Paint Shop recommendation

[GeoffP]

I'm looking for recommendations to have my 87 Camaro painted. I would much rather have someone do a better than average job than get ripped off by the local collision shop. I'm near Augusta, Ga if that helps. I don't want to drive further than possibly Atlanta area if possible.

I just got an estimate from the local shop this afternoon - $5500. I guess that's not terrible, but then the guy told me it could be 2-6 months before I get the car back because insurance work gets priority. While I did already know this somewhat, I was not expecting 6 months from what is the largest shop in the area. They wouldn't even adjust the cost if I complete things such as disassembly/reassembly, etc. Hopefully someone will chime in on this - what's a realistic expectation for turn around time? My car needs minor body work (both doors have quite a few dings, but nothing major) and it needs the paint completely stripped because the color is reacting. I have the tools to completely strip the paint and even have a primer gun (that I don't know how to use!). Maybe it's high time I learn? I'm open to suggestions - I really didn't want to spend $5500 on my daily driver. I was hoping for around $3500 on the high side.

[elitecustombody]

it depends on current condition of the car and how much of trim/parts will be removed as well as if you will do the paint stripping,I could probably do it for $3500-4000 if you strip the paint and remove glass,trim,e.t.c. BTW, I'm located in Jacksonville,1 month is reasonable on job like that

[email protected]

[GeoffP]

Thanks for the reply. Can you possibly share a some references? I'm really not sure what other questions I need to ask.

[TreySmith]

You can get it done for around $800.. But they don't take off the parts and trim. Just take all the stuff off yourself, spend $800, and walkaway with a paint job that looks $5000... After working at a body shop, the whole $8000 for a paint job is such bull ****.. It is like $100 in paint and like 10 hours of labor with 2 guys..

[racebuicks]

You can get it done for around $800.. But they don't take off the parts and trim. Just take all the stuff off yourself, spend $800, and walkaway with a paint job that looks $5000... After working at a body shop, the whole $8000 for a paint job is such bull ****.. It is like $100 in paint and like 10 hours of labor with 2 guys..
Yea right.................dream on $100 in paint...:rofl: :rofl: :rofl: you are obviously what 16 years old and have never had anything painted:rolleyes: you say you worked at a body shop ...doing what sweeping floors??

[racebuicks]

I'm looking for recommendations to have my 87 Camaro painted. I would much rather have someone do a better than average job than get ripped off by the local collision shop. I'm near Augusta, Ga if that helps. I don't want to drive further than possibly Atlanta area if possible.

I just got an estimate from the local shop this afternoon - $5500. I guess that's not terrible, but then the guy told me it could be 2-6 months before I get the car back because insurance work gets priority. While I did already know this somewhat, I was not expecting 6 months from what is the largest shop in the area. They wouldn't even adjust the cost if I complete things such as disassembly/reassembly, etc. Hopefully someone will chime in on this - what's a realistic expectation for turn around time? My car needs minor body work (both doors have quite a few dings, but nothing major) and it needs the paint completely stripped because the color is reacting. I have the tools to completely strip the paint and even have a primer gun (that I don't know how to use!). Maybe it's high time I learn? I'm open to suggestions - I really didn't want to spend $5500 on my daily driver. I was hoping for around $3500 on the high side.

Whoever does your car there are a couple things that make the job outstanding. First make sure that they use no laquer primers sealers or paint. Beleive it or not some people cheat out and use laquer primer then try to put decent paint over it. It wont last trust me on this one. Todays BC/CC paint jobs are designed to be long lasting finishes. If the metal work is properly prepared and sanded well (speaking as if the car has little to no body repair that is) they should be using a 2 part epoxy sealer, or a tintable catylized sealer under a good BC/CC paint job. Then if they need to sand and polish the paint, make sure they dont use wool pads to do so. Todays paint is better suited to the foam pad polishing. If the paint is of any quality they can do this withing 24-48 hours with no issue. I use PPG products in my shop and it has a better track record in matching the original color. SOme painters like Dupont its all in the shop's opinion. The cost of a GOOD paint job is also reflective on the quality of materials. SOme colors can cost $200 a quart, clear is $290 a gallon + catylist and reducers so this shop that said $5500 is really in line with todays prices of paint as well. When oil went to $140 a barrel all the paint went up 45% then when oil came down guess what .... the paint didnt. Not trying to scare you but on average our completes with body work has a $2500-4000 material bill. Depends on the amount of work done. Of course I havent ever done any cars that "just needed paint" If you can disassemble some of it to save some money I would recommend it. Just remember that you have to bolt it back together without scratching it too. 2-6 months is BS really but every shop has its priorities.
Good luck on your job. Of course I would love to help but Im 1000 miles away.

EDIT: ALso one more thing to concider, make sure they plan to back mask every part of your car so that you dont have to have overspray in the fenderwells, cowl panels, door jams etc etc. The more that is masked back the cleaner the job will look.

[Steve1968LS2]

You can get it done for around $800.. But they don't take off the parts and trim. Just take all the stuff off yourself, spend $800, and walkaway with a paint job that looks $5000... After working at a body shop, the whole $8000 for a paint job is such bull ****.. It is like $100 in paint and like 10 hours of labor with 2 guys..

:rofl:

[mazspeed]

You can get it done for around $800.. But they don't take off the parts and trim. Just take all the stuff off yourself, spend $800, and walkaway with a paint job that looks $5000... After working at a body shop, the whole $8000 for a paint job is such bull ****.. It is like $100 in paint and like 10 hours of labor with 2 guys..

Puff Puff pass.

[ccracin]

You can get it done for around $800.. But they don't take off the parts and trim. Just take all the stuff off yourself, spend $800, and walkaway with a paint job that looks $5000... After working at a body shop, the whole $8000 for a paint job is such bull ****.. It is like $100 in paint and like 10 hours of labor with 2 guys..

I don't think you could get spray bombs from Walmart for $100.

[GeoffP]

Thanks for the responses. It's been so long since I had any dealings with a paint and body shop that I just didn't know what to expect. I was somewhat surprised when the guy at the local shop said $5500. I also thought about what I'd been told about this particular shop being high price wise. I know you get what you pay for, but thought 2-6 mo is just wrong. I think for $5500 the car should be in and out in no more than a month tops (but that's just me). I guess it would be different if I didn't know that it could technically be done in a week or two if a couple guys were dedicated to the job.

It didn't help when the guy told me they had an 83 Z28 in the shop that had been there for 6 months and they are just now fitting the doors back (it's not even painted yet!). The guy then proceeds to tell me that the owner will have around $7-8k in it when they're done with it.

[mazspeed]

Thanks for the responses. It's been so long since I had any dealings with a paint and body shop that I just didn't know what to expect. I was somewhat surprised when the guy at the local shop said $5500. I also thought about what I'd been told about this particular shop being high price wise. I know you get what you pay for, but thought 2-6 mo is just wrong. I think for $5500 the car should be in and out in no more than a month tops (but that's just me). I guess it would be different if I didn't know that it could technically be done in a week or two if a couple guys were dedicated to the job.

It didn't help when the guy told me they had an 83 Z28 in the shop that had been there for 6 months and they are just now fitting the doors back (it's not even painted yet!). The guy then proceeds to tell me that the owner will have around $7-8k in it when they're done with it.

Yeah 6 months is not right. Move on to another shop if you can. Talk to people in the business and find out what shop they have used though car shows and what not. A lot of us have spent 10k and more on just paint and body work. That's kind of the norm. Do as much body work as you can, and prep it as best you can, this might help, but expect to pay for paint. It’s like the old saying, buy nice or buy twice, that very much applies to paint. And don't listen to guys like Trey who have no idea what their talking about, talk to car real guys in your area.

[camcojb]

You can get it done for around $800.. But they don't take off the parts and trim. Just take all the stuff off yourself, spend $800, and walkaway with a paint job that looks $5000... After working at a body shop, the whole $8000 for a paint job is such bull ****.. It is like $100 in paint and like 10 hours of labor with 2 guys..

wow....................... Having done my own paint jobs I'm wanting to know where you can buy all the materials needed to paint a car for $100. Hell, I just spent $400+ in just clear.

Jody

[elitecustombody]

Thanks for the reply. Can you possibly share a some references? I'm really not sure what other questions I need to ask.

here is a thread I made on one of my projects I finished couple months ago

http://www.lateral-g.net/forums/showthread.php4?p=190129&posted=1#post190129

give me a little time as I'm uploading pics ,since it only allows for 5 pics per post

you can check with Stage 6 Motorsports,904Motorsports, Speedfab,Velocity Trends,Aerotrends ,Fifth Gear,TK Performance or Duval Acura, I do paint and body work on all their brand new never titled cars,so I don't think I do sloppy work,otherwise I wouldn't be working on brand new cars

[GeoffP]

I saw that thread just before looking this one back up to see if there were any replies. That Supra looks very nice. I am definitely not looking to take mine down that far! :)

[comp-spec]

You can get it done for around $800.. But they don't take off the parts and trim. Just take all the stuff off yourself, spend $800, and walkaway with a paint job that looks $5000... After working at a body shop, the whole $8000 for a paint job is such bull ****.. It is like $100 in paint and like 10 hours of labor with 2 guys..

Just payed 430.00 just for clear ..:mad:

[Musclerodz]

Must have been MAACO, and their CHEAP paint. The gallon of Dupont red basecoat I just bought cost me $397 with a 15% discount.

[GeoffP]

Sheesh - paint sure has gone up. When I had this car painted 12-15 years ago, I paid between $600-700 for the paint, clear, and all the D/A discs and other misc prep items. It was good stuff too - PPG and their Concept line clear.

[DOOM]

:wow: And to think I had it wrong all these years!!! Oh hey Pete I need a refund on the paint for KARMA :rofl: I'll tell you what , do'nt send me all my money keep a $100.00 ,oh wait keep $150.00 I want you to go all out with one extra coat of clear!!! Thats cuz I like Tony.:lol: We have a saying in my shop when one speaks with out knowledge ''WHY DOES HE SPEAK''.......:_paranoid
Mario

You can get it done for around $800.. But they don't take off the parts and trim. Just take all the stuff off yourself, spend $800, and walkaway with a paint job that looks $5000... After working at a body shop, the whole $8000 for a paint job is such bull ****.. It is like $100 in paint and like 10 hours of labor with 2 guys..

[comp-spec]

LOL ........ I wish it was only 100
Just paid
1168.oo 1 gal base with reducer and 1 gal of clear with activator and reducer
no primers or sealers :wow:

[GeoffP]

You guys are a riot! :lol: You're making me think I should do the prep myself, buy the paint, and then pay someone to shoot it in a booth... (maybe I should, really).

[98ssnova]

Man I wish I could paint my car for 100 bux I remember when I did it like 12 years ago and I did all the body work my self paint clear buff. The paint cost 350 buxs for everthing and that was with a hookup from a friend. But if I had to cash in my time it would easily be a couple grand. :cheers: but good luck with the 100 dollar paint job:lol:

[70TWO NOVA]

I usually use Sherwin Williams paints which arent too bad price wise, but an average size car still cost around $300 to $500 in supplies. Too bad youre not closer or i could paint it for you. I charge somewhere in the neighborhood of 2-3k per job since im still learning.

Heres my most recent project. I honestly beleive you can get show quality results with less than top notch paint......as long as you know what you are doing.
http://www.lateral-g.net/forums/showthread.php4?t=17470&highlight=300zx

[Musclerodz]

I usually use Sherwin Williams paints which arent too bad price wise, but an average size car still cost around $300 to $500 in supplies. Too bad youre not closer or i could paint it for you. I charge somewhere in the neighborhood of 2-3k per job since im still learning.

Heres my most recent project. I honestly beleive you can get show quality results with less than top notch paint......as long as you know what you are doing.
http://www.lateral-g.net/forums/showthread.php4?t=17470&highlight=300zxYou may not tell the difference now, but you will in 5-10 years.

[DOOM]

LOL ........ I wish it was only 100
Just paid
1168.oo 1 gal base with reducer and 1 gal of clear with activator and reducer
no primers or sealers :wow:

I here ya my clear bill alone last month was $2100.00:faint: Pete sent you a PM .......
Mario

[70TWO NOVA]

You may not tell the difference now, but you will in 5-10 years.
i think if one keeps on top of the waxing/polishing with good quality products and keeps the car garaged it will last a lot longer than that.
What brand/products do you use?

[comp-spec]

I here ya my clear bill alone last month was $2100.00:faint: Pete sent you a PM .......
Mario
got your PM
Your the man THANKS .....you gave enough already

[70TWO NOVA]

Ive been using Sherwin Williams 4th Demension (Nason, Omni equivilant) for about 4 years now and everything Ive done so far has held up real nice, even in the heat and UV rays we get here in AZ. If thats not a test I dont know what is.

[jst8a5.0]

Yeah mid line DuPont silver, black, primer and clear, $1487.xx I guess a thread really just need a stupid comment to get jump started, hahaha!

[elitecustombody]

Ive been using Sherwin Williams 4th Demension (Nason, Omni equivilant) for about 4 years now and everything Ive done so far has held up real nice, even in the heat and UV rays we get here in AZ. If thats not a test I dont know what is.

I have no reason to try that Nason junk, but I tried 4th dimension as a "freebie" favor for one of my friends and will never use it again,I painted a front bumper ,hood and a fender for his 01 Z28, it was black and took nearly 5 coats to get the coverage ,Ultra 7000 will cover in one coat, so if you do the math, the cheap junk will cost more,as you will need alot more of it ,plus the smell of that junk was just plain nasty,it's like I just stepped next door at MAACO paint booth

[elitecustombody]

I guess a thread really just need a stupid comment to get jump started, hahaha!

isn't that how it usually works on just about any forums?

[70TWO NOVA]

I have no reason to try that Nason junk, but I tried 4th dimension as a "freebie" favor for one of my friends and will never use it again,I painted a front bumper ,hood and a fender for his 01 Z28, it was black and took nearly 5 coats to get the coverage ,Ultra 7000 will cover in one coat, so if you do the math, the cheap junk will cost more,as you will need alot more of it ,plus the smell of that junk was just plain nasty,it's like I just stepped next door at MAACO paint booth

im not saying Dimension is the best stuff in the world, but i dont think its as bad as some "professionals" make it out to be. The way i look at it is that for the price its a good all around product, no i wouldnt paint a show car with it. It seems like if you ask 10 painters about a product there will be 10 different opinions and there is always one who hates it and one who loves it.

[elitecustombody]

im not saying Dimension is the best stuff in the world, but i dont think its as bad as some "professionals" make it out to be. The way i look at it is that for the price its a good all around product, no i wouldnt paint a show car with it. It seems like if you ask 10 painters about a product there will be 10 different opinions and there is always one who hates it and one who loves it.

next time, why don't you try the GM 99k or whatever is straight black and let me know how many coats it will take to get for that stuff to cover,

Like I said,it makes no sense to even try to use it,because you will need atleast twice of that cheap base to get the same coverage with premium basecoat ,in the end, you spend the same money and spend atleast double the amount of time spraying the cheap junk, so I know to me it makes no sense ,

If you want a better product at even better price than 4th Dimension, try Pro-Spray or Matrix, trust me, it's 100 times better , I haven't used Valspar in ages, but their sealers and base were pretty good, matching wasn't that great

[70TWO NOVA]

i have, i shot this 95 Camaro with GM black in Dimension and cleared with their Ultimate Overall Clearcoat. Took about 5 coats to cover completely. Heres some pics;
http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj98/7dtwoo/HPIM1368.jpg
http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj98/7dtwoo/HPIM1372.jpg

[racebuicks]

2 coats would have been more than enough with PPG anymore than that with black and your throwing money away

[70TWO NOVA]

i had a full gallon of it anyway, so i dont see the harm in using it all to cover the car, plus being regular black it was cheaper anyway. Its not like i ran out.

[elitecustombody]

i have, i shot this 95 Camaro with GM black in Dimension and cleared with their Ultimate Overall Clearcoat. Took about 5 coats to cover completely. Heres some pics;
http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj98/7dtwoo/HPIM1368.jpg
http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj98/7dtwoo/HPIM1372.jpg


car look great, but you already said it yourself, it took 5 coat to cover,

Why don't you do the math, atleast twice of the basecoat,atleast twice the reducer,and atleast twice the time to spray it, does it make sense?

you spend same money or less for half of the amount of basecoat,atleast half or less of reducer and atleast half the time to spray the good stuff

Do you get what I'm saying?

[70TWO NOVA]

thanks, i get what you are saying, but it usually ends up being cheaper still than the "good stuff". i mean im in no way against other brands and qualities. I guess im just trying to say that the cheaper stuff can still produce as good results as the more expensive stuff.
What do you guys know about the life span/quality of the SW "Ultimate Overall Clear"

[racebuicks]

thanks, i get what you are saying, but it usually ends up being cheaper still than the "good stuff". i mean im in no way against other brands and qualities. I guess im just trying to say that the cheaper stuff can still produce as good results as the more expensive stuff.
What do you guys know about the life span/quality of the SW "Ultimate Overall Clear"


I may not know about your paint quality. BUT...Here is what I do know.... I painted my 70 GS in 1985 I used PPG (at the time the very best material) and to this day I have yet to have to repaint it because the paint is faded. Oh yea it has 245000 miles on it now over 160 since it was painted. I have repolished it about 7 years ago to get scratches out thats it. In 92 I painted my street car and if you park them side by side you cant tell the difference in the paint. Once again only polish required to keep the "like new " finish still on it. I will figure the math out so you dont have too 1985 $1000 worth of product then..............2009 today that makes my paint job 25 years old divided by $1000 I have about nothing in my paint job right now and it still looks great. Now think about this when your cheaper brand of paint is this old will it be show car ready still after a quick hand glaze???...........really only time will tell. I would never use cheaper stuff on a car that Im painting as I dont like the odds. Your car looks fine Im just making a point, you have to see how time and the elements treat your paint. Once you have a LARGE amount of time then you can brag about the cheap stuff. I have customers out there all over the country that I have painted for and ALL of them are still looking great. I hope it lasts for you ...really I do.

[racebuicks]

Here is a picture of the car taken in 05 that I painted in 85

I dont have any good shots at home they are on the work computer

[70TWO NOVA]

thanks, i agree with you 100% that I have yet to see the long term durability. I guess all i can say for it right now is, so far so good.

[elitecustombody]

thanks, i get what you are saying, but it usually ends up being cheaper still than the "good stuff". i mean im in no way against other brands and qualities. I guess im just trying to say that the cheaper stuff can still produce as good results as the more expensive stuff.
What do you guys know about the life span/quality of the SW "Ultimate Overall Clear"

I'm with you,I think I have tried just about every paintline there is or was avaliable from Sikkens,to ICI,to PPG,Glasurit,Diamont,DuPont,Martin Senior,Lessonal,Sherwin,Valspar,Pro-spray,SpiesHecker,Matrix, and some other ones,but if you try Matrix,you will want to forget about 4th dimension, try Matrix AG42 clear,you will not want to use anything else,

the main reason I went tru so many paintlines is to find the best match, and I can tell you, just stick with whatever system you use,some paint brands have better matches on domestics,some do better on imports, I have found that Sherwin Williams Ultra 7000 has awsome match on late model Hondas and Acuras,as I've painted and did alot of spot paint work on brand new Acuras,painted and installed spoilers on them , but for all over resprays Matrix is untouchable with ,coverage and ease to work with

[70TWO NOVA]

hows the cost on the matrix stuff? and who carries it?

[elitecustombody]

try to google your area body shop supply stores,and BTW, I've done a few Supras with Matrix back in 97 and till this day it looks like I just did it ,and it was the regular 4:1 mixing ratio clear, AG 40 is high-solids clearcoat with awsome UV protectants,I've manipulated and experimented with that clear so many times ,and I'm amazed ,you will forget what solvent pop is even if you hose on coat after coat after coat with no flash time, even if you mix in reducer,there is virtually no die-back and it's not hard to buff, use slow or very slow hardener and you will have glass-like finish,with the right gun anyone can lay it down with amazing results and best part,5 liter kit cost around $175

[70TWO NOVA]

thanks ill definatley have to try that. Im at the point where i want to start broadening my horizens anyway. Im 22 years old and have only been painting a little over 3 years, I think iam starting to get the hang of it and am contemplating making a career out of it. I really appreciate all the help.

[Musclerodz]

i think if one keeps on top of the waxing/polishing with good quality products and keeps the car garaged it will last a lot longer than that.
What brand/products do you use?
I use Dupont Chroma series for most jobs. I will use the higher end Dupont or HOK when the job calls for it. I have used all the cheap stuff over the last 15 years. Learned by trial and error like you are, and with every paint job, I bought nicer paint and nicer guns. Gone from $50 gal paint and $50 paint guns to $400 gal paint and $400 paint guns.

You will never realize it with overall paint jobs, but trying blending a collision job with cheap paint. Isn't going to happen unless you are a professional at blending and even then is a SOB. Not worth the headache.

[70TWO NOVA]

i only do full paint jobs so i havent had the problem of blending.

[GeoffP]

Good info guys! I personally have only done some very small jobs with a couple cars I wasn't afraid to mess up. I had an 83 Camaro years ago that I didn't mind making a mistake on and then helped my mom paint her 89 S-10 Blazer. We did all the paint prep and priming in the shop I owned at the time and took it to a friend of mine for the final paint. Since my IROC is one I plan to keep, I don't want to screw it up if I make a big mistake. This is why I'm researching shops to do the work. Either way, keep the comments going - I'd love to see more.

[70TWO NOVA]

well, since we are on the topic of advice, what do you guys use when color sanding, buffing, polishing? Any particular brands you guys like? Ive been using 3m stuff and it seems to work well, its just kinda expensive.

[DOOM]

well, since we are on the topic of advice, what do you guys use when color sanding, buffing, polishing? Any particular brands you guys like? Ive been using 3m stuff and it seems to work well, its just kinda expensive.

I use one product in my shop SYSTEM ONE! no other product in my shop. One product for all three steps! :hail:

[70TWO NOVA]

is the price comparable to the 3m brand stuff?
what makes it so good?
sorry for all the ?s

[racebuicks]

WE do it a little on the old school way still. We use dry 1200 on a finishing DA and then use the foam 3000 pads wet. Then polish with a Mequires red foam pad then a final buff with a smoother black 3m pad and polish. Take awhile to do ti right but the final outcome is very flat paint with no orange peel. Like glass!!:hail:

[70TWO NOVA]

WE do it a little on the old school way still. We use dry 1200 on a finishing DA and then use the foam 3000 pads wet. Then polish with a Mequires red foam pad then a final buff with a smoother black 3m pad and polish. Take awhile to do ti right but the final outcome is very flat paint with no orange peel. Like glass!!:hail:

what compound do you use? also, got any pis of the finished product?

[68protouring454]

the only way to get a troy like paint job or other hi end job, is to clear it 2-3 coats, sand it with hard block 600,800, re clear 2 coats, sand 1000,1500,2000 or higher, buff, then polish. clear will get wavy, and sanding with a da will make the clear fat, but will leave fat ladys ass everywhere, been there done that
also the meguirs one creme, 3 pad polish system is killer, as well as carborundum's deal, work s so nice.

[comp-spec]

3m perfect it ... NO DA ... water sand 1200 - single-stage DuPont Chroma Premier
http://www.competition-specialties.com/images/48chevy/gfiffin30.jpg

[racebuicks]

the only way to get a troy like paint job or other hi end job, is to clear it 2-3 coats, sand it with hard block 600,800, re clear 2 coats, sand 1000,1500,2000 or higher, buff, then polish. clear will get wavy, and sanding with a da will make the clear fat, but will leave fat ladys ass everywhere, been there done that
also the meguirs one creme, 3 pad polish system is killer, as well as carborundum's deal, work s so nice.

The fat lady ass marks are because you are not using the DA correctly. Look under my customers links in my signiture and see flat paint no fat lady ass marks.

what compound do you use? also, got any pis of the finished product?
I will have to wait to get you the polish numbers at work.

[68protouring454]

i am not talking about the little swirls the da leaves from the clear clogging the paper, i do not let a da within 100 ft of a cleared hot rod, maybe a in and out collision job.
i can promise a hand cut buff and polish will blow away a da finish any day of the week,

[70TWO NOVA]

heres my current project.
1200 grit wet sanded with foam pad, cut with 3m perfect it, polished with 3m Finess it.
http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj98/7dtwoo/Joes%20300ZX/HPIM1405.jpg
http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj98/7dtwoo/Joes%20300ZX/HPIM1394.jpg

[elitecustombody]

D/A is for lazy slackers,the finish will never be flat,especially when working on a vehicle with many curves where d/a sander will not lay flat,and will never reach in some corners, that's why I use hard rubber block and sanded flat and wrapped in masking tape mixing stick ,when it's all blocked down with 1000,I move up to 1200,1500,2000 and then use Kovax film on soft foam,then I use 3M Perfect-it II rubbing compoind on Meguiars Burgundy cutting pad, I got it dialed in so much that I can buff solid black paint and leave no swirls,the pad has to be broken in though, I've tried recommending my trick to few painters and none of them could get the results I'm getting,lol, it takes alot of patience and knowing your tools,as I never buff at high speed,I start cutting at around 1500 rpms,when I know that all sanding scratches are gone, I turn down the speed all the way down and do 15-20 passes ,pad must be loaded with compound and moist, I'm sure everyone has their own tricks and tecnique ,but it makes me cringe when I see some detailers turn up the speed to 7000 and try to buff with wool garbage,compound slinging all over the place,swirls that have to be sanded out,burnt edges,e.t.c.

[racebuicks]

Actually I will partially agree and partially disagree with you. Hand sanded cars will look as good as a DA sanded car, with that said you must know I dont DA the entire car. It cant be done. NOBODY is that good. EVer! Now what I do is all the flat areas get DA'd and the curved areas get 1200-1500 depending on paint peel in that region. After that I take the 3000 pad by hand and hand DA it so the paint will polish perfectly without burning thru the clear.

[elitecustombody]

i am not talking about the little swirls the da leaves from the clear clogging the paper, i do not let a da within 100 ft of a cleared hot rod, maybe a in and out collision job.
i can promise a hand cut buff and polish will blow away a da finish any day of the week,


I agree :cheers:

[jst8a5.0]

next time, why don't you try the GM 99k or whatever is straight black and let me know how many coats it will take to get for that stuff to cover

What do you mean by this. I thought you guys were talking about whatever line he uses and I believe this is a DuPont color. I just bought some but haven't cracked the seal. Lemme know.

[elitecustombody]

What do you mean by this. I thought you guys were talking about whatever line he uses and I believe this is a DuPont color. I just bought some but haven't cracked the seal. Lemme know.


I meant whatever the 4th dimesion has in black for GM black

[racebuicks]

Sorry, your photos are taken at 30 to 40 feet it seems and at low image resolution. I can't believe you are using a D/A that is too funny.


Jeff



I cant beleive that people dont complain about the straightline scratches you have when blocking the paint either ...........but to each his own.
I dont have an expensive camera here at the shop. I only use the one I use for the insurance work I do.
The picture I threw on here is a close up of a curved section of the car you can see the reflection is clean.

Look all this keyboard clipping of each others work is BS. The chance of this happening is so slim it wont happen, but if all of us here brought our work and parked it side by side, probably nobody could tell the difference in the paint jobs. We each have opinions on which way is correct. I only stated the thing about the fat lady ass remark because in my experience (doing this since 1982) the reason that happens is because the person running the DA was inexperienced. Tell me Im wrong???? That was not a dig at anyone just the facts as I have seen them in the last 20+ years.

One thing Im surprized at is noone has said this so I will. DAing a car with 1200 will not take off enough paint / clear to make fat lady ass marks. Unless the DA is up on edge. (thats not the correct way to use it anyway) And then 3000 that really doesnt take anything off either. ...And if you are DAing that way, you need to put the DA down and step away from the finish.

For the record ,all the work we do here gets no DA to it untill polish time. All cars are hand blocked (several times all the way to the sealer/paint time). I could see real fast that a DA could make fat lady ass marks in the paint job if it was used prior to paint. Thats why we dont do it. I have done cars and they are all over the US. Some of the work I did is now 20 years old, back then we used different materials. Todays materials are made for production shops, thus they have their own temperments. How people use them is how the end result looks once completed. My rule is the smoother you shoot it the less you buff. Primers included.

I can only vouch for the work we do here and it has been far suprerior than anyone in about a 200 mile radius that I have seen. If anyone wants to tour the shop here and your in the KC/ Topeka area sometime come on over. I tour all the time for travelers. I am part of 2 national car clubs and people traveling thru tour all the time. I have a brand new Morton building and a 30x30 paint room we shoot them in. In the mean time some of us need to step back and think about the slaps that are being thrown over a keyboard since you'all really dont know what really goes on....in anyones shop.

[comp-spec]

This is the only place a D/A belongs on a finished car :yes:

http://www.competition-specialties.com/pics/da.jpg

[racebuicks]

This is the only place a D/A belongs on a finished car :yes:

]


whatever:rolleyes:

[ProdigyCustoms]

Yup, a DA will ruin one quick. Rat tails everywhere, burn through edges, make the clear uneven, wavy. Really the cheaters way.

[GeoffP]

Maybe I'm ignorant, but I'd never dream of using a DA with any grit paper on a painted and cleared surface. That's just me though.

Now, does anyone have any other recommendations? ;) We've gotten a little off topic. Thanks!!

[comp-spec]

I guess it would be different if I didn't know that it could technically be done in a week or two if a couple guys were dedicated to the job.
.

2guys 1 week 80 hrs At 50 hr 4000.00
2guys 2 weeks 160 hrs at 50hr 8000.00
that's at only $50 hr and most shops are more then that

Now add paint Your looking at 6-10 grand

Remember the famous saying this isn't a show car I don't want a show paint job ..Till you get your car back and you start picking it apart and saying what about this and that. Then your telling everyone how you got the shaft and that guy S**ks...But remember you didn't want a show paint job

Good luck and remember were the DA belongs

[68protouring454]

lol, you have no idea what fat ladys arse is, lol. It is or has nothing to do with da marks. then you come on here and start acting like you know what your talking about.

p.s pete, that pic was great. te only time my da's get used is when stripping or polishing metal

[70TWO NOVA]

anyways...... i was gonna ask what you guys think of the Sharpe brand of guns. The razor model in particular compared to some of the devilbiss or iwata guns?

[68protouring454]

sharpe is decent, but iwata and sata are on top of the heap. i would buy a used sata before a new devilbiss or sharpe. but the sharpe will definitely work for you. Its just as you get better and better you will want to perfect everything

[racebuicks]

I use a pressure cup system made by Matson. I can flip canisters and paint multiple colors all at once. I love it. My painter likes the Sata gravity feed. Its all what your used too.

[elitecustombody]

anyways...... i was gonna ask what you guys think of the Sharpe brand of guns. The razor model in particular compared to some of the devilbiss or iwata guns?


nothing wrong with Sharpe, except it's about half the cost of Iwata or Sata,they are more higher quality guns,if you end up buyng used gun, make sure it sprays right before paying for it, my brother got screwed a few times buying used Sata guns,I'd rather pay full price for new one than buying used gun,unless it's a steal of a deal

[GeoffP]

I may have found a guy local (he's actually my wife's cousin) who has done some paint work on the side. He does fantastic work from the cars I've seen, so I plan to ask him if he'd be interested in doing my car in my garage through final prep and then paint it in a booth. I have a friend in Sandersville that owns a shop that would probably shoot the final spray for me so I'm going explore that route. What I need to know since ya'll were talking about paint brands, what's a good middle of the road paint system to use? I have used PPG products before so I know a little about how they're mixed etc. Is there something that would be comperable price wise that produces better results?

Thanks!

[GeoffP]

Good news for me. I called the friend of mine in Sandersville and after talking to him for a few minutes he said he could probably do the all over paint for about $2000. I'm thinking he quoted me a little low, but still think it'll be less than $3500 or so. The bad news is that he's so booked that it'll be at least 2-3 weeks before he can start on it. I figure I've waited this long, I can wait a little longer. When I asked what paint system he uses these days, he said it's a German company. It's funny because my 95 Z28 was the first car he painted with that German paint 10 years ago when we was first trying it out. (at least it's funny to me!) I'm probably going to go with him since I know what kind of work he does (he's the one that painted the car almost 15 years ago - man I'm gettin' old!). He's a good guy so I know he'll do me right. I'm excited - it's been awhile since I had a nice looking car to drive. :D

[comp-spec]

can you put up pics of the car your painting

[GeoffP]

I'll do my best to get some up this weekend. I haven't been able to this week because of the weather and it getting dark so soon after I get off work.

[DOOM]

This is the only place a D/A belongs on a finished car :yes:

http://www.competition-specialties.com/pics/da.jpg

x2!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[GeoffP]

DOH - Crappy weather keeps preventing me from getting pics of my car. It's raining today here so probably won't have any posted today either. Imagine this - the clear is peeling up in sheets because of the base reacting (it's literally falling apart under the clear). Whenever it rains, I end up with more and more clear peeling up. All the horizontal surfaces are just about completely peeled up with only the base left on the car (if this helps at all). The good news is that it should really make getting the clear off easy. I am guessing a trip to the car wash pressure washer will probably blow most of the clear right off the car. A razor blade may get quite a bit off too. I haven't tried that yet either.

Right now, I'm shopping for a new or good used rear bumper cover (mine is wavy) and a new hood, probably ASCD SS hood or something similar. I already have a new front chin spoiler and the rest of the GFX are in decent shape, so no need to replace them.

I'm also looking at a set of C6 Corvette 18/19's for it off e-Bay. The car should look pretty nice when I'm done. :D