Running Hot

[rsk68]

Hi all,
Seems the car dosnt want to run when it gets over 210 deg, the first time it happened it started sputtering and poping like the ignition was cutting out and then it just whent dead this was when I got off the freeway from a 30 mile ride, on the freeway it runs at 180 deg and just gets hot when i hit the surface streets. After towing the car home i noticed the battery terminal was loose, could this cause the ignition to not work well at idle? I'm runing a Digital E-Curve Pro-Billet Distributor with no box, now it also feels like its flooding when this happens, could it be due to not getting enough spark at this time, and could the ignition really fail at just 210 deg?
Also what temperature should i get nervous at, 210 dosnt seem that hot, i have a Ron Divis radiator in it and thought this would be the least of my worries. As for now I'm only good for a short trip around town and this is no way to enjoy a fresh built car.

[rich-allen]

My jeeps thermostat doesn't even open until 205 degrees. My buds camaro (2000) came stock with a 215 thermostat so, it's just getting warmed up.

I would check your gauge, something doesn't sound right.



Rich

[Vegas69]

With a carb it's a different ball game. Around 210 is when mine starts getting a hesitation but doesn't die. The fuel injected cars can run much hotter without any drivability issues. The cooling fan in my vette came on at 235. While it won't hurt your motor carbuerators just don't like the heat.

[rsk68]

I wonder if a insulated cab spacer would help out a bit.

[Vegas69]

Need to get her cooling better around town.

[XcYZ]

A phenolic spacer would help with the carb. As for the coolant temp, from what you're saying, you need more fan/better shroud. What are you using for a fan now?

[rsk68]

Hey Scott
I'm running a Ron Davis Radiator with a 160 thermostat, this is the fan relay and thermostat kit im running, I copied it from there website.

Two (2) 40 amp weather resistant relays
One (1) Stainless steel fan switch (On 185 / Off 165)
Two (2) In-line fuse holders w/ 30 Amp fuse
Detailed instructions included

[camcojb]

It isn't the radiator, it's the fan if it's heating up in traffic or low speeds. What fan(s) are you running?

Jody

[rsk68]

Hi Jody,
I'm running Ron Davis, Im also wondering if I have the timing to advanced, I dont have a timing lite so one of the guys at the shop set it at 36 deg total advance.

[Y-TRY]

I had a similar problem with my car. As mine turned out, my alternator wasn't rated to produce enough amps at low rpm. With the big fuel pump and ignition running, the fan kicking-on was just enough to overdraw the system. It ultimately killed the battery and left me stranded a few times before changed alternators. The combo of low alternator rpm and slow wind speed caused my car to get hot and the additional juice needed for the fan dropped the spark needed for the ignition. So it was overheated and stuttering as you describe.

Overheating and stuttering because of the alternator? I know this seems like a stretch but that ended up being my problem. I re-wired the whole car several times trying to chase that down. Lesson learned. It might not be your situation but it's worth mentioning.

[rsk68]

Y-TRY
I believe this is what is happening to me, I myself have no way to check amperage coming out of the alternator, can someone tell me what it should be reading and an easy way to check it, I think i can get a meter from my brother. currently I'm running the 140 amp unit that came with the front runner system from Vintage air.

[68protouring454]

change the pulley on the alternator to a smaller one, so it spins more rpms at low motor rpm, this is not the first problem with the front runner set up

[rsk68]

Can i get this smaller pully from VIntage Air, what diameter do you recomend?
makes sense that this would help.

[68protouring454]

i am not sure about the equation to use to figure it out, but any pulley would work as long as it has the same about of ribs.
someone here maybe able to help with the equation to figure out what the crank pulley is spinning at idle and what the alt is spinning currently at idle. then find spec for max rpm on alternator and go as small as you can, without going over max alt rpm at engine wot

[Y-TRY]

The two aspects I learned:

1- The ratio is about 3:1, based on how the alternator companies rate their output. If they quote 140amps, that's at driving speed with 3:1 pulley ratio. If the ratio is altered the amperage also changes. If you have a lower ratio AND an alternator that is weak at low RPM that could be the 1-2 punch that you're experiencing.

2- In this case, peak amperage isn't as important as what it puts out at idle or low rpm. Not all 140-amp alternators are the same. They have power curves. Shop around.

Contact Powermaster as well as Vintage Air to verify what I'm saying and point you in the right direction. Your alternator company should be able to tell you the curve.

My pulleys had about 2:1 ratio but changing them wasn't an option. So, even after swapping to a high-amp/low rpm alternator I have to idle slightly faster than I would normally to compensate. But it really helped me. This was very frusatrating to hunt down. It'd be worth it if I can help someone else.

[rsk68]

Well I finally took the car to a local tuner and the car has never run better, the car can sit and idle all day and not get hot at 180* but as soon as you drive it in town slow stop and go up to 40 it gets up to 210*, as soon as it hits 210* it gets a little hesitation and pop going in the carb, it was 94* outside and i didnt have the Air on, hate tho think what would happen if i did that.
It could be I'm over reacting at 210* but I'm scared of braking down again and i would love to run the Air, could i just have a hot blooded motor that will always run on the hot side?
I told my wife last night I need the new Edelbrock fuel injecrted 555 so i wouldnt have this problem any more, she didnt go for it.

[camcojb]

I had this exact problem a few years ago, wish I could remember the details. It was fine at idle and as soon as I touched the gas the temps climbed, let off to idle and they came back down. Not a fan issue as it cools fine at idle. In my case the pump was spinning too fast, and I swapped to a bigger water pump pulley to slow the pump down. Problem eliminated.

I think you have the front runner though, and that system has been out for a long time without issues. In my case I had a put together deal and the water pump pulley was too small, spun the pump too fast. Water temps acted like a tach, going up with rpms. I believe it was a Vic Jr water pump, and some March pieces.

Jody

[Vegas69]

Mine is doing the same thing. Mid nineties and around town stop lights and such it runs between 200-210. Get out on the freeway and 180-195. Now when it cools off into the 70's or 80's it cools easily. I would like it to run cooler but it's not going to happen. 210 isn't going to hurt anything. I put on a Phelonic carb spacer yesterday and it has really helped my hard hot start and hesitation hot.

[rsk68]

Hey Jody,

I think I'm going to lose my hair over this one, I wonder if an oil cooler with a fan would make a big difference.

[jy211]

what's your cooling fan set up look like? I am running a fan/shroud combo off a cobra on my 396 and it's sits at 180 or below with the air on. I am running a BS tru track set up as well.

[rsk68]

Ron Davis 3400 CFM and vintage Air front runner

[Vegas69]

I have dual 11" spals with over 3000 cfm as well. That 555 will be really hard to cool.:unibrow: 210 shouldn't kill your engine or have any damaging effects. You are finding a bug that needs attention with a stall at that temp.