71 nova front suspension setup advice

[MC71Nova]

I'm considering a CPP disc brake conversion with 2" drop spindles and a tall lower balljoint conversion. It's my understanding the brake conversion pushes the rim out about .20" from the stock drum facing. This would be mated to an 18 x 7 inch front rim with 4.5 inch backspace and a 235 tire (American Racing CL 205's). Any experts out there who can tell me if this has a more than likely chance of interference with outer fender lip or fenderwell? Would it be possible to go even lower... say 3" from stock? I know "stock" varies car to car but this appears to be stock original springs and all original suspension. With the current 215/70r15 tire, the bottom edge of the highest part of the front fender lip is above the top of the tire when viewed level from the side. This needs to be remedied!

My only experience with lowering was way back in the day on a '72 Nova with severely chopped springs and stock parts and a 185/70R14 tire on a cragar rim. That bad boy left only about 2" Xmember clearance and no rubbing but the rim/tire combo was tiny by today's standards! Looked really cool though... I love that slammed look. Thanks!

[realcoray]

I'm considering a CPP disc brake conversion with 2" drop spindles and a tall lower balljoint conversion. It's my understanding the brake conversion pushes the rim out about .20" from the stock drum facing. This would be mated to an 18 x 7 inch front rim with 4.5 inch backspace and a 235 tire (American Racing CL 205's). Any experts out there who can tell me if this has a more than likely chance of interference with outer fender lip or fenderwell? Would it be possible to go even lower... say 3" from stock? I know "stock" varies car to car but this appears to be stock original springs and all original suspension. With the current 215/70r15 tire, the bottom edge of the highest part of the front fender lip is above the top of the tire when viewed level from the side. This needs to be remedied!



Pretty much everyone here will tell you to avoid the drop spindles and go with drop springs. There are various issues with the spindles.

[strtlegal]

I've had it all on my car..The dropped spindles are the worst thing you can do as far as geometery wise..As your wheel moves up the tie rod placement technically moves down. I know CPP clears a little better then other drop spindle manufactures. I think you should be okay with that combo. I run a 18x8 (5"bsp) with a 245/40 and my car is about 3-3.5 drop..I've switched around so much I dont remember. I think im about 23" from ground to the fender lip..

My trick is I run a degree of negative camber to clear the fenders.

My car consists of ATS/Speedtech spindles, Speedtech arms running 12way adjustable shocks and a Hellwig bar. Works great and the only rubbing I get is if I have a passenger it rubs a tad at the back of the liner from running alot of caster...

My car honsitly looks exactly like Speedtechs Nova...My car was done first though:lol:

[MC71Nova]

strtlegal - so are your ATS/Speedtech spindles drop spindles? Not quite sure from your message. Those are pricey high-end spindles, aren't they?

My other thought was to go with the Hotchkis TVS front and rear 2" drop including the front sway bar with a CPP standard disc conversion and the tall spindle. Same wheels and tires. I'm trying to stay somewhat reasonable in price here. There is a hotrod shop here in my town that will do a front end only CPP disc conversion all included with new master cylinder, hoses and everything out the door for $1200. I'm thinking about handing them the Hotchkis springs and shocks and tall balljoints and having them do that since they have to take apart the spindles anyway and then just installing the sway bar and rear springs and shocks myself. Would that work, do you think in terms of getting me better handling and stopping without rubbing? Also, do you know if it's possible to keep the rear drums with the new CPP master cylinder until I get around to buying a complete posi new rear end with discs? I'm not looking to track this car, just improve handling and stopping over stock and get the right stance for now.

[MC71Nova]

Correction... in the message above I meant to say, go with the Hotchkis TVS front and rear 2" drop including the front sway bar with a CPP standard disc conversion and the standard (not drop) spindle. :rolleyes:

[Blake Foster]

My car honsitly looks exactly like Speedtechs Nova...My car was done first though:lol:


:rofl: :rofl: :rofl:

the ATS Spindle actually has 7/8" drop over the stock spindle but all the geometry has been optimized and is probably the best modification you can make on the front of these cars.

[MC71Nova]

Don't get me wrong, I'd love to have the ATS spindles because they look awesome. But $1100... yikes.

[lhkustoms]

the CPP disc kit coupled with a hotchkis tvs kit will work great and We offer a tall NON DROP spindle which will let the springs bring the car down and you can get the improved geometry of the tall spindle and we are having a 15% off sale right now on all of our products. The spindle sale price $637.50 with free shipping. http://www.lateral-g.net/forums/showthread.php4?t=29768

[strtlegal]

:rofl: :rofl: :rofl:

the ATS Spindle actually has 7/8" drop over the stock spindle but all the geometry has been optimized and is probably the best modification you can make on the front of these cars.

:hail: :hail:

You need some sort of drop because the Nova for my taste just doesnt drop down enough with Hotchkis springs..Personally I think spindles are a must. I've been through the dropped spindle phase and the car just felt disconnected..Yes it isn't cheap, but neither is doing twice. Trust me once you get a taste of what this bolt on stuff can do your old going to want more.

However look around you may like the way the Hotchkis springs look...

[MC71Nova]

This is the car I'm trying to duplicate in terms of stance. I've got the exact same wheels (to the extent I can tell from the photo... I've got 18" American Racing CL205's) It looks to me like I need to drop the rear at least 1 or 2 inches and the front 2 to 3. BTW... anyone know this car?? I'd love to get this car's setup! :hail:

[strtlegal]

My car sits just like that maybe a tad lower in the front and my rear I adjusted up..I dont like the look of it being lower in the back.

Your not going to be able to go any lower then that unless you ditch the fender liners and run steering stops on your control arms. I cut mine in the center to clear my tires at full bump.

[LS1NOVA]

I agree with Strlegal, you need the Speedtech spindles in order to get the front low enough on these cars while retaining good geometry. When they are lowered too much using just springs the lower ball joint pivot gets higher than the lower control arm inner pivot point. This is bad. The almost 1" drop the Speedtech spindle offers is perfect.
If I was to redo mine, I would add these.

Im using SC&C's stage 2 plus. I works really well and I am very pleased with the auto x results. Im using a 17x8 with 5" BS. Using a 7" wide wheel you will have some extra room to avoid rubbing.

Whatever you do, use a system that improves over the stock geometry such as Speedtech, Sc&C. Slapping on some dropped spindles and arms from XX company does not always offer much for improvement besides looks and wow factor.

[MC71Nova]

The SC&C stage 2 kit looks very interesting. A few questions. I don't see an X-Body kit.. did you use the Camaro '67 - '69 kit? Would that work for a '71 Nova? if you retain the stock lower control arms, is the tall lower balljoint a press-in or a bolt-in thing? Is that $816 price for both sides? It seems like this would get me much better camber adjustment and geometry, even if I use a stock height spindle. If I do that, what is the best way to lower the car 2" - 3"... springs only? Do the balljoints affect ride height? Would cut stock springs be better or lowered springs like a Hotchkis 2" lowering spring?

[strtlegal]

Yes before I met Blake I used to deal with Marcus @ ScandC alot...That guy has probably forgotten more about suspension then any of us would ever know...

Yes you can use your stock spindles with a tall ball joint and I think you will need to do a Gulstrand mod as well.. You can also buy his lower arms that move the spring down further in the bucket allowing a sort of drop. Because you still want to get it lower...You could buy DSE springs and use the rest of his stuff.. It is a great option

[lhkustoms]

The SC&C stage 2 kit looks very interesting. A few questions. I don't see an X-Body kit.. did you use the Camaro '67 - '69 kit? Would that work for a '71 Nova? if you retain the stock lower control arms, is the tall lower balljoint a press-in or a bolt-in thing? Is that $816 price for both sides? It seems like this would get me much better camber adjustment and geometry, even if I use a stock height spindle. If I do that, what is the best way to lower the car 2" - 3"... springs only? Do the balljoints affect ride height? Would cut stock springs be better or lowered springs like a Hotchkis 2" lowering spring?

The 67-69 F body and 68-74 X body use all the same components. In your application you will not use a "tall lower bj". Using it would move the steering arm up and it needs to be moved down to reduce bumpsteer. the best way to lower your car is using 2-3" drop springs. You want to lower it to where the balljoint pivot is level with the inner lca pivot. I would use 2" drop springs to start and cut the spring if necessary to achieve the desired height. The tall upper bj will improve the camber gain about 60% of what a tall spindle like our Pro Billet spindles or the ATS spindles negative camber gain will produce over stock spindle geometry. The benefit of using our Pro Billet spindles is that you can use stock style disc brakes and wheels until your ready to upgrade or the budget allows. Install them get an alignment and your back driving again. Unlike our Pro Billet spindles If using the ATS spindle you will need to upgrade to 13" brakes and minimum of 17" wheels before you get back on the road.

The SC&C street comp 2 package is a great improvement over stock and Marc does offer them as an option with our Pro Billet Z/28 style geometry corrected steering arms instead of the tall outer tie rod. You get reduced bumpsteer as well as a quicker steering ratio and better wheel clearance.

[MC71Nova]

Wow! :hail: All excellent advice and you've all given me much to think about. I just need to decide now how hard I intend to drive it and how much the budget will allow. I've heard guys say over and over that a DSE subframe (or another AM subframe) is the way to go from day one as you'll just end up there eventually and spend 2x the money in the meantime getting there. I can see the logic but I simply can't justify $8 - $10K in front end/brakes/subframe right now, especially in this economy. I'll have to mull it over and go from there but I apppreciate all of the excellent advice. Obvously lots and lots of great, experienced folks here! :thumbsup:

[strtlegal]

I was saying using a taller upper ball joint with an SPC arm will be a nice improvement..This is why I also mentioned you needing the Guldstrand mod. The stock spindles are your limiting factor however this package is a nice upgrade. But if you can save some money to it right the first time..

A front clip is not necessary but it does haves it's finer quality's..