Help with Mirrors

[bearcat]

I'm putting these mirrors on a 69 Camaro. I want to replace the glass, but I don't know (cannot remember) if they are Gen 2 mirrors or from a 71-72 ish Chevelle. Any Help? Also not sure if there is a difference in the glass size between the two.

Any gotchas for putting these on a 69 camaro?

Thanks for the help!

[70rs]

They sure look like second gen mirrors. But without seeing them side by side I can't tell you for sure. Try posting that pic on Nastyz28 and you should have a definite answer in a minute or two. LOL! As for the glass size and a Chevelle mirror, try looking up the part numbers or fitment descriptions in the aftermarket sites (Yearone, Classic Industries, NPD,...) there should be info there that will get you on your way. Good luck with it.

have any pictures of the car they are going on?

[bearcat]

Here is the other if that helps along with a couple of pics of the car. Thanks for the help.

Eric

[67ragtp]

They look like second gen chevelle since they have the stud mounting. Check with Dorman or ppg replacement glass for the replacement mirrors.

Rich

[speedshftr]

sweet car/really looks sharp:thumbsup:

[70rs]

Here is the other if that helps along with a couple of pics of the car. Thanks for the help.

Eric

Nice looking camaro you have. I like that two tone job. Not many look good to me with it but yours looks great. Nice job.

[osdmike]

You will find the "Bullet" style mirrors on many different models of Olds/Pontiac/Buick/Chevy 1970-75.
I´m not sure if the glass differs.
But the length and the angle of the stem varies.(see pic)
I used a piece of aluminum to get the right angle.

Your car looks great !!! :thumbsup:

[bearcat]

Nice looking camaro you have. I like that two tone job. Not many look good to me with it but yours looks great. Nice job.

Yeah, I went back and forth a thousand time about the 2 tone. I'm very happy I went with it. The pictures don't do it justice.

[MODO Innovations]

Measure the glass, the tallest height X length ( it is measured diagonally ).

If the glass is 2 7/8" X 5 1/4" it is 2nd gen Camaro, if it 3 1/4" X 5 3/8" it is from a Chevelle.

[bearcat]

Measure the glass, the tallest height X length ( it is measured diagonally ).

If the glass is 2 7/8" X 5 1/4" it is 2nd gen Camaro, if it 3 1/4" X 5 3/8" it is from a Chevelle.

Thanks Shannon, looks like Chevelle. I had 3 1/4 X 5 1/2. I'll double check. Any gotchas mounting these on a 69 Camaro?

Thanks!

[bearcat]

Hey Mike, were those Chevelle mirrors? I'm wondering how mine are going to turn out without the billet piece you put in there.

I'm fairly certain they are Chevelle....

[IndyNova]

very nice looking camaro, I absolutley love the blue/silver 2 tone! :thumbsup:

[osdmike]

I was told that My mirrors were Camaro 1970-81, but I don´t think they are.
The stem seem to be longer.
I´d like to get the shorter ones.

Check this site!
Scroll down and compare different mirror stems.

http://images.google.com/imgres?imgurl=http://images.sabob.com/products/images/1/Corvette_Vette_Stingray_C3_Sport_Bullet_Mirrors_NI CE.jpeg&imgrefurl=http://www.sabob.com/Products/Corvette_Vette_Stingray_C3_Sport_Bullet_Mirrors_NI CE.html&usg=__El6q9ZCZQ2DLUCLp-nQzT2ruvCw=&h=376&w=500&sz=32&hl=en&start=36&sig2=bjeDf-lhYnACpV-5b60MXw&um=1&tbnid=f72JHslveJZGWM:&tbnh=98&tbnw=130&prev=/images%3Fq%3DBULLET%2BMIRROR%26ndsp%3D18%26hl%3Den %26rlz%3D1I7GGLJ_sv%26sa%3DN%26start%3D18%26um%3D1&ei=wtpgS7m-M4Pt-AawvuTKDA

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Also notice that some gaskets has different angles, depending on different vehicle types!!!

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[osdmike]

Another one !!!!
http://bulletmirror.com/


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[MODO Innovations]

Most of the 2nd gen Camaro mirrors don't have the studs sticking out of the stem. They have a screw in the glass side of the stem that uses a bracket that attaches to the door and the screw goes thru it to bolt it to the bracket. I said most, I think some of the very early 2nd gens used a stem from another car. I have one set that has short stems (same height as a normal 2nd gen) with studs but the glass is larger like the Chevelle mirrors. I think these mirrors are originally for a 70-72 Chevelle, but I'm not positive.

I have done a bunch of research on these but I am by no means an expert. The more desirable one's, from what I have seen are from the 73-77 Chevelle. These can be easily recognized by the adjustment actuator (the part that mounts in the door panel). The actuators are at a 90 degree angle, usually with a black knob and a white plastic piece where the cables attach.

The 74-87 GM cars with these mirrors have the larger glass but the stem is also taller and at a more agressive angle. These are plentiful.

As far as installing either of these on a 69...it all depends on the placement on the door. The stems with studs will be more challenging than the stems without studs. On the stemmed versions you have to decide your placement, drill the holes and then massage to fit. Just take your time on fitting them. Some trimming of the stem is required to make sure that you get the angle of the bullet part level...I know leveling a radius doesn't make since.lol I mean you want to try and make the ellpise's smaller radii on the edges set at the same level or as much as possible. You will be the final judge on this.
I hope this helps, but again I am no expert. Just my $.02.

[bearcat]

one other question. Does anyone know the size of the base of the mirror that mounts to the door? I have holes pre drilled. Just in case I don't like the look of these mirrors, I hope the original will cover the holes.

Thanks,

[70rs]

Another one !!!!
http://bulletmirror.com/


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Thanks for the link. Now I don't have to try and piece together a kit for my car. Or spend any time restoring junk.:thumbsup:

[NOT A TA]

I've been watching this thread to see where it lead. I've been messing with these mirrors for years and also have a few sets here to measure. I have not worked on the Chevelle mirrors, just the F body and G body ones.

All of the early 2nd gen F bodys I've owned or worked on came stock with the ones which have the bracket that screws to the door. This type is easily recognized by the chrome screw that can be seen on the rear of the stem where it is held to the bracket. The sheet metal screws that hold the bracket to the door have a 2" bolt pattern. All the early 2nd gens I've worked on had this type. The design sucks. They use a couple of sheetmetal screws to hold the bracket in place and sandwich the plastic "gasket" which holds it in place.
The problems are that,

1. The rear end of the bracket bends easily. Someone leaning on the mirror once pretty much ruins it. Once bent the mirror wiggles. No amount of trying to push it back without taking the mirror off and straightening the bracket will cure it.

2. The sheetmetal screws that hold the bracket/gasket to the door get stripped by people who thought they were going to fix the loose mirror by removing the mirror and tightening whatever they found (the sheetmetal screws) not realizing the bracket is bent enough to make the mirror wobble but not enough to be noticable to the average inexperienced guy.

3. If the mirror wobbles for an extended period of time it makes a groove in the bottom of the gasket and tightening or replacing/rebending the bracket will still not cure the wobble enough to make the mirror feel solid.

It's been my experience that the ones held on by studs are MUCH more solidly held to the car. They have a wider bolt pattern (3 1/16 C to C on the G body one I'm measuring), and are secured with flanged locking nuts from the inside of the door thereby sandwiching the reinforced sheetmetal.

Tips I've learned.
1. The studs can be removed to aid in positioning the mirrors on a car which didn't have them stock. Just lock two nuts together on the stud and remove the stud.
2. There are gaskets of varying thicknesses and angles that were used on different cars. I've actually found that a better mirror alignment can be accomplished using thicker gaskets and sanding them off on the paint side to achieve the best mirror position on early 2nd gens, particularly on the passenger side.
3. If someone stripped the screws that hold the stem to the head (there's a cast aluminum piece inside the mirror itself is mounted to) self tapping screws can usually be used to attach the stem to the head.
4. 2ng gens windows tilt in quite a bit. When installing 2nd gen mirrors on vehicles with door windows more upright than a 2nd gen the mirrors with the longer stems aid in moving the mirrors out far enough to look correct. I have not installed bullet mirrors on a first gen but the 2nd gen stems may bring the mirror in too far toward the glass.
5. It's a personal thing but I don't like the writing on the passenger glass so when there's an option I use the ones without the writing.
6. Be sure to get the mirror positioned EXACTLY where you want it before tightening it up. I've straightened out crooked mirrors for people only to be disappointed that a mark can be seen in the paint afterward because the mirrors were installed on "soft" paint.

Shown below is a early 2nd gen mirror next to the yellow G body mirror.

http://i240.photobucket.com/albums/ff292/NOTATA/81%20Malibu/81Malibu115.jpg

http://i240.photobucket.com/albums/ff292/NOTATA/81%20Malibu/81Malibu114.jpg

[bearcat]

Good info. I'm not sure what the heck type of mirrors that I have. I think they may be C3 mirrors.

[WSSix]

They could be late C3 mirrors like you mentioned. I'm not sure at all though how to tell. Are they electrical or are those just the adjusting cables coming out the bottom of the driver's side?

[bearcat]

Nope not electric