AFX spindles

[shaggy56]

Hello Im new on the board and I was referred by someone on another site. I own a 1971 Nova that Im interested in upgrading my spindles to the AFX tall spindles. I noticed on their webpage that these particular spindles are backordered. I also tried calling them but their mailbox is full. Im still waiting for an e-mail response. I already have some C5 brakes and 17 inch wheels and would like these spindles to complete my project. I was wondering if their was anything else I needed and if anyone knew how I could order or help me order these spindles.

Thanks

[JamesJ]

I would look into a different brand, they pretty much closed there doors.

[JamesJ]

Just depends on how long you are willing to wait.....

[shaggy56]

They closed there doors? I havent seen anyone offer anything remotely to what they sell. Im just wondering how long they are backordered. I guess Ill take a chance and do an online order if noone has any info.

[skatinjay27]

They closed there doors? I havent seen anyone offer anything remotely to what they sell. Im just wondering how long they are backordered.your right nobody does make a spindle for these cars that can hold a flame to the AFX spindle.
On that note yes ATS closed thier"shops" doors but ATS is still in buisness.
just call them during buisness hours and order them direct through tyler so youll know exacty what to expect.

[shaggy56]

I just placed an online order. I hope I will be ok. It asked me to put in the balljoints and control arms that I will be using. I just wasnt sure if I needed steering arms.

[VP23271]

Their website is still up and running and filling orders. I just spoke with Tyler 2 weeks ago and ordered a LS road race oil pan.

The AFX spindle is on back order I believe because of the the hubs.

http://www.t56kit.com/

[skatinjay27]

Their website is still up and running and filling orders. I just spoke with Tyler 2 weeks ago and ordered a LS road race oil pan.

The AFX spindle is on back order I believe because of the the hubs.

http://www.t56kit.com/yea he's got alot of the main body just waiting on some parts for them.

[shaggy56]

yea he's got alot of the main body just wait... on some parts for them.

Yeah like I said I placed the order already. I just got nervous when I seen backordered. The last thing I bought that was backordered took like 5 months.

[chicane]

FYI...

ATS is STILL in business... they have only closed their store/service front end. The e-commerce end is still up and running.

The AFX spindle have been on back order due to a CNC machine "driver card" failure. That physical card has been replaced and the spindles are once again in production. I would say that spindle sets will be shipped shortly.

The LS7/LSx oil pans are waiting on the internal tubes to be remanufactured due to a sub-manufacturer's oversight in a specific diamention. ATS QA found this issue and have taken the necessary steps to correct the issue.

[ScotI]

I inquired about the G-body tall spindles on 3-25 & received an e-mail from Tyler on 3-28 informing me that he expected to be filling orders within approx 3-wks.

[Teetoe_Jones]

Yep, we are still around. We have a few hundred sets coming off the machines this week. From there we will be assembling them, boxing them, and filling all B/O. From here on we should have a good supply on the shelf.

Tyler

[Blake Foster]

How did that song go......... Welcome back ,welcome back, welcome back!!

:thumbsup:

good to hear

[JamesJ]

Yep, we are still around. We have a few hundred sets coming off the machines this week. From there we will be assembling them, boxing them, and filling all B/O. From here on we should have a good supply on the shelf.

Tyler

Good to hear, with the limited parts you sell and as many people on this board and the other that can answer all the question you should be able to do this without all the other stuff, and having to have a phone on your hip 24/7 :thumbsup:

[shaggy56]

I havent seen any updates on these spindles. Does anyone know another source for these spindles without the long wait? I dont want to cancel my order unless someone knows someone who may have these in stock. I dont even know how to cancel my order if I wanted to since I cant contact them and their mailbox is full.

[1badchevelle]

Best bet is to wait a couple more weeks it will be worth it. I have a set on the shelf just waiting for my frame to go get coated.:thumbsup:

[shaggy56]

Thanks that makes me feel better I hope they get sent soon. I just finished scrubbing the rust off my subframe and going to coat it myself with master series silver and then acrylic paint. Im going to reinforce the seams with my mig welder this weekend. Should keep me busy for a little while more.

[mstennes]

Yep, we are still around. We have a few hundred sets coming off the machines this week. From there we will be assembling them, boxing them, and filling all B/O. From here on we should have a good supply on the shelf.

Tyler

Tyler, Sent you a text today, the spindle question reminded me, "Black Widow"
Mike

[camaro2nv]

Man I hope these things come through. Ive been on the list for three months. Seems with all the orders they should be able to open again.

[Musclerodz]

Talked to Tyler yesterday, he is headed to Vegas this weekend to box up a bunch of spindle sets to ship. Don't know how many or who is getting them, but some people should be receiving their spindles in the next couple weeks. He also had a bunch more being machined so the supply issue should be resolved hopefully very soon

[g_vanlaar]

That is great news... I sold my baer track kit and stock spindles to run the afx spindle before i knew they were this hard to get. I can't wait.

[chicane]

FYI... Curtis and I picked up a few hundred spindles today and now all that is required is bearing packs, which the remainder should arrive this weekand and start the process of their modification. So... it's looking closer to shipment.

Not to mention... I also had my hands on another few hundred sets that were going throught their last machining/finishing steps... right up to the point of another CNC machine card failure... so it's one step at a time for now. :faint:

What I am wondering is... how many 'opted' or the wheel stud upgrade ??? I'd like to get a rough number so that ball can be set in motion as well... and not to delay shipments any further.

Getting the bearing packs/assemblies form the manufacturer seems to be the biggest problem thus far.

Anyway... spindles are in their final assembly and inspection process and should ship soon.

[awr68]

Real good news! :woot:

[Spiffav8]

Yeah it was a fun day. I'll be helping get things assembled and shipped. From what I was told it will be about two weeks for the bearing packs to arrive and then we will ship ASAP.

Keep the faith people! :thumbsup:

[awr68]

Guys, thanks for helping Tyler with this....it is much appreciated!!

[simbad's68]

Chicane,
Any idea on the wait time on new orders?

[Spiffav8]

Chicane,
Any idea on the wait time on new orders?

ASAP is all I can say. Like Tom said, the machine is broken. The machinist is really frustrated as he is getting way behind on all the work he needs to get caught up on. Bearing packs are also an issue. The supplier is behind of getting orders out to ATS and from the sounds of it they two will be a ways out for the next round of Spindles.

The good news is that ATS is looking to the future and will be doing more Spindles (in addition to those currently waiting to be completed) down the road a ways.

Feel free to place an order if you want a set. I'll post updates as I get more info. Feel free to contact me if I can answer any more questions for you.

If you're trying to reach Tyler and he's not getting back to you right away, don't be offended. Keep in mind that he is working for Anvil and he is giving them 100% during normal working hours.

[ElkyZO6]

I can help will the hub shortage if the supplier can't keep up. Let me know what hubs you want and I'll get you a price.:thumbsup:

[Spiffav8]

I can help will the hub shortage if the supplier can't keep up. Let me know what hubs you want and I'll get you a price.:thumbsup:

ElkyZO6,

Thanks for the offer. I will pass this info along and we'll see what happens.

:cheers:

[Mean 69]

I need to modify an existing set of hubs for use with 3" long, 1/2" studs. I am assuming from the color of the studs that you guys use press-in ARP, which is what I'd like to use as well. Can you tell me what I need to do to modify, i.e. what studs do I need, and what diameter to open the holes on the hub up to match? I have access to a machine shop so no issue there.

Thanks,
Mark

[Spiffav8]

I need to modify an existing set of hubs for use with 3" long, 1/2" studs. I am assuming from the color of the studs that you guys use press-in ARP, which is what I'd like to use as well. Can you tell me what I need to do to modify, i.e. what studs do I need, and what diameter to open the holes on the hub up to match? I have access to a machine shop so no issue there.

Thanks,
Mark

Mark,

That is one for Tyler. Sorry, but I just don't have an answer to that one.

[65bomber]

Can somebody help me out and pass this message along to the folks at ATS? I am stressing out because I have built everything around these spindles and hubs. Not to mention that I am in the military and transferring in the next month (June 22). I would hate to have them ship to someplace I am not at. And, I would like to change my shipping address. Other than that these are by far the best spindles I have seen for any older car!

[Spiffav8]

Can somebody help me out and pass this message along to the folks at ATS? I am stressing out because I have built everything around these spindles and hubs. Not to mention that I am in the military and transferring in the next month (June 22). I would hate to have them ship to someplace I am not at. And, I would like to change my shipping address. Other than that these are by far the best spindles I have seen for any older car!

Bryan,

How long ago did you place your order?

[65bomber]

Curtis,
I placed the order back in March sometime. Thanks for getting back to me.

[Spiffav8]

Curtis,
I placed the order back in March sometime. Thanks for getting back to me.

From what I know......you should get them before you transfer. If for some reason you don't, let me know and I'll make sure you get them at the new address.

[65bomber]

Many thankyou's Curtis. Have a great day.

Bryan

[RomsMotors]

Any new updates on the spindles:_paranoid

[Spiffav8]

Any new updates on the spindles:_paranoid

Not yet Scott. I hope to talk to the right people in the next few days. I'll let you know what the word is as soon as I get it.

:thumbsup:

[will69camaro]

So why cant Tyler respond in these threads? He's been posting in others but wont come in here to answer customer's questions? I'd like a set of spindles but having my doubts about the vendor...

[1badchevelle]

I cant speak for him but I think he is just trying to get himself situated with Anvil, and has left the c/s to other's(Curtis) to handle. I have not had a chance to talk with Curtis but he's on top of it. I would say place your order you will not be disapointed.:thumbsup:

[Spiffav8]

So why cant Tyler respond in these threads? He's been posting in others but wont come in here to answer customer's questions? I'd like a set of spindles but having my doubts about the vendor...

That's a question only Tyler can answer. I don't blame you for having your doubts about Tyler and ATS right now...times are hard for the guy. If you want a set of Spindles and you're willing to wait a bit for them, it's safe to order a set. There have been some delays...delays that are beyond the control of ATS. It sucks for everyone.

[Spiffav8]

I cant speak for him but I think he is just trying to get himself situated with Anvil, and has left the c/s to other's(Curtis) to handle. I have not had a chance to talk with Curtis but he's on top of it. I would say place your order you will not be disapointed.:thumbsup:

Thanks for the pat on the back! I would ask everyone to keep in mind that I do not work for ATS. I'm just a little closer to them than most of our members and I am doing what I can to help all my :lateral: friends.

I hope to have more info for everyone by Monday.

[skatinjay27]

Thanks for the pat on the back! I would ask everyone to keep in mind that I do not work for ATS. I'm just a little closer to them than most of our members and I am doing what I can to help all my :lateral: friends.

I hope to have more info for everyone by Monday.i will jump in to re-assure the fact that curtis doesent work for ATS and like he said he just wants to help everyone(customer/friends/and tyler) to be happy, hell he even paid full price for the afx spindles he had on is 67! lol
"I seent it!"

but i think it like badchevelle said its got to do with his new gig with anvil and he doesent want to step on anybodys toes because it look like part of his job is being the internet PR guy.:lateral:

[will69camaro]

Yea it wasn't to point fingers at anyone I was simply curious. It seems that someone that can post in another thread may want to take the time to answer questions about parts that people have been waiting for. I understand stuff happens that can tie up the build process and all and have no ill feelings toward anyway just curious as I said.

I may pick up a set but I may know of a local set if I can convince the owner to sell them to me.

William

[camaro2nv]

I sure wish Tyler would post in here. I called a left a message a couple weeks ago with updated CC info but I got no call back.

[indebt69]

This is from Tyler on pro-touring under the Suspension thread:

We have 108 pair of tall AFX spindles being assembled by my fabricato in Las Vegas right now. Of those, about half are sold. We will have a stock of them for a few months, and have already sent in an order to our foundry in TX for another 500 sets. If you need me, email is best. I'm doing Anvil stuff full time during the day in Los Angeles, and my phones, equipment, and inventory is still in Vegas.

We are going to be shipping all orders for Tall AFX spindles shortly. No dealers from Classic Industries to SC&C have any spindles in stock, but all dealers seem to have at least 10-20 sets on order.

Tyler
Anvil
Makers of Carbon Fiber parts

[65bomber]

Curtis, I am now transferring 10 days earlier. After reading Tylers latest thread he said the spindles should start shipping sometime soon. Can I go ahead and change my shipping address? I think I might need to give someone there (ATS) updated CC info.

From what I know......you should get them before you transfer. If for some reason you don't, let me know and I'll make sure you get them at the new address.

[Spiffav8]

Curtis, I am now transferring 10 days earlier. After reading Tylers latest thread he said the spindles should start shipping sometime soon. Can I go ahead and change my shipping address? I think I might need to give someone there (ATS) updated CC info.

Bryan,

Did you call and leave that info on the machine? If so it was received and I am told it will be updated. Regardless....send it to me in a PM and I will forward it on to insure that it gets taken care of. Be sure to include your last name.

[98ssnova]

I would like to say thanks to Curtis on this whole thing right now. You have been outstanding in keeping Tyler and ATS in good standing I'm sure that evey order will be filled. I have talked to Tyler last time I was in vegas, he is a stand up guy and would do anything to help everybody out. But everybody also have to keep in mind that he started a new career over at Anvil. I have had an order in since JAN. I know that it will be filled and I am giving the guy alot of leway. Just give him some time to plant his feet in LA. After all we were the one's holding out on buying parts from ATS so he had to adapt. RANT OVER.... Curtis be good buddy and hopefully i will see you soon.:cheers:

[Spiffav8]

Wow....after all the nice things you guys have been saying it really sucks to have to post some not so great news.

As most of you know getting the bearing packs/assemblies form the manufacturer never seems to go easy for ATS. ATS ordered enough bearing packs to build all the spindles on hand...48 pairs or so if I remember correctly. Well they just got word that enough to build 10 pairs shipped (finally) and that the rest are on back order.

Trust me when I say that Tyler and all of ATS are more than a bit frustrated with all the delays. Kind of B.S. when you're trying to run a business and keep your customers happy.

Sorry for the bad news guys. Keep the faith though that the wheel is turning......just really, really, REALLY slow at the moment.

[Teetoe_Jones]

Bearings are coming in as they are built, so we are expecting a pallet of 120 in the next few days to be shipped out from Delphi.
I have Russell my fabricator pre-assembling all the tall spindles with inserts, studs, spiral locks etc so that when the bearing packs get in we can slam them in and ship them out. All the phones, inventory and equipment is still in Vegas, while I'm in Los Angeles doing stuff with Anvil full time. I'm close to securing a new shop in LA and then we will be running much smother. Email is best for the time being to reach me.
Thanks again to Curtis and the Vegas crew that I left behind for helping me out as I try to juggle 2 full time jobs.

Orders will be processed by date of order. Some of you have been waiting since december and will be getting your stuff shortly.

Tyler

[65bomber]

Any updates?

[chicane]

Still waiting on Delphi...

[65bomber]

I talked to some one at ATS on Monday. They said spindles should start shipping next week, maybe though. Cross your fingers!

[rich-allen]

Glad to see your making it happen :thumbsup:

[Spiffav8]

Well guys ATS is all loaded into a semi trailer and ready to hit the road. Once everything arrives at the new shop and Tyler gets things set up things should get back to some sense of normal for them.

Good luck Tyler! It's going to take a few to get organized, but it will be so good to have you back up and running again!.

:thumbsup: :cheers:

[Teetoe_Jones]

Dude-

Huge thanks to you and Tom (chicane67) for packing up 3 huge storage units full of inventory, equipment and some spare hookers in that trailer for me. Saved me a few days worth of traveling and will make the transition back into the full operation much smoother. Those who are waiting for AFX spindles have Curtis and Tom to thank for making it happen.

Tyler

[camaro2nv]

Yes!!! Thanks guys!

[awr68]

All good news! Thanks guys!! :cheers:

[1badchevelle]

Where in LA did ATS move to? New shop? Is it part of AnviL? :thumbsup:

[65bomber]

Yeah where in L.A. are you going? I am transfering on the 16th and will be in Topanga Canyon for a few days. What are the chances of me stopping by and picking up the spindles?

[Spiffav8]

Where in LA did ATS move to? New shop? Is it part of AnviL? :thumbsup:

No it is not part of Anvil. ATS will be located next to them. Kind of nice for a guy (Tyler) whos is working two jobs.

[Spiffav8]

Yeah where in L.A. are you going? I am transfering on the 16th and will be in Topanga Canyon for a few days. What are the chances of me stopping by and picking up the spindles?

It wouldn't do you any good to stop by at this time. Right now ATS is packed into the back of the Semi and in route to L.A. Trust me when I say it's going to take Tyler a few days to or weeks to make sense out of things. Additionally the bearing packs are also on the way, but have not been installed yet. So yours are not ready at this time.

[deuce_454]

I have a set of spindles.. love them, and loved dealing with tyler.... but it seems to me that there have been too many "they will ship in two weeks" posts.. and the bearing packs are comming..... :willy:

now lets see some action.. a pic with a great big bunch of spindles and todays newspaper.... and for gods sake if people have waited long enough to want to pick them up them selves.. bu all means send them without bearing packs.... it takes 8 minutes to install them.....:cheers:

[Teetoe_Jones]

WWWOOOOOHHHHHHOOOOO!!!!!! Got word that all hubs have shipped as of this morning from Delphi!! RocknRolla!!!

Tyler

[camaro2nv]

Oh yeah! Only problem now if the exp on my CC has changed. Tyler how do I get the new exp to you?

[chicane]

I'm just waiting to hear about the 'two hour window unload' once the trailer got there...

At least we got the trailer packed before it got hot here... :faint:



And good news about the word from Delphi to top it off. For some of you that are complaining, you shouldn't be... I've been waiting 3+ years for mine... now, I can actually get a set once Tyler's back up and running without the Vegas distractions.

Well... I guess that's if the shade of the palm tree's and beer dont slow him down...

[XLexusTech]

Great news! Dont forget to set the web page to in stock from on backorder :cheers:

[1badchevelle]

I can actually get a set once Tyler's back up and running without the Vegas distractions.

Well... I guess that's if the shade of the palm tree's and beer dont slow him down...

Maybe will make a Laker and Dodger fan out of him....:unibrow:

[shaggy56]

Well these spindles are really holding up my build. ATS seem really unresponsive to my questions so its difficult for me to order anything. I already have my rear rims from this article but Vintage wheel works are waiting for me to order my front rims as they are saving me the centers so my rims match. I want to order the CPP brake kit from the article but Im not sure if they will work with these spindles. Does anyone know if this brake kit will work and if not what would be a good complete brake kit in the same price range that would be compatible and work with the rims from the article and the ATS spindles.

Here is the article to make things clear. I would really hate to cancel my order with ATS but that may be difficult since they are unresponsive.

http://www.superchevy.com/technical/chassis/brakes/sucp_0806_chevy_nova_disc_brake_conversion/index.html

Thanks in advance.

[skatinjay27]

if the vvw wheels wheels cleared the cpp brake kit then Im sure c5 standard or z06 and c6 standards will fit too... any c5 c6 vette brake setup will bolt right up to the afx spindles.

you could piece together a setup or just get a kit from tobin at www.kore3.com
for less than the cpp stuff.

[Spiffav8]

if the vvw wheels wheels cleared the cpp brake kit then Im sure c5 standard or z06 and c6 standards will fit too... any c5 c6 vette brake setup will bolt right up to the afx spindles.

you could piece together a setup or just get a kit from tobin at www.kore3.com
for less than the cpp stuff.

I had exactly what Aj is talking about on my 67 with the AFX spindles. Awesome setup!!

[bwazcat]

Any update as to when we can expect some spindles to ship?

[indebt69]

I got word from my vendor that I purchased them from, that they are shipping out this week. This was on Monday. Yet I haven't seen any posts in here from others verifying this. So, we shall wait and see.

[Spiffav8]

Sorry guys I have no new news to offer. If I do hear anything I will be sure to pass it along.

[1badchevelle]

Wow, I'm glad I bought mine about a year ago.:unibrow: the bad thing is they are still in a box.

[shaggy56]

I had contacted someone by phone recently. They explained that they have 108 spindles and that every order is accounted for since this number consists of orders and surplus spindles to have in stock. So basically my understanding is that everyones spindles are coming but they have yet to assemble all of them but as they assemble them then they ship them out.

[Teetoe_Jones]

They are coming! I have been assembling AFX spindles for 8 nights straight and I'm seeing light at the end of the tunnel. We are filling orders by sales date, so there are some people that have been waiting patiently since October of 2008 (those people really want this spindle) and those who placed orders weeks ago will be some of the last to get them. We have enough for everyone, so no issues with us going into another back order after these have shipped. We are filling 108 pair in the next 10 days.

Here is some pics to keep you guys happy...

Me and the drill press have gotten to know each other well. I had to drill over 200 hubs this week.
http://i26.tinypic.com/i3a1hj.jpg

Here are tall AFX spindles awaiting their turn with liquid nitrogen and bearing packs:

http://i27.tinypic.com/10r0r3o.jpg

Here are the finished ones awaiting packaging:

http://i26.tinypic.com/30xfxad.jpg

Thanks for the support and patience!

Tyler

[waynieZ]

Those look so sweet !!

[awr68]

NICE!!! :thumbsup: :woot: :cheers:

[65bomber]

Sweet! I can't wait to get a pair.

[65bomber]

Well I just checked my credit card balance and there is a pending purchase from ATS. So, everyone check your door steps! I hope this brightens some ones weekend.

[RomsMotors]

I have a tracking number from Fedex for my pair. I'll have them by Thursday:willy:

[camaro2nv]

Tyler do you need my new exp date for my CC? I should be pretty high on the list. I think its been about seven months ago. Thanks Steve

[214Chevy]

Just to give a shout out to Tyler. I bought a set last year, '08. I had to wait a short time when they were on back order. But when I got them.........oh boy!! Seriously, out of all the stuff I've bought for my Chevelle and trust me I've bought alot. This was single handedly the most beautiful piece I've ever seen. I love them. I ought to buy another pair and just put them on the shelf for the future. Hey, who knows when I may buy another car. LOL!!

[wayne70]

Door bell ring's and there stand's a FedEx guy and a box marked ATS:woot:

[Spiffav8]

Sure it nice to see everyone so excited about their orders starting to arrive. Guys I know Tyler really appreciates your understanding and support while he and ATS have gone through so rocky times.

[camaro2nv]

Door bell ring's and there stand's a FedEx guy and a box marked ATS:woot:

What was your order date?

[Teetoe_Jones]

What was your order date?

We have only sent out 1/5 of the orders we have, and 80% of them are from SC&C. Some of the order dates are from October of 2008. We have you on the list, we just got more packaging in this morning and the next batch is going out within days.

It takes time for 1 guy to assemble 100+ pair of spindles, package them all, invoice everyone and ship each box when you work another full time job during the day. I am going as fast as I can, and I am following order dates as close as I can possible allow for.

Tyler

[camaro2nv]

We have only sent out 1/5 of the orders we have, and 80% of them are from SC&C. Some of the order dates are from October of 2008. We have you on the list, we just got more packaging in this morning and the next batch is going out within days.

It takes time for 1 guy to assemble 100+ pair of spindles, package them all, invoice everyone and ship each box when you work another full time job during the day. I am going as fast as I can, and I am following order dates as close as I can possible allow for.

Tyler

Thats man for the post! Ive just been sweating it because of the exp, date on my card. Whats up with the oil pan? I know you said they were back in stock but never heard back from you. Should I just buy it on your site? Thanks again Steve

[awr68]

Tyler, do you need us to send you some Jolt Cola, AMP, Red Bull, or N0S? You certainly have been putting in the hours!! Thanks Man!! :thumbsup:

[shaggy56]

I ordered my set at the beginning of april and I havent heard anything yet. I noticed some guys have started to get theres so I hope they are coming soon. Anyone else get theirs yet and when did you order them?

[camaro2nv]

I ordered my set at the beginning of april and I havent heard anything yet. I noticed some guys have started to get theres so I hope they are coming soon. Anyone else get theirs yet and when did you order them?
I think my order was December 08.

[Spiffav8]

I ordered my set at the beginning of april and I havent heard anything yet. I noticed some guys have started to get theres so I hope they are coming soon. Anyone else get theirs yet and when did you order them?

I'd bet you're still on the waiting list. Please keep in mind that Tyler is and will be playing catch up for awhile. You'll get them just later than sooner in this case.

[camaro2nv]

I'd bet you're still on the waiting list. Please keep in mind that Tyler is and will be playing catch up for awhile. You'll get them just later than sooner in this case.
Agreed, hang in there! I just ordered the oil pan also.

[skatinjay27]

Agreed, hang in there! I just ordered the oil pan also.your gonna freak when you actually hold it in your hands and you'll have a hard time believeing that it was all human welded by a guy who under 25!:thumbsup:

[notchbackgta]

Any chance I may get my spindles back with this new shipment? ;)

[shaggy56]

I just received a tracking number via fedex. Says I should have them by august 3rd. Im very excited thanks.

[Spiffav8]

I just received a tracking number via fedex. Says I should have them by august 3rd. Im very excited thanks.

Congrats! You are going to love those things!!!

[camaro2nv]

I just received a tracking number via fedex. Says I should have them by august 3rd. Im very excited thanks.

Ok now Im worried. You ordered in April and got tracking info?

[Teetoe_Jones]

The only ones we have not sent are ARP upgraded hubs. Camaro2nv what is your last name?

Tyler

[camaro2nv]

Norton

[Spiffav8]

Tyler...how is does your inventory look after sending all these out? Just wondering if you will have any on the shelf or if we will all be waiting for the next batch to be completed.

[camaro2nv]

Tyler any updates on my info?

[shaggy56]

Got them today. Man Im so inspired to finish my project now.

http://i124.photobucket.com/albums/p1/shaggy56_bucket/DSCF2829.jpg

[camaro2nv]

Got them today. Man Im so inspired to finish my project now.

http://i124.photobucket.com/albums/p1/shaggy56_bucket/DSCF2829.jpg

Congrats!
I guess some how my phone order was missed. So all these months Ive been posting about being on the list I guess I wasnt,lol My orders in now, I just hope they ship soon.

[shaggy56]

Congrats!
I guess some how my phone order was missed. So all these months Ive been posting about being on the list I guess I wasnt,lol My orders in now, I just hope they ship soon.

Thanks.

Sorry to hear that. On the bright side I think you will get them soon because they were acting like they had plenty leftover even after all the placed orders.

[RomsMotors]

Tyler,

Any update on when the steering arms are going to ship? I got the spindles they look great.
Thanks Scott

[shaggy56]

I was hoping someone could help me out with my spindles. I plan on using the baer tracker tie rod ends to clearance some rims I have but I may need some additional clearance from the steering arms since they are the medium versions.

[camaro2nv]

Does anyone have a set of these that they want to sell? Maybe they're not ready for them yet? I cant seem to get Tyler to PM me back. Im ready to give up on this guy.

[dhutton]

Does anyone have a set of these that they want to sell? Maybe they're not ready for them yet? I cant seem to get Tyler to PM me back. Im ready to give up on this guy.

Try ordering a set from Mark at SC&C. He is one of the biggest, if not biggest buyers of these. He'll know if extra sets are available and when they might ship.

Don

[Spiffav8]

Guys I have contacted Tyler to get more information on the steering arms. I know you are all chomping at the bit to get them and I understand. Please keep in mind that Tyler is working two jobs and still getting his new shop setup. I know it was a ton of work and some late hours to get the spindles sent out. We all know you will be happy with them once they do start to ship. ATS products are always worth the wait.

[shaggy56]

Guys I have contacted Tyler to get more information on the steering arms. I know you are all chomping at the bit to get them and I understand. Please keep in mind that Tyler is working two jobs and still getting his new shop setup. I know it was a ton of work and some late hours to get the spindles sent out. We all know you will be happy with them once they do start to ship. ATS products are always worth the wait.


Do you know if they might ever make short steering arms for the 1st gen F-body chassis?

Most of us are using spacers to get deep backspacing.

[Spiffav8]

Do you know if they might ever make short steering arms for the 1st gen F-body chassis?

Most of us are using spacers to get deep backspacing.

No idea. I would think that once ATS is 100% again we will see a few new products. I suppose you could e-mail Tyler and suggest it.

[g_vanlaar]

The steering arms would be great. I can't find the short ones anywhere!

[dhutton]

Do you know if they might ever make short steering arms for the 1st gen F-body chassis?

Most of us are using spacers to get deep backspacing.

This came up a while ago. Tyler said he did not make enough money on them to justify it. He only makes a few dollars on the A body ones and if he priced the F body ones high enough to make it worthwhile no one would buy them.

Don

[shaggy56]

This came up a while ago. Tyler said he did not make enough money on them to justify it. He only make a few dollars on the A body ones and if he priced the F body ones high enough to make it worthwhile no one would buy them.

Don

Thanks for the response. Im looking into another option now anyhow.

[shaggy56]

I found stock used short steering arms. They were $200 but I didnt see anyone else with them so I got them.

[sun6fish]

Does anyone have a idea when ats will be shiping the spindles with the arp upgrade? It sounds like my turn should be soon.

[65bomber]

Can some one tell Tyler to please contact me about shipping my steering arms to the correct address? Thanks.

[Sfinx]

Hi,

Can anyone update this thread to advise whether the back log is now cleared and new orders will move rather quickly? or is there still a large wait?

Thanks,
Gavin

[XLexusTech]

Hi,

Can anyone update this thread to advise whether the back log is now cleared and new orders will move rather quickly? or is there still a large wait?

Thanks,
Gavin

X2:cheers:

[dhutton]

Hi,

Can anyone update this thread to advise whether the back log is now cleared and new orders will move rather quickly? or is there still a large wait?

Thanks,
Gavin

I got a call from Mark at SC&C yesterday saying that the spindles I ordered several weeks ago should ship early next week so it sounds like the backlog is getting quite a bit smaller. If you want them I suggest you order from Mark since he seems to be able to get in touch with Tyler and usually has the latest news regarding ship dates etc.

Don

[Sfinx]

Ok thanks, for the update.

[RomsMotors]

Has anyone got their steering arms? I talk to Tlyer two month ago when I got my spindles, he told me they were in the anodizer and should have them the next week. Two month later and no steering arms. Just wondering if anyone got their arms? :question:

[notchbackgta]

I may suggest that you try to contact Tyler at Anvil instead of ATS. I spoke to him a little while ago

[mfain]

For what it's worth, I put ATS spindles on a custom fabricated suspension in my Corvette (front steer, rack and pinion). Tyler did not have A-body (front steer) arms at the time. I bought a block of T7075 aluminum and had a very good machinist in Phoenix put the dimensions I gave him (based on the bump steer and Ackerman measurements I had taken) in CAD and then CNC machine the arms for me. They are very similar to the A-body arms, but are probably not exactly the same dimensions. I wouldn't want to take business away from Tyler if he is still producing the steering arms, but there is at least another alternative. I haven't hard anodized the arms yet (T7075 should be anodized to prevent surface corrosion). The arms were pretty expensive (one-off), but part of the cost was the initial computer set-up and the cost of the jig, something that could be partially offset if you produced more than one set. I'll try to find a better picture of the steering arms.

[Marcus SC&C]

I just got a heads up from Tyler that another batch of our backorders would be shipping next week. He didn`t mention if all of them would ship with steering arms so I`m waiting to hear back from him on that then we can contact everyone. I know everyone would like to get their parts right away but Tyler`s doing the level best that he can. Everyone will get their parts, just hang in there guys. Mark SC&C

[65bomber]

Does anyone know who owns this company? I am highly disapointed with this companies customer service. I would like to let the owner know about how I feel. I'm sure there are others out there as well who feel this way.


I WISH SOMEONE FROM THE COMPANY WOULD GET TO ME ON MY SITUATION!!!!!!!!!!! :question: :question: :question: :question: :question:

[camcojb]

Does anyone know who owns this company? I am highly disapointed with this companies customer service. I would like to let the owner know about how I feel. I'm sure there are others out there as well who feel this way.
It's still Tylers company as far as I know. He's doing it part time, so you'd need to contact him for an idea when they'll ship.

Jody

[Marcus SC&C]

Guys, everyone is in the same situation here, even us. We`re all patiently waiting for our ATS stuff because it`s the best stuff in the business and it`s worth waiting for. Tyler is doing his damndest to get the parts done and shipped as fast as he can. This is a one man show now, he has no help and he now has a day job. That should give you some indication as to how well things are going. My hat`s off to the guy, most folks in the same situation would have thrown in the towel a long time ago and nobody would be getting any spindles or steering arms no matter how long they waited. Those of us who appreciate the situation are thrilled that we can still get these parts at all and we`ll wait if we have to. Mark SC&C

[dhutton]

I got my spindles last week after ordering in mid July. I don't think there are many better options for an A body so I decided to order early and factor in the wait time. I'm sure it will be worth it.

Don

[awr68]

Mid July, sounds like ATS is catching up!!

[Teetoe_Jones]

Steering arms are in as of today. I'm boxing them up tonight.

Thanks for everyone's patience on this matter.

Tyler

[brans72]

Thanks for the BIG update Tyler!I know it seems as sometimes we can't wait for the parts but the updates due help out!!! Maybe one day I can afford the ATS steering arms.

[65bomber]

Tyler,
I have sent you three emails in a span of 2 weeks concerning my issue. I have tried calling you at the number on the t56kit.com website ( 702-245-6305 ) and it says the voicemail box is full. I am going to post my email here in hopes that you might have a chance to read it or one of your friends tells you about. I did not order two sets of steering arms nor did I receive a 2nd set.

(October 29th)

Tyler,
This is the 3rd email I have sent to you on this. PLEASE get back
to me. My credit card statement shows that I have been charged twice for
the steering arms! I have only received one set of them. Is this a mistake? What is going on here?


Here is what my c.c. statement shows:


(Spindles and steering arms)
Jul 17, 2009 Jul 17, 2009 AMERICAN TOURING SPECI
($928.36)

(2nd charge for steering arms I did not receive)
Oct 13, 2009 Oct 13, 2009 AMERICAN TOURING SPECI
($231.58)


Talk to you later.

Bryan

[Tom.A]

Bryan,

I know you want a firm answer from ATS but it appears that the total sum would seem atleast close to correct ie;
Spindle set $875.00...plus shipping could =$928
Steering arms $215.00...plus shipping could = $231.00

Maybe I am wrong? I was just going by the prices listed on his web page

[65bomber]

Tom
Here is the original invoice:

1 AFX Spindle
64-72 Chevelle; Tall; Factory; Factory (Long Text; Long Text; No) $749.00 $749.00 Shipped (7/16/2009)
1 AFX Billet Steering Arms
64-72 Chevelle/A-Body; Factory $215.00 $215.00 Shipped (7/16/2009)



Tyler,
I have sent you three emails in a span of 2 weeks concerning my issue. I have tried calling you at the number on the t56kit.com website ( 702-245-6305 ) and it says the voicemail box is full. I am going to post my email here in hopes that you might have a chance to read it or one of your friends tells you about. I did not order two sets of steering arms nor did I receive a 2nd set.

(October 29th)

Tyler,
This is the 3rd email I have sent to you on this. PLEASE get back
to me. My credit card statement shows that I have been charged twice for
the steering arms! I have only received one set of them. Is this a mistake? What is going on here?


Here is what my c.c. statement shows:


(Spindles and steering arms)
Jul 17, 2009 Jul 17, 2009 AMERICAN TOURING SPECI
($928.36)

(2nd charge for steering arms I did not receive)
Oct 13, 2009 Oct 13, 2009 AMERICAN TOURING SPECI
($231.58)


Talk to you later.

Bryan

[realcoray]

Tom
Here is the original invoice:

1 AFX Spindle
64-72 Chevelle; Tall; Factory; Factory (Long Text; Long Text; No) $749.00 $749.00 Shipped (7/16/2009)
1 AFX Billet Steering Arms
64-72 Chevelle/A-Body; Factory $215.00 $215.00 Shipped (7/16/2009)


When I ordered them in early 2008 they were at one price (listed as on backorder), and then when they were shipped 6+ months later I was charged the price at that time, which had gone up.

It's a bit shady but that seems like what happened to you also, in between your order date and the ship date the price went up even though he didn't have them, and then he charged you the current price when he finally did.

[Teetoe_Jones]

Taking this to PM.

Tyler

[65bomber]

I had ordered them on the 2nd of March for 749 and 215 respectively. I was never sent an email or letter advising me of a price increase. Did you get a letter or an email?

When I ordered them in early 2008 they were at one price (listed as on backorder), and then when they were shipped 6+ months later I was charged the price at that time, which had gone up.

It's a bit shady but that seems like what happened to you also, in between your order date and the ship date the price went up even though he didn't have them, and then he charged you the current price when he finally did.

[JRouche]

Umm Tyler said he was taking it to PM, meaning to me he was gonna deal with it on a individual level. I would go with that. Im sure he will set it right. Just deal with him. I wouldnt be surprised to find he will honor the price from the day you ordered them. Billing and ordering SNAFUs happen. JR

[chicane]

No kidding.... what's with the rash of Chevelle owners going to other sites to do nothing but whine ?? :P

[Teetoe_Jones]

Guys-

The cost of everything went up from the time we ran out of inventory last SEMA till we had them back in stock and shipping in June. Forgings, machining, hubs, hardware, wheel speed sensor brackets, packaging; it all went up and we had to change all our products retail pricing to reflect this increase. The charges he got on his spindles and steering arms are not unique to him alone. Every single person who ordered AFX spindles was charged the same- $875; this is regardless if you ordered them through me, Marcus, or before they were re-listed on our site at the previous price.

We even had a price increase on the steering arms from $215 to $250, but because Marcus had already charged his clients for arms, I honored the former price and ate the difference.

I offered a full refund if he would like to go try something else since he feels singled out. The cost of doing business in the USA has increased, and we are all feeling the burn; I won't be mad if he decides to go elsewhere for a lesser priced product for his project.

Tyler

[65bomber]

Tyler,
I want to express my extreme displeasure with your company. It should be a moral obligation to you to keep your customers happy with any change in price or lack of product. Your negligence is obvious of this. I have had nothing but issues with your company. Starting back when I was stationed at United States Coast Guard Air Station San Diego and tried to get my shipping address changed to the correct one. It didn't happen. I was assured that it would happen, but it never did. With your failure to change my shipping address resulted in me having to take MILITARY Leave and drive down to San Diego from San Francisco to pick them up. I have always heard that ATS was a reputable company, but I am appalled at your lack of concern for my situation. Let alone the way you treat a member of the United States Military. I will ask you this, Will you HONOR the total price on my order? Which was $984.47 for the spindles and the steering arms. The price that was ADVERTISED on your website on 02 MAR 2009.

Thanks,
Bryan

p.s. Thank you to all past and present military members for your service and sacrifice.

[JRouche]

Deleted by myself. John Rouche



Tyler,
I want to express my extreme displeasure with your company. It should be a moral obligation to you to keep your customers happy with any change in price or lack of product. Your negligence is obvious of this. I have had nothing but issues with your company. Starting back when I was stationed at United States Coast Guard Air Station San Diego and tried to get my shipping address changed to the correct one. It didn't happen. I was assured that it would happen, but it never did. With your failure to change my shipping address resulted in me having to take MILITARY Leave and drive down to San Diego from San Francisco to pick them up. I have always heard that ATS was a reputable company, but I am appalled at your lack of concern for my situation. Let alone the way you treat a member of the United States Military. I will ask you this, Will you HONOR the total price on my order? Which was $984.47 for the spindles and the steering arms. The price that was ADVERTISED on your website on 02 MAR 2009.

Thanks,
Bryan

p.s. Thank you to all past and present military members for your service and sacrifce.

[Teetoe_Jones]

I will ask you this, Will you HONOR the total price on my order? Which was $984.47 for the spindles and the steering arms. The price that was ADVERTISED on your website on 02 MAR 2009.

Thanks,
Bryan



Nope. That is like asking me to honor the pricing in our catalog from 2005 when they were $625 per pair. You are not being singled out. Everyone paid the same price on the last batch which was well over 100+ sets. If I give you the old price and eat any margin I had on the product, 100 more clients are going to ask 'why don't I get a refund or discount too?"

Like I told you before, I'd be happy to refund you for the steering arms and spindles if they are new, not installed and still in the boxes. You can go to another company for a lesser priced product.

If I ate a price increase every time costs went up you wouldn't have a set of spindles to bitch about. ATS would be out of business. Have you ever heard the phrase "pricing is subject to change without notice" before? Every company has that clause in the catalog they give out, and we are no exception.

Tyler

[96z28ss]

If you take orders at a said price, and charge them on a credit card that price. Thats what it should cost the customer.
Its not the customers fault that you didn't have product on the shelf. Its not the customers fault that your supplier raised the price. You should be on top of that when your putting your order in.
You shouldn't have charged the customer till the product was ready to ship, and at that time, notified customer of a price increase before putting order in.

[Teetoe_Jones]

If you take orders at a said price, and charge them on a credit card that price. Thats what it should cost the customer.
Its not the customers fault that you didn't have product on the shelf. Its not the customers fault that your supplier raised the price. You should be on top of that when your putting your order in.
You shouldn't have charged the customer till the product was ready to ship, and at that time, notified customer of a price increase before putting order in.

I never charge for product that doesn't leave the shop. We changed all pricing on our site in April when we got wind of the cost increase, and the software is designed to notify the client via email; I simply don't have the time to call every client since by the time I was getting to ATS business, it was already past 9pm on the east coast.
The fact of the matter is that when he ordered the product, it was listed at an old price and was out of stock. He was not charged until the product left and at current pricing. Like I stated, if he feels the increase is more than the quality of the product he got, he can return it for a full refund and go else where.

Tyler

[Blake Foster]

I Don't really know what to say to this, this will always be an issue, price increases happen all the time, we have just had a price increase also, all orders placed up to the price increase have been sold at the previous price. From the date of the price increase all new orders are at the new price. This looks and sounds like the calander needs to decide.
Having said that it, is (WAS) looks like it will be :willy: ) not my place to decide on the policies of another company.

With the aqusition of ATS will come issues. I know that is going to happen.
I don't need to get in the middle, at the same time i see very few alternatives other than to TRY and accomidate all the future orders as best we can. allong with filling any of the existing back orders.

Thank you.

[camaro2nv]

I Don't really know what to say to this, this will always be an issue, price increases happen all the time, we have just had a price increase also, all orders placed up to the price increase have been sold at the previous price. From the date of the price increase all new orders are at the new price. This looks and sounds like the calander needs to decide.
Having said that it, is (WAS) looks like it will be :willy: ) not my place to decide on the policies of another company.

With the aqusition of ATS will come issues. I know that is going to happen.
I don't need to get in the middle, at the same time i see very few alternatives other than to TRY and accomidate all the future orders as best we can. allong with filling any of the existing back orders.

Thank you.

Blake this is why your company is successful. You know how to take care of your customers. Im proud to own the parts your company makes. :bow:

[Blake Foster]

Thank you for that, but lets not forget where the product came from and the very dedicated and smart guy who bent over backwards to invent develop and get the product off the drawing board and into production and on the cars we love so much,
if any of you have not been involved in the manufacturing, marketing, distribution and sales (note that that is all one department and one guy) it is a ton of work and that doesn't include all the other stuff that goes along with it.
please take that into consideration when asking the ? where are my parts?

Tyler has done an admirable job even if there has been issues, we all have issues to deal with.
lets not throw him under the bus!!

[Marcus SC&C]

I`m sure Blake and the guys at Speedtech will do a great job with the ATS spindles. We`re looking forward to getting backorders filled,new orders underway and working with Speedtech a lot in the future.

As for the sour grapes, the general rule of thumb I`ve seen most businesses observe over the years is that if you pre order something and pay a deposit you are locked into the price being charged at that time. If you pre order with no deposit it simply assures you that you will be allocated the product when it becomes available. If there`s a production cost increase and summary change in the retail cost then so be it, although you should be notified. If you don`t want to pay the current price you don`t have to buy the parts. Every manufacturer would love to keep production costs low and parts flying out the door but sometimes production and expense realities make that very hard to do. Mark SC&C

[awr68]

Hopefully now that ATS is owned and ran by ST long term back orders will be a thing of the past and the price the day parts are ordered is the price you will be charged.......I have faith that Blake and Roger will have this running smoothly in a small amount of time.

Tyler did a great job bringing the parts to market, he just needed more help in the production side of the business....I think the sale to ST was a great move!! Best of luck Tyler on what you do in the future....you have a lot of great ideas in that blue head of yours!! :cheers:

[mstennes]

Knowing Tyler, and getting all my LS7 conversion parts from him, plus FREE advice, it pisses me off those of you, who seem to think hes trying to pull something here. If you didnt notice the economy tanked last year, and Tyler had his ass on the line (and other employees) who all did what they could to start up a new business, design and engineer these custom products for a industry that can only sell so many. I dont know who here has started up a business from scratch, but let me tell you it is NOT easy, waaaaaaaaay more money goes out than come in, and then you have to keep reinvesting, it is NOT easy!!!! Now that we have that covered, lets take into the fact there were also some some personal issues, now we have another distraction. Tylers work ethic, devotion and honesty are his trademark, to question it when YOU have NO idea whats going on or whats going on behind the scenes is inexcusable! Than to expect some sort of break or other "gift" is just down right wrong. Try to call him, keep trying hes NOT hiding, if you dont like whats going on then take it up with Tyler, and I'm sure you will be humbled.

[ibdmann]

i ordered three things from ats with no problems

[70rs]

I have been queitly watching these kind of threads go on and on for months now. I joined THIS forum because it did not show signs of the drama that goes on in some others. I like it here and have made some really good friends through this and have also recieved a HUGE amount of support for my project and great advice from members here.

No one likes drama. If people just remember to keep business as business and NOT make these issues personal everyone comes out better off in the end.

Many businesses have had a hard time over the past year. Many have gone under. ATS is in good hands now and will continue to grow.


Best of luck to Tyler in the future and to Blake and the guys at Speedtech with the new venture. I think it is a great opportunity for everyone involved.
:cheers:

[mstennes]

I have been queitly watching these kind of threads go on and on for months now. I joined THIS forum because it did not show signs of the drama that goes on in some others. I like it here and have made some really good friends through this and have also recieved a HUGE amount of support for my project and great advice from members here.

No one likes drama. If people just remember to keep business as business and NOT make these issues personal everyone comes out better off in the end.

Many businesses have had a hard time over the past year. Many have gone under. ATS is in good hands now and will continue to grow.


Best of luck to Tyler in the future and to Blake and the guys at Speedtech with the new venture. I think it is a great opportunity for everyone involved.
:cheers:

That was my point, use the phone, send a IM, but dont spout your mouth off and waste Band Width here in tech forums. If you woul have been paying ANY attention you would know whats going on, ut I draw the line on airing your stuff here, try to get other members to side with you, and then try to berate. 70RS this is NOT aimed at you, I'm agreeing 100% with you. I may not post allot but I have been here for a while, and this BS is getting out of hand. Drama, want drama go back to high school. Tyler :bow: is AOK!!!!! Good luck amigo!:cheers:

[Spiffav8]

Knowing Tyler, and getting all my LS7 conversion parts from him, plus FREE advice, it pisses me off those of you, who seem to think hes trying to pull something here. If you didnt notice the economy tanked last year, and Tyler had his ass on the line (and other employees) who all did what they could to start up a new business, design and engineer these custom products for a industry that can only sell so many. I dont know who here has started up a business from scratch, but let me tell you it is NOT easy, waaaaaaaaay more money goes out than come in, and then you have to keep reinvesting, it is NOT easy!!!! Now that we have that covered, lets take into the fact there were also some some personal issues, now we have another distraction. Tylers work ethic, devotion and honesty are his trademark, to question it when YOU have NO idea whats going on or whats going on behind the scenes is inexcusable! Than to expect some sort of break or other "gift" is just down right wrong. Try to call him, keep trying hes NOT hiding, if you dont like whats going on then take it up with Tyler, and I'm sure you will be humbled.

Ummmm.....have you been in a cave? Did you read all the posts? Did you realize that ATS has been sold and is now part of Speedtech? It's all good now, so no need to fire the big guns. But thanks for looking out for a VERY good friend of mine.

:cheers:

[mstennes]

Ummmm.....have you been in a cave? Did you read all the posts? Did you realize that ATS has been sold and is now part of Speedtech? It's all good now, so no need to fire the big guns. But thanks for looking out for a VERY good friend of mine.

:cheers:

Yes I have, my response was in reguards to one poster, who actually had the gall to question Tylers integrety. Thats something I just didnt like at all, and it doesnt matter about ATS being sold it, I didnt like his integrety being questioned, thats all.:cheers:

[70rs]

That was my point, use the phone, send a IM, but dont spout your mouth off and waste Band Width here in tech forums. If you woul have been paying ANY attention you would know whats going on, ut I draw the line on airing your stuff here, try to get other members to side with you, and then try to berate. 70RS this is NOT aimed at you, I'm agreeing 100% with you. I may not post allot but I have been here for a while, and this BS is getting out of hand. Drama, want drama go back to high school. Tyler :bow: is AOK!!!!! Good luck amigo!:cheers:

I got ya. We're all good.:cheers:

[98ssnova]

With all the cheers going here I thought i would post one up for everybody :cheers: just trying to lighten the mood:thumbsup:

[Spiffav8]

With all the cheers going here I thought i would post one up for everybody :cheers: just trying to lighten the mood:thumbsup:

Hurray...let's all skip and be friends. :rofl:

[mstennes]

Hurray...let's all skip and be friends. :rofl:

Ok then, beers on Tyler:unibrow:

[98ssnova]

Hurray...let's all skip and be friends. :rofl:

remember i know where you live:rofl:

[Spiffav8]

remember i know where you live:rofl:

Hey man I'm OCONUS so if you stop by the house walk the dog, mow the lawn and be sure to leave beer in the fridge.

;)