Engine fires then dies

[AM.MSCL]

I drove the car (69 Pontiac Firebird w 400 and 4 speed manual trans) over to the A/C place yesterday morning and no issues with the car. Temps ran about 210 degrees going over there. Got the A/C charged and working. Drove the car home with A/C on and 100 degrees out side. Water Temp needle sitting on the mark between 210 and 250. Car shut off with no issue and never had any issue on way home. I got home around 5pm last night; this morning going to work (another car) the garage smells like hot car and a hint of fuel (guessing the fuel boiled in the bowls of the carb). Then today at 3pm I swap out the T-stat from 195 to 160 and fill the rad up again. Put a new rad cap on the car also.
Try to start the car and it just spins till battery drains. I put the battery charger on it and pull the air filter. Check and make sure fuel is squirting into the engine and it is.
I try to start the car and it fires and immediately dies.
I have new spark plugs waiting to go into the car so I go ahead and swap them out.
Try to start the car and it fires like it is going to start and then dies.
Leave the charger on it for an hour.
Go out and attempt to start the car again and it starts and struggles for idle (maybe 5 seconds) and dies again.

During all of this I check oil level on dip stick and for water in oil – everything ok.
Water in Radiator is full.

Anyone have any ideas of what to look at now? Or just wait till morning to see what happens?
Thanks
Ray

[ma73z]

Hey Ray, sorry to hear about your troubles, can you give us more info on your car (ignition,fuel sys., etc.) have you done any work on it since you drove it last?

[GregWeld]

Fuel - AIR - Spark

Sounds like you have spark and fuel. How long does it run? As in fires and dies or does it actually start - and you release the key and she's still running only dies immediately?

Instead of cranking the poor thing til you kill the battery - which is also hard on the starter motor.... try using starting fluid --- a small squirt and you'll fire right off. Any time I'm having problems with starting a car - I use the starter fluid.

You coil standing up or laying down? Is it the old round style? Sounds like things got fairly warm in there... and maybe you cooked the coil. Which is why I was asking about it actually running -- or just trying the catch. The ignition key will allow 12 volts to pass to the plugs -- giving you a false hope... but if you let off the key to the run position there's no spark from the coil. I just went through this and it took me 3 days to figure it out. I was chasing a fuel issue -- thinking I had spark.

If it's actually starting and runs momentarily after you allow the key to go back to "run" position -- have you tried cranking your idle up a bit - to see if she'll run at a higher idle speed? That would allow you to try to do some more diagnoses...

Try starting it -- and when it doesn't start - immediately pull a plug -- see if it's wet -- indicating a flooding condition.

[AM.MSCL]

Will late last night it started right up. I have not tried this morning yet.

It has all MSD igintion coil and dist.
It was running great for 3 days in a row and then we charged the A/C since it was a brand new Vintage air system.

[GregWeld]

Well.... that's a good sign.

I was looking for what might have gotten "heat soaked" and then was breaking down. A coil could do that. Carb can as you know. Starter motors can get real cranky (pun) when hot.

I'd go around and check ALL your electrical connections... coil - starter motor etc because HEAT can cause unusually high resistance. And this would be a "just to be sure" measure.

Also -- given the high heat where you live.... do you have a phenolic spacer under the carb? :cheers: