Relay with Aeromotive A1000 pump ?

[DRJDVM's '69]

I'm planning out my supercharged 406 with a RWHP goal of around 600 HP at around 12 lbs boost.

I have a Ricks Hot Rod tank with the in tank Aeromotive A1000 pump. The car is completely rewired with a American Autowire universal 18 circuit system so the wires are in perfect condition, new alternator etc..

So... should I run a relay back by the tank/pump to make sure I get a constant 13.5 V to the pump so it has every bit of juice needed to reach its potential fuel output ??? Obviously if I mount it by the tank, weather resistance is a factor (although my car never sees rain).

Any suggestions ????

[Speedster]

If you are not using the pump controller (PN 16302) Aeromotive says you must run a relay to ensure constant pump voltage. Your EFI will thank you.:yes:

[DRJDVM's '69]

I'm actually going carbed... at least for now......

[Speedster]

Carbs are not as sensitive.
The pump (and fuel) will get warm without the controller though.
If you cruise for more than 30 minutes the tech guys at Aeromotive said you should really use the controller. If not, you will need a huge return line, since the pump is running all out all the time and the A1000 flows a boatload of fuel at low pressures.

[DRJDVM's '69]

I'm gonna be running a 10 AN supply and an 8 AN return as Aeromotive suggested.

[Speedster]

Sounds like you have it covered. A hint they gave me that you can do if you are running a voltmeter gauge, is to hook it up to the Fuel Pump terminals.

[Blown353]

Definately run a relay. A Bosch 30 amp will do nicely and are under $5. Run 8 gauge (minimum) wire back to the pump to minimize voltage loss, and pull the power from a source capable of flowing enough current (i.e. pull from the back of the alternator or battery or where ever your main distribution block is, and don't forget a fuse.) Stick the relay in the trunk where it is easy to swap out in the future. If you want to put it under the car, you can get a weatherproof relay and weatherproof connector from Hella.

Also, -10 on the feed line is way overkill, -8 (1/2") will be more than adequate. -10 or -12 on the suction side of the the pump is a very good idea but once you're out of the pump -8 will be more than enough. Since you're carbed make sure you run the same diameter return line as well so you can get the pressure down low enough. Don't forget all the usual tips: avoid restrictive 90 degree pipe fittings (use the swept tube AN connectors instead), route away from heat and where not possible use heat shields and insulating wrap, etc.

I would also suggest going with the pump speed controller right off the bat to avoid any potential issues. Being stuck on the side of the road because of vapor lock really bites.

When I was running my setup carb'd with an SX pump (flowrates similar to the A1000) I never had a vapor lock issue even on hot summer days. Your mileage may vary though, as evidence points to the Aeromotive A1000 being rather prone to vapor lock.

You can also install a fuel cooler on the return line after the regulator for extra insurance.

Troy

[rwhite692]

Yep...what Troy said.

[DRJDVM's '69]

I based my supply and return lines on what Aeromotive suggested on their website. They have diagrams for all their pump and regulator combos and for EFI vs carb etc. They recommend the 10 AN supply and 8 AN return.

I figured it would better to be slightly oversized than undersized when it comes to fuel delivery. I was planning on using a fuel cooler on the return side, but wanted to hold off on the controller for now at least. I may go EFI in the future too.

I contacted Americam Autowire and they suggested I have the relay near the electrical supply... ie. not way back by the pump. My trunk is all boxed in with my stereo stuff etc, so thats why I was considering mounting it under the car rather than in it..

I rewired my entire car with an American Autowire universal 18 circuit system so it already has a supply off the fuse box for an electric fuel pump etc.

[Blown353]

Believe me, you can skip the -10 line from the pump to the carb and save a few bucks and also probably avoid some routing issues. A -8 hose (1/2" line) will support more power than you intend to make and also flow more fuel than the pump can deliver even at freeflow, I think Aeromotive was just being extra cautious. Jody made ~1200hp using a -8 feed line on his yellow Camaro.

While -8 is fine on the pressure side of the pump be sure you use -10 line minimum on the suction side of the pump.

If you skip the controller and run a good cooler I think you'll have zero issues. I don't have a cooler installed (yet) and haven't had a problem (yet) but plan to add one sometime soon.

It's also not a problem routing the relay near the power source, in fact, it's a bit safer as the wire "downwind" of the relay isn't energized when the relay is off. I'd just mount it where it can be easily accessed in the event it fails.

Troy

[DRJDVM's '69]

My tank is Ricks Hot Rod stealth tank, so the inlet side of the pump is all done already. The AN fitting on the tank are 10 AN and 8 AN... I'm sure I can get a "step down" adapter to go from 10 AN to 8 AN for the line.

The cost for 10 AN vs 8 AN line and fitting wont really amount to much....

[Blown353]

If the tank already has a -10 out, might as well stick with it. Won't hurt anything.

The other thing you could do is run -10 from the tank to your fine-mesh filter, and run -8 from the filter out.

Rick sets up his tanks with an pre-pump filter, right? (should be 100 micron.) You'll want to install a 10 micron filter after the pump.

Troy

[DRJDVM's '69]

Thanks Troy
Yes the tank does have a pre- pump filter and I was planning on running another filter closer to the carb.

The other debate I was having....... running hard lines from the tank to the engine compartment vs. braided hose...

I would prefer to run hard lines, but I cant bend or flare worth a damn ( I tried with some of my brake lines) plus I dont own the right tools to do it well..... Inline Tube can make me lines but in the end it will probably cost me more......plus that set-up will end up with more connections so it has potential for leaks etc. More connections also equal more fitting= more $$

[Payton King]

I have a Rick's tank as well. Run it like Troy said. With the kit that Aeromotive put together for the LS1 (though summit) from the Tank to the 10 micron filter is a 10. Out the other side they reduce it to an 8 and run it all the way to the front. They supplied a 6 for a return and I will need an adapter to connect the 6 to the 8 on the tank.

From a number of sources I have heard that if you run the braided line for the entire system you will get a gas smell that permeates the lines...something about pump gas as race gas does not do this. Try and use as much hard line as possible to cut down on the smell.

Remember if you use stainless hard line it takes a 37.5 single flair...and it is hard to work with so you may want to mock it up with steel first to make a pattern.

[Blown353]

Braided hose will work but keep in mind the liner is rubber and will rot out over enough time, and since you can't see it because of the braid you almost have to wait for a leak! Thus, I like running as much hardline as possible, either stainless or aluminum-- eliminates the amount of hose in the system.

Flaring for AN is easy; it's a 37.5 degree single flare, MUCH easier than the typical 45 degree double flare on brakelines. Rigid makes a very good tool that will do both stainless and aluminum very easily. Get the appropriate AN tube sleeves and nuts and have at it. Either get aluminum tubing or annealed stainless tubing.

As far as bending, I also like the Rigid benders.

Concerning the braided line "stinking'-- this does happen. Some brands are better than others. I use all XRP stuff and find it to be much less "stinky" than Earls or Aeroquip.

Troy

[crazy1969]

Sorry for what i going to say but i stand 100% by this remark ALL U GUYS running carbs need help. This is the year 2006 not 1950s its E.F.I or D.F.I you will love the differance trust me on this .My old car was 1968 camaro 409 carb i tough it was quick then i went fuel injected WOW thats all i have to say SORRY

[DRJDVM's '69]

Crazy1969........

No one is going to deny that in some ways EFI is better..... the big difference is $$$$$$$

Theres nothing wrong with carbs and its been documented on many occasions that EFI doesnt offer any more power than a properly built and tuned carb. Yes EFI has better throttle response, MPG and driveability but that all comes at a pretty high cost....

I can't afford to go EFI right now. or I would be....

[67ragtp]

Well said Ned, Im setting up the same system, when the funds are available to convert to FI a regulator change is all that will be needed. If fuel Injection is ever going to become as popular/and widely used as a square bore holley, the price has to come down. I just dont get it, are we still paying for the developement cost of a little electronic box. Im done b****in.

Rich