]

Yep - do your best to buy from someone you know or have at least met if possible. If not, buy from Summit or Jegs.

:thumbsup: :thumbsup:

[cencalc6]

I think it's funny how you get what you pay for in most instances.

Tattoos - Ever seen a nice jail house tattoo
Hookers - How much beer would you need to consume to even consider getting near a $20 Hooker?
Hamburgers - The 10 dollar burger is better then a .39 burger anyday
Wheels for your car - Ever heard of HRE, Ask the guys at Pep boys about them.
Welders - Do you really think the $100 buzz box will lay down a stack of dime?
Casters - The kind on your tool box Just buy the Harbor Freight Caster once you will know what I mean
New York Steaks - Sizzler Sells a New York steak and so does the Outback. And so does that fancy steak house in the Wynn at Las vegas that won't allow you to wear short in there restaurant.
Attorneys - Would you ever trust a cheap attorney to get you off the hook if you were innocent?
Bicycles - You ever had a $100 huffy that weighs about a 1000lbs.

I believe preceived value is more important then actual cost.


:lol: :lol: :thumbsup:

[70rs]

I agree with this ^^^
Buy quality, from a quality vendor. In the long run you come out ahead with less problems.
That the vendor stands behind the product is a huge value. The knowledge, support and relationships that can be built are only more proof.
It helps the industry. It helps your project and you get to make friends along the way.

I'm on a really tight budget. But even as tight as it is I refuse to skimpy on the things that count. For me that means quality, proven parts that perform. ARP fasteners for example that I will buy from a vendor here. Brakes from another. Shocks and suspension components from yet another.
I could save a few bucks going to the big mail order places, but I'll never get the same service. Or ever be buddies with the sales rep there.

[bret]

I think it's funny how you get what you pay for in most instances.

Tattoos - Ever seen a nice jail house tattoo
Hookers - How much beer would you need to consume to even consider getting near a $20 Hooker?
Hamburgers - The 10 dollar burger is better then a .39 burger anyday
Wheels for your car - Ever heard of HRE, Ask the guys at Pep boys about them.
Welders - Do you really think the $100 buzz box will lay down a stack of dime?
Casters - The kind on your tool box Just buy the Harbor Freight Caster once you will know what I mean
New York Steaks - Sizzler Sells a New York steak and so does the Outback. And so does that fancy steak house in the Wynn at Las vegas that won't allow you to wear short in there restaurant.
Attorneys - Would you ever trust a cheap attorney to get you off the hook if you were innocent?
Bicycles - You ever had a $100 huffy that weighs about a 1000lbs.

I believe preceived value is more important then actual cost.

Roger...I'm stealing this for our next catalog...PERFECT!!

[andrewb70]

I think it's funny how you get what you pay for in most instances.

Tattoos - Ever seen a nice jail house tattoo
Hookers - How much beer would you need to consume to even consider getting near a $20 Hooker?
Hamburgers - The 10 dollar burger is better then a .39 burger anyday
Wheels for your car - Ever heard of HRE, Ask the guys at Pep boys about them.
Welders - Do you really think the $100 buzz box will lay down a stack of dime?
Casters - The kind on your tool box Just buy the Harbor Freight Caster once you will know what I mean
New York Steaks - Sizzler Sells a New York steak and so does the Outback. And so does that fancy steak house in the Wynn at Las vegas that won't allow you to wear short in there restaurant.
Attorneys - Would you ever trust a cheap attorney to get you off the hook if you were innocent?
Bicycles - You ever had a $100 huffy that weighs about a 1000lbs.

I believe preceived value is more important then actual cost.

The points made above are certainly valid, but vendors need to remember that the concepts of "value" and "quality" are entirely subjective. Meaning that each individual will have their own scale by which they measure what is important to them.

Let's examine your list of items in a different light.

Tattoos - If I am getting a jailhouse tattoo I am not concerned about it looking "nice." Jailhouse tattoos have a great deal of meaning attached to them and the aesthetic value is secondary.

Hookers - If I was just in jail and I have a fresh jailhouse tattoo, I might settle for a $20 hooker...

Hamburgers - Of course the $10 burger is going to taste better, but if all I have is lint in my pocket and I haven't eaten all day, the 39 cent burger will surely hit the spot.

Wheels - Yes, HRE, BBS, Forgeline, and many other companies make excellent wheels. They are generally light and strong and exactly what is needed for a high performance street or race car. But if I am a kid on a budget and I can't afford $1200 PER wheel, a set of Enkies or 5Zigens might work just as well and I can get a whole set for the price of ONE Forgeline wheel.

Welders - Yes, $4000 machines will lay down pretty beads (with a competent operator), but sometimes all I need to do is make a simple bracket from angle iron that no one will ever see. The $500 MIG will work just fine for that.

New York Strips - See the hamburger example.

Casters - I am quite sure that the casters from Harbor Freight are not the greatest, but if I need to hold up a light toolbox that rarely gets moved, I am sure they will suffice.

Attorney - Does price alone determine the quality of legal service? In addition to what a lawyer charges I would want to look at their conviction record, level of trial experience, etc...

Bicycles - See wheel example.

Perceived value is a ratio of the (perceived) benefits that are derived from a product or service divided by the price. We, as consumers, are always looking for products that will give us the most benefit (as we perceive it) at the lowest price possible. Vendors, builders, and manufacturers need to always consider their customer base, and their potential customers. There are any number of ways to make profit, both at the top end of the scale and at the bottom. Think Walmart, Target, Sears, JC Penny, Macy's, Dillard's, Nordstrom's, Saks Fifth Avenue, Neiman Marcus, ??? etc......Each individual will have their own listing of stores that represents something different to them. It is also critical for vendors, builders, and manufacturers to remember that as they move up the chain, the number of customers gets smaller and smaller. This has tremendous impact on operations, overhead, support, etc...

Andrew

[bret]

Andrew...I agree with your points. There are many levels and definitions of "quality" pertaining to the design, construction, and function of any product. Different people and different applications require different levels of quality. I have a $3.00 rubber hammer from Harbor Freight in my toolbox because, well, its a rubber hammer. I also have a $300 flaring tool in my box because it really important to me to be able to make nice flares on brakelines.
That being said, I think EVERYONE, wheather they buy a $3.00 rubber hammer or a $300 flaring tool expects an appropriate level of competent customer service. They [rightfully] expect a friendly, knowledgeable, articulate, intelligent person [or process] to get them the components they need for their project as quickly, effeciently, and cheaply as possible.
THAT is is main difference between a cheap part and an "expensive" part. In reality, it cost just about as much to make a cheap part as it does an expensive part [with some exceptions]. Its those friendly, knowledgeable, articulate and intelligent people [who like to eat warm food and sleep indoors] that must be figured into the cost of an 'expensive" part.

THAT is why I always recommend that you purchase from the people who demonstrate they can truly answer your questions, regardless of the monetary price.

[andrewb70]

Andrew...I agree with your points. There are many levels and definitions of "quality" pertaining to the design, construction, and function of any product. Different people and different applications require different levels of quality. I have a $3.00 rubber hammer from Harbor Freight in my toolbox because, well, its a rubber hammer. I also have a $300 flaring tool in my box because it really important to me to be able to make nice flares on brakelines.
That being said, I think EVERYONE, wheather they buy a $3.00 rubber hammer or a $300 flaring tool expects an appropriate level of competent customer service. They [rightfully] expect a friendly, knowledgeable, articulate, intelligent person [or process] to get them the components they need for their project as quickly, effeciently, and cheaply as possible.
THAT is is main difference between a cheap part and an "expensive" part. In reality, it cost just about as much to make a cheap part as it does an expensive part [with some exceptions]. Its those friendly, knowledgeable, articulate and intelligent people [who like to eat warm food and sleep indoors] that must be figured into the cost of an 'expensive" part.

THAT is why I always recommend that you purchase from the people who demonstrate they can truly answer your questions, regardless of the monetary price.

Bret, all valid points. People, systems, and procedures all need to be in place to achieve even the minimum (this is also very subjective) level of customer service and support. Summit and Jeg's may not have people that know every little detail about every little product, but they have excellent online ordering systems and amazing warehouse systems. If I know the exact part that I need, I go online and with minimal effort the parts show up in 2 days.

When I have doubts as to what I need and I am shopping for more complicated components, then I want to talk to companies that I feel have knowledge and will steer me in the right direction based on my desired outcomes. I also used to work in sales, so I am very sensitive about making sure that the company that treated me the best got my business, all things being equal, even if I have to pay a more.

My main point is that all this is rather complicated and not as clear cut as some people would have everyone believe. There are good and bad manufacturers, vendors, and customers.

Andrew

[novanutcase]

Bret, all valid points. People, systems, and procedures all need to be in place to achieve even the minimum (this is also very subjective) level of customer service and support. Summit and Jeg's may not have people that know every little detail about every little product, but they have excellent online ordering systems and amazing warehouse systems. If I know the exact part that I need, I go online and with minimal effort the parts show up in 2 days.

When I have doubts as to what I need and I am shopping for more complicated components, then I want to talk to companies that I feel have knowledge and will steer me in the right direction based on my desired outcomes. I also used to work in sales, so I am very sensitive about making sure that the company that treated me the best got my business, all things being equal, even if I have to pay a more.

My main point is that all this is rather complicated and not as clear cut as some people would have everyone believe. There are good and bad manufacturers, vendors, and customers.

Andrew

Yes! It's not as black and white as some may think.

John

[GregWeld]

Re: hookers




If teeth can't live in that mouth... What chance do you think your crank has...




You're all still beating a really dead horse. Some vendors make it. Some don't for many various reasons. I'm sorry it didn't work out for Jon but it is what it is. It's all of the reasons and none of the reasons. Everyone faces the exact same set of business issues.

Next.....

[jocko124]

Damn Greg, right again. You keep this up and I'll have to start a fan club!!:D


Re: hookers




If teeth can't live in that mouth... What chance do you think your crank has...




You're all still beating a really dead horse. Some vendors make it. Some don't for many various reasons. I'm sorry it didn't work out for Jon but it is what it is. It's all of the reasons and none of the reasons. Everyone faces the exact same set of business issues.

Next.....