New Full Quarter or Patch Panels?

[Ron Fox]

Which is the best way to go, New Full Quarter with Sail or Patch Panels?

There is a big pitted area on the quarter where it meets the window. There is a small dent close to the small window on the side, and rust has eaten away the some of the area around the wheel and lower part of the back quarter. (All of this is on the drivers side quarter)

The passenger side quarter has very little pitting close to the window but has the same rust issues like driver's side.

I thought about putting a Full Quarter on the driver's side but patching the passenger's side.

Also, I am going to need a full truck pan so using a Full Quarter would give me the opportunity to put a complete full truck in without cutting it into.

Everyone's thoughts?

Thanks.

[ItDoRun]

Full quarters all the way! Especially if you're doing a full 1-piece trunk pan.

[Ron Fox]

Both sides?

The drivers side is worse than the passenger.

[70rs]

Full quarters both sides. But it is also the most expensive way to go. You will have a better base to build on though.

[Mrfixit]

Been there, done that. :willy:

Quarters
Rockers
Outer wheelhouse
trunk drop off
trunk floor
Shock towers?
Inner Wheel house
Floorboards?

Check the roof carefully when you remove the quarters.

[ItDoRun]

Both sides?

The drivers side is worse than the passenger.

:yes:

[ItDoRun]

When my dad and I first resored my car about 20 years ago, I didn't have a lot of money, so I opted to do patch panels. About 6 months later, the weld seams started showing through. Do the full quarters and don't look back. You'll be rust free and glad you did afterwards.

[redfire69]

Quarters both sides. Careful, original quarters are usually welded to the inner structure *under* the roof panel too. Alot of fun! Nice project, BTW.

[Ron Fox]

I am having my car built. I am a rookie when it comes to cars but I have been reading, watching tv, going to shows and talking to everyone about the correct way or ways to restore a car (with mods). I finally realized that there are so many different ways to build a car (color, mods, details, wheels,etc.) that sometimes it is difficult to choose a direction.

I have heard some people say to keep all the original metal on a car if all possible.

ItDoRun, did you use a butt weld on your patches?

Mrfixit, you mentioned to check the roof carefully. Please explain more.

Are the Full Quarters difficult to line up? Has anyone had problems?

I am also putting in a new full floor. I could patch it but I think it will look cleaner and I will be happy once it is in.

Thanks everyone for the information. This site and everyone in here makes a world of difference.

[Bow Tie 67]

The roof can have severe rust under the window trim. I ended up going with a new roof and full quarters. When it comes to original sheet metal dont sweat it that is for people who own rare orginal muscle cars. I'm assuming you will modifying your car since your on this site, so orginality takes a back seat.

[Ron Fox]

My '69 Firebird is not a rare car. It's only a 4-speed air car. At first I wanted to go back original and maybe upgrade the heads, carb, etc. But as time has gone by the vision in my mind has change over and over many times. It's difficult with so many options out there. At the moment mini tubs, a 4-link, and putting the original engine aside is part of my vision. I bought my Firebird when I was 15 years old (and that was 27+ years ago). I figured that I should build it the way I want since I have no plans on selling it.

The main issue at the moment is getting the body work properly corrected (with all rust eliminated) and to get a very straight car.

Is there an inner structure in the roof that would hold rust? What is everyone's thoughts on my top part of the window (see photo)

Thanks.

[ItDoRun]

I am having my car built. I am a rookie when it comes to cars but I have been reading, watching tv, going to shows and talking to everyone about the correct way or ways to restore a car (with mods). I finally realized that there are so many different ways to build a car (color, mods, details, wheels,etc.) that sometimes it is difficult to choose a direction.

I have heard some people say to keep all the original metal on a car if all possible.

ItDoRun, did you use a butt weld on your patches?

Mrfixit, you mentioned to check the roof carefully. Please explain more.

Are the Full Quarters difficult to line up? Has anyone had problems?

I am also putting in a new full floor. I could patch it but I think it will look cleaner and I will be happy once it is in.

Thanks everyone for the information. This site and everyone in here makes a world of difference.

Yes, we used butt welds on the original patch panels. Please note that I'm not saying you can't patch it and make it look right. A lot of people do. I just think the full quarters eliminate the potential for those areas to reveal themselves later on.

My 68 quarters fit really good. I also helped with the installation of some 69 quarters from Classic Industries and they fit really good as well. Remember you may get two panels that will eat your lunch. Each panel will have it's own areas of concern. Maybe I've been lucky so far.

How much area of the floor will you need to patch? I removed and installed the full floor in about 16 hours by myself (other than having someone help me put it through the windshield and set it in place) including prepping and shooting epoxy primer on the top side. Once again, my floor fit like a glove and I wouldn't even consider a patch panel unless it was a really small area. It's super nice when you lay under the car and see it.

And redfire is right, the quarters are spot welded under the roof skin and will take some time to remove and prep for the new quarter.

Check out my build photos in the link on my signature. I've got plenty of pictures for reference. Mine's a 68, but it's the same basic process.

Chris

[TA219]

I also say go full quarters, on my project I replaced one side with a full qtr and the other side with an 80% panel and in the end, I have spent more time and effort on the 80% side. The full qtr is a little more work up front but much better in the end!

[Ron Fox]

I agree with you Chris that full quarters eliminates any future problems and I am sure I will go that rought on the drivers side but a little voice keeps saying "keep all the original metal intact." I wonder what the percentage of problems have occured with quarter patch panels?

Chris, great build photos. It's amazing to see how you guys take a car down to bare bones and make them look brand new. I like the idea of going to bare bones because it gives an opportunity to get rid of all the rust in deep, difficult area's.

I see you used a full quarter on the drivers side but not on the passenger side. Why?

With my floor the drivers side is the worst (I left the window cracked on hot days). The passenger side is not bad. (See Photos) Both sides could be patched but I do not want any visual signs of patch panels from underneath. I know most people are not going to get on there hands and knees to look under the car but I will know its there. (crazy huh?). Also, I am thinking about painting the underneath of the car Gold.

Was your floor worse than mine?

Thanks everyone.

[Ron Fox]

There is a NOS passenger side full quarter panel on Ebay. How can you tell if it is a real NOS piece? Would it be worth buying or would Classic Industries full quarter be the best way to go?

Thanks.

[J2SpeedandCustom]

What about that drivers side rocker? If it's rusted that bad on the outside and in the wheel well I bet the inner rocker is swiss cheese as well! What does the shop that is building the car recommend?

[Ron Fox]

I actually found an individual who works out of his house and has a nice size shop. It took me almost two years to find someone I could trust and that has experience to back it up. I did my homework on him while looking into around 8 or so references he gave me.

We have studied the car a few times and deceided to go with a full floor and full trunk. Both quarters will need work. He wants to go with a full quarter on the drivers side and patch the passenger side. Both outside rockers will need to be changed. I can see the inner rocker on the drivers side and it seems to look good inside.

I still have issues with the doors and both fenders that I have not mentiones yet. I will start a new thread on both of these. I am sure everyone will say to re-skin both doors. The fenders will need to be patched also.

Any comments about the NOS Full Quarter on Ebay?

Thanks.

[ItDoRun]

I agree with you Chris that full quarters eliminates any future problems and I am sure I will go that rought on the drivers side but a little voice keeps saying "keep all the original metal intact." I wonder what the percentage of problems have occured with quarter patch panels?

Chris, great build photos. It's amazing to see how you guys take a car down to bare bones and make them look brand new. I like the idea of going to bare bones because it gives an opportunity to get rid of all the rust in deep, difficult area's.

I see you used a full quarter on the drivers side but not on the passenger side. Why?

With my floor the drivers side is the worst (I left the window cracked on hot days). The passenger side is not bad. (See Photos) Both sides could be patched but I do not want any visual signs of patch panels from underneath. I know most people are not going to get on there hands and knees to look under the car but I will know its there. (crazy huh?). Also, I am thinking about painting the underneath of the car Gold.

Was your floor worse than mine?

Thanks everyone.

I originally patched the sail panel area on the passenger side and then decided to remove it after I saw what the body man had done to it. To make a long story short, he was taking way too long, so i pulled the car from him and decided to do things myself. Boy, am I glad I did after seeing the patch job on the sail panel. I'm currently in the process of replacing that full quarter. I should have it welded in within the next week or so.

As far as the floor goes, mine was in much better shape than yours, and I still replaced the entire piece. I, like you, didn't want any visual weld seams.

Sounds to me like you'll be replacing the full quarters and full floor! Now, just take the plunge and do it. You won't regret it.

[ItDoRun]

I actually found an individual who works out of his house and has a nice size shop. It took me almost two years to find someone I could trust and that has experience to back it up. I did my homework on him while looking into around 8 or so references he gave me.

We have studied the car a few times and deceided to go with a full floor and full trunk. Both quarters will need work. He wants to go with a full quarter on the drivers side and patch the passenger side. Both outside rockers will need to be changed. I can see the inner rocker on the drivers side and it seems to look good inside.

I still have issues with the doors and both fenders that I have not mentiones yet. I will start a new thread on both of these. I am sure everyone will say to re-skin both doors. The fenders will need to be patched also.

Any comments about the NOS Full Quarter on Ebay?

Thanks.

I wouldn't bother buying a NOS panel. You'll pay way too much for it and it will still need some work to make it fit. Buy the reproduction piece and use the extra money elsewhere on your car. That's just my opinion.

[Ron Fox]

Chris, what color are you painting the underside of your car?

[Ron Fox]

I wouldn't bother buying a NOS panel. You'll pay way too much for it and it will still need some work to make it fit. Buy the reproduction piece and use the extra money elsewhere on your car. That's just my opinion.

He wants $749.00 for the Full Quarter but says "will deal" and gives his email address.

Classic Industries has the Full Quarter for $349.00 or $399.00-I can't remember which.

[ItDoRun]

Chris, what color are you painting the underside of your car?

Low gloss/semi gloss black.

[ItDoRun]

He wants $749.00 for the Full Quarter but says "will deal" and gives his email address.

Classic Industries has the Full Quarter for $349.00 or $399.00-I can't remember which.

At $749, I would question if it's really a true GM quarter. I would expect that quarter to be in the $1200-$1500 range if it was an OEM piece, but who knows. If it is a true GM quarter, that seems like a killer deal.

[Ron Fox]

Low gloss/semi gloss black.

Don't mean to sway from my original question about full quarters but what do you think about painting the underneath the same color as the body? Would it be too risky and too difficult to clean?

What other underside hard materials could be paint body color?

Thanks.

[Ron Fox]

At $749, I would question if it's really a true GM quarter. I would expect that quarter to be in the $1200-$1500 range if it was an OEM piece, but who knows. If it is a true GM quarter, that seems like a killer deal.

I agree that this NOS piece should be higher. I would not want to take a chance. Classic Industries seems to have a great full quarter that GM has its hands on.

Do you know of any other companies with good full quarters with the sail, etc? (Year One)

Thanks.

[ItDoRun]

I agree that this NOS piece should be higher. I would not want to take a chance. Classic Industries seems to have a great full quarter that GM has its hands on.

Do you know of any other companies with good full quarters with the sail, etc? (Year One)

Thanks.

I used CPU Muscle Car Parts.

[redfire69]

What about that drivers side rocker? If it's rusted that bad on the outside and in the wheel well I bet the inner rocker is swiss cheese as well! What does the shop that is building the car recommend?

X2!

If your doing outer rocker and full floor, you might as well do inner rockers as they collect water and debris and rot from the inside out. I ended up cutting the floor away from the inner rocker and replacing the inner and outer rockers as an assembly. After that, I cut away the remaining floor to make way for the one-piece replacement. Of course, adequate bracing needs to be in place. Fun stuff!

[Ron Fox]

X2!

If your doing outer rocker and full floor, you might as well do inner rockers as they collect water and debris and rot from the inside out. I ended up cutting the floor away from the inner rocker and replacing the inner and outer rockers as an assembly. After that, I cut away the remaining floor to make way for the one-piece replacement. Of course, adequate bracing needs to be in place. Fun stuff!

That would probably be the smart thing to do.

New full floor, full trunk, full quarters, both inner and outer rockers, new trunk lid and not to mention the other area's of the car (door skins, etc.) and I will end up with all brand new metal. I just hope in the long run everything lines up straight with decent gaps.

Thanks Ron.

[redfire69]

That would probably be the smart thing to do.

New full floor, full trunk, full quarters, both inner and outer rockers, new trunk lid and not to mention the other area's of the car (door skins, etc.) and I will end up with all brand new metal. I just hope in the long run everything lines up straight with decent gaps.

Thanks Ron.


That's where I'm at. The more you dig, the more you find. It takes alot of fitting before final welding. I think the only external original metal on my car will be the a-pillars...LOL.

[Ron Fox]

That's where I'm at. The more you dig, the more you find. It takes alot of fitting before final welding. I think the only external original metal on my car will be the a-pillars...LOL.

I was hoping to keep more original matal intact but I know in the long run and many years down the road I will be happy I made the right choice.

I guess I should start a new thread for my doors and one for my fenders.

Thanks.

[70rs]

I was hoping to keep more original matal intact but I know in the long run and many years down the road I will be happy I made the right choice.

I guess I should start a new thread for my doors and one for my fenders.

Thanks.

I am going through the same thing on my '70. I have the choice of partial quarters. full quarters or patch whats there. I am going the full panel option. In the long run it will be a better car and I will get to see and replace if needed the wheel houses and everything else. I may even do a new roof panel. I think if you bite the bullet and do it all now the right way you will be happier in the long run. Good luck.:cheers:

[Ron Fox]

I am going through the same thing on my '70. I have the choice of partial quarters. full quarters or patch whats there. I am going the full panel option. In the long run it will be a better car and I will get to see and replace if needed the wheel houses and everything else. I may even do a new roof panel. I think if you bite the bullet and do it all now the right way you will be happier in the long run. Good luck.:cheers:

I agree. The car is down to the shell so this will be the only time to do it right and to do it only once. It's just difficult to take that first step.

Question. Will or could the Old full quarter panels come off the car in one piece?

Thanks.

[J2SpeedandCustom]

Ron,

Steve Rupp did a great article on his car "Penny" about quarter panel installs. I can't find the thread, but basically the aftermarket quarter fit better than the NOS part.
That has been my finding as well, these car's were not built with the gaps we have in mind. So you going to have to modify any part you buy might as well save some money to spend it on the labor.

Jeff

[70rs]

I agree. The car is down to the shell so this will be the only time to do it right and to do it only once. It's just difficult to take that first step.

Question. Will or could the Old full quarter panels come off the car in one piece?

Thanks.

I agree, the first cut is a tough one and I have not done it yet. I have seen the quarters come off in one piece but since I have never done it myself I'm not sure how easy it is.

[ItDoRun]

I agree, the first cut is a tough one and I have not done it yet. I have seen the quarters come off in one piece but since I have never done it myself I'm not sure how easy it is.

Don't even bother trying to salvage it. You'll waste way too much time. As far as the first cut. You're right. It's hard to do, but just do it. The demo part is the FUN part!!!! :unibrow:

Now quit typing and start cutting. And take plenty of pictures.

[Ron Fox]

Ron,

Steve Rupp did a great article on his car "Penny" about quarter panel installs. I can't find the thread, but basically the aftermarket quarter fit better than the NOS part.
That has been my finding as well, these car's were not built with the gaps we have in mind. So you going to have to modify any part you buy might as well save some money to spend it on the labor.

Jeff

Please send me the thread if you happen to run across it.

Classic Industries seems to have a good full quarter repo. What do you think about Classic Industries?

[70rs]

Don't even bother trying to salvage it. You'll waste way too much time. As far as the first cut. You're right. It's hard to do, but just do it. The demo part is the FUN part!!!! :unibrow:

Now quit typing and start cutting. And take plenty of pictures.

No kidding, thanks for the kick in the a**. I needed that. Off to the garage!:thumbsup:

[ItDoRun]

Please send me the thread if you happen to run across it.

Classic Industries seems to have a good full quarter repo. What do you think about Classic Industries?

I believe the Classic Industries quarter is made by Dynacorn. Someone correct me if I'm wrong. There's only two manufacturers from what I've seen....Dynacorn and Golden Legion. Just flip a coin and order one. You're going to have to massage it to fit no matter which one you get. My driver side quarter fit as good as the original. The passenger side is good, but I did take a cut off tool and welding machine to it last weekend to tweak a few areas I didn't like. Find the cheapest place you can that offers the cheapest shipping and let it roll.

Chris

[J2SpeedandCustom]

Please send me the thread if you happen to run across it.

Classic Industries seems to have a good full quarter repo. What do you think about Classic Industries?


Classic, NPD basically which every place you want to buy them from is fine. The cool thing about the after market qtr's is the front of the wheel well opening is wider than original. Makes fitting bigger tires easier! :yes:

[Ron Fox]

I believe the Classic Industries quarter is made by Dynacorn. Someone correct me if I'm wrong. There's only two manufacturers from what I've seen....Dynacorn and Golden Legion. Just flip a coin and order one. You're going to have to massage it to fit no matter which one you get. My driver side quarter fit as good as the original. The passenger side is good, but I did take a cut off tool and welding machine to it last weekend to tweak a few areas I didn't like. Find the cheapest place you can that offers the cheapest shipping and let it roll.

Chris

If a go with full quarters, which I 99.9% sure I will, hopefully they will fit nice without much banging on.

[Ron Fox]

Classic, NPD basically which every place you want to buy them from is fine. The cool thing about the after market qtr's is the front of the wheel well opening is wider than original. Makes fitting bigger tires easier! :yes:

I did not know this. Is it just the front part or the entire opening?

[awr68]

If a go with full quarters, which I 99.9% sure I will, hopefully they will fit nice without much banging on.

only do FULL quarters!

[Ron Fox]

Classic, NPD basically which every place you want to buy them from is fine. The cool thing about the after market qtr's is the front of the wheel well opening is wider than original. Makes fitting bigger tires easier! :yes:

Jeff, how much wider is the quarter?

Thanks.