Art Morrison Max G sub

[novanutcase]

anyone be able to quote the real costs of an ARt Morrison Max G sub with Vette front end? :)

[trayb]

$1440, From what I was told for the front clip.

[mazspeed]

Complete it's about 7k from what I understand.

[TravisB]

I priced a complete max g chassis the other day complete w/c5 front minus the brakes was like 12k.....very reasonable IMO :yes:

[mazspeed]

My bad. I thought I heard 7k somewhere.

[TravisB]

My bad. I thought I heard 7k somewhere.

depends on options and what it includes and stuff....i'm sure they have one for 7k too if thats all you have they are real good at spending your money for you.......lol

[mazspeed]

depends on options and what it includes and stuff....i'm sure they have one for 7k too if thats all you have they are real good at spending your money for you.......lol
heheh, I was thinking of doing this and ditching the Fatman next year, but I'm looking at other projects as well. I may pull the trigger once I know someone who has done it, and tells me that it's the way to go.

[JohnnyR]

How difficult would it be to put this frame under a 66 Nova?

-j

[rocketman]

you would have to cut most to all the floor out of it.and build new floor and either weld the body to the frame or build body mounts.and then refit everything.its not a bolt in,basiclly take the whole car apart and start over

[TravisB]

How difficult would it be to put this frame under a 66 Nova?

-j


pretty much what rocketman said....

we are going to do a 70 chevelle we plan on welding 1/2in plate to the rockers and sleeving holes in the frame and bolting to the frame to the body the legnth of the rocker then making additional body mounts in the rear :thumbsup:

But we also plan on building a new floor as well

[TravisB]

anyone be able to quote the real costs of an ARt Morrison Max G sub with Vette front end? :)


your best bet is to call direct....talk to craig or don they have helped me in the past :thumbsup:

[Sinco]

Here try the link, mine is a full frame.

Lateral-g.net :: Doug Sinjem's 66 Nova

[Sinco]

I don't think the link worked. Go under members and you can see pics of my 66 Nova. Wayne Due built the frame and it has C5 suspension front and rear.

[jonny51]

Here ya go http://www.lateral-g.net/members/sinjem/

[Sinco]

Thanks

[novanutcase]

A few questions if you don't mind:

How hard was it to cut out the firewall, floor pan, and trunk?
How hard was it to reseat on the chassis in terms of fitment?
Is this possible without the assistance of a garage?
What kind of rear end are you putting on this?
I was told by Kevin Kosir at Art Morrison that to drop the body back on to the frame with a C-5 front end would limit the ride height and the wheels would not tuck under the wells but it looks like they tuck under just fine on your ride. Was there something you did to modify this? He suggested their IFS front end.
:thumbsup:

[novanutcase]

Sinco,

Since your project is pretty much what I am looking for another round of questions:

Was your full frame an Art Morrison frame?
Are you building a G-Machine or a straight line dragger?
It looks like the rear end is an IRS. Is this correct and which did you finally choose? :hail:

[Sinco]

A few questions if you don't mind:

How hard was it to cut out the firewall, floor pan, and trunk?
How hard was it to reseat on the chassis in terms of fitment?
Is this possible without the assistance of a garage?
What kind of rear end are you putting on this?
I was told by Kevin Kosir at Art Morrison that to drop the body back on to the frame with a C-5 front end would limit the ride height and the wheels would not tuck under the wells but it looks like they tuck under just fine on your ride. Was there something you did to modify this? He suggested their IFS front end.
:thumbsup:

Wayne Due built the chassis. I believe he had morrison bend the rails. Due to the narrow front end on Novas we had to bring the front hub to hub measurement in to fit the front tires in the wheel wells.

Wayne probably used a plasma cutter to cut the firewall and floor out. He did have the car while he did the work. Putting everything back is going to be the hard part, fitting the wheel tubs, floor and trunk. It's all got to be custom.

[Sinco]

Sinco,

Since your project is pretty much what I am looking for another round of questions:

Was your full frame an Art Morrison frame?
Are you building a G-Machine or a straight line dragger?
It looks like the rear end is an IRS. Is this correct and which did you finally choose? :hail:

I'm building a g-machine not really a drag car. The front is all C5 and so is the rear. The rear end is out of a cobra R and should be able to handle about 700 hp. We are still going to put down bars from the firewall to the frame.

We are going to cut the firewall back and shave it smooth. I'm going to run the new LS7 and either a 4l65e or the new 6 speed automatic. It will have stand alone egine management either BS3 or the Haltech and probably a stand alone computer for the trans.

[Sinco]

Novanutcase you might want to call and talk to Wayne Due. He does subframes for the novas either c5 or c4 suspension or build a custom frame. He's easy to talk to and deal with. Depending on your budget he should be able to help you.

The reason I wanted a frame was so I could get the car low. It's all running on traditonal shocks and springs no air bags. The cars ride height should be about 4 inches behind the front tire and about 5 behind the rear.

[wiedemab]

I talked to someone at AME a few months back about a Max G for an early body Chevy II. I don't even own one yet, but will be my next project. After running some rough numbesr compared to a good front sub, rear setup, and everything else that the AME chassis take care of for you, it's still probably a little more expensive, but would speed up the build process tremendously in my mind.

The told me in the ballpark of $12K for a roller with the basic brake package. This was using AME's front suspension, not Corvette, due to the narrow width of the Chevy II. I'm not sure, but I think WD uses narrowed Corvette geometry and a rack and pinion from a different application (Mustang maybe). Someone that know more about his product could verify this.

Just my $.02 on the subject.

If I can save enough $$$ I'll probably end up with a Max G at some point.

Thanks,

Brandon

[JohnnyR]

How does narrowing the front of a C5-based front end affect the geometry? Does it minimize the benefits of going C5 versus the Art Morrison IFS set up? This is assuming that the C5 is a better front end.

-j

[novanutcase]

You and I are thinking alike in the type of car that we are looking for although I am not looking to have such a high horsepower type of car. I'll probably just drop in a stock crate LS2. I MAY lay a supercharger on top of it but not sure yet so with that in mind what do you think would be the most cost effective yet trickest setup for this type of HP? I think I'm going to use a T-56 for the trans but I am still undecided as far as rear end options. Right now it looks like either truck arm or IRS. What do you think? :thumbsup: :hail:

[novanutcase]

In reference to your ride height, are you planning to run this on the street at all? If you are it seems like you'll have a hell of a time getting around normal roads(as opposed to a race track) as far as irregularities in road surfaces. My idea is to have an everyday driver that can smoke Bimmers and Posches in the turns.

[novanutcase]

I notice your in La Habra Hts. I live in L.A. Think it would be too much to ask if we could get a face to face? I would love to see where your car is at and listen to your suggestions. :bow:

[JohnnyR]

Right now it looks like either truck arm or IRS. What do you think? :thumbsup: :hail:

Well Mr. Nutcase, if you're going to go the full-frame route via Wayne Due or Art Morrison, you don't need to settle for the Truck Arm. You have your choice of 4-link, 4-bar, or IRS.

So, the question is, which set-up is best for a g-machine?

-j

[Sinco]

I notice your in La Habra Hts. I live in L.A. Think it would be too much to ask if we could get a face to face? I would love to see where your car is at and listen to your suggestions. :bow:

Just pm me and we can hook up. My car is at my shop in LaHabra. At this point we can discuss are your questions.

Regards Doug

[wiedemab]

I'm not positive that WD narrow the front, but I thought I read that somewhere. I thought someone else may be able chime in on that one?

As long as the inner and outer tie-rod pickup points remain the same relative to the control arm pickup points the geometric characteristics of the suspension could remain unchanged even when narrowed.

Again, I'm not positive that he is narrowing it, but the Vettes are pretty wide compared to a Chevy II.

[Sinco]

I'm not positive that WD narrow the front, but I thought I read that somewhere. I thought someone else may be able chime in on that one?

As long as the inner and outer tie-rod pickup points remain the same relative to the control arm pickup points the geometric characteristics of the suspension could remain unchanged even when narrowed.

Again, I'm not positive that he is narrowing it, but the Vettes are pretty wide compared to a Chevy II.

Like I stated in an earlier post the front hub to hub needs to be narrowed to fit under the front end of the nova and run the C5 control arms. In doing this the rack needed to be raised but other than that everything else works good.

[novanutcase]

John Parsons has said that to just narrow the C-5 will throw the geometry off. Did Wayne reconfigure it with different attach points? Did this also change the mount points for the motor in terms of height?

[Sinco]

John Parsons has said that to just narrow the C-5 will throw the geometry off. Did Wayne reconfigure it with different attach points? Did this also change the mount points for the motor in terms of height?

I don't know all the details that Wayne did. I'm sure he just did'nt pull the hubs in and call it a day. That's why I had him do the job because he knew where to put things so everything would work correctly. Trust me after studying JPs pics he definately knows a thing or two about suspension geometry. I know we did have to raise the rack. We are going to set the engine back anyways so that shouldn't be a problem. I haven't mocked up the engine yet, when I do I'll post some pics.

[novanutcase]

sin, in raising the rack did this influence your moving the motor back to clear the rack or was it purely for better balance throughout? Since I am thinking seriously of having Wayne do a similar frame for me I need to know since this is probably not an option I want to do.

[TravisB]

sin, in raising the rack did this influence your moving the motor back to clear the rack or was it purely for better balance throughout? Since I am thinking seriously of having Wayne do a similar frame for me I need to know since this is probably not an option I want to do.


he probably had to raise the rack...sinco(doug)is moving the engine back to get wieght off the front end...in fact I think he has a couple more ideas for getting weight off the front end :_paranoid

[wiedemab]

Just revisiting an old thread.

I wasn't implying that WD was just pulling the hubs in and calling it a day. I was just stating that relative to each side of the front suspension, if the inner and outer pickup points for the control arms and inner and outer tie rod positions do not change relative to one another (in 3D space), characteristics like bumpsteer, camber gain, caster gain etc. would not change.

Looking at the whole front suspension - Ackerman would change because the radius by which the inner and outer wheel follow in a turn would change due to the distance between the wheels changing.

Narrowing the Vette suspension would require that the Corvette rack be modified or a different rack be used. I thought I read somewhere that WD was incorporating a Mustang R&P into his design.

Anyway, I'm far from a suspension expert. Both Wayne Due and John Parsons (as well as many other people) know more about suspension geometry than I ever will, so if I'm wrong, please correct me, but I think my statements are accurate.

Later,

Brandon