Penny's new little sister?

[Steve1968LS2]

Calling tonight to make an offer on this '68 Camaro.. well, it's a '68 Camaro with a '67 quarter, one less side marker to fill. lol Seems like a decent roller considering some of the turds I've looked at.

Whatch think?

No numbers matching 350/powerslide combo, rebuilt subrame
http://picsorban.com/upload/tr1.jpg

Original quarter with minimal filler
http://picsorban.com/upload/tr2.jpg

Clean floors, no rust. Original auto car
http://picsorban.com/upload/tr3.jpg

No rust in the cowl and the window channels look good. I think the car came from Arizona at some point.
http://picsorban.com/upload/tr4.jpg

Underside looks good.. grungy but no rust.
http://picsorban.com/upload/tr5.jpg

[Steve1968LS2]

Passengers side quarter was replaced long ago. They did an "ok" job of it. The frame has a slight buckle. Should be about to fix it on the frame rack if needed.
http://picsorban.com/upload/tr6.jpg

Pretty sure the back panel was replaced with the quarter. Looks to be OEM parts (makes sense since they were done long ago.) Trunk lid is new as well.
http://picsorban.com/upload/tr7.jpg

Replaced quarter. Panel alignment seems decent. The "inner" areas are a bit rough. I bet it was an insurance repair back before these cars were worth anything.
http://picsorban.com/upload/tr8.jpg

All the trim and most of the parts come with the car. Missing the front glass but who cares.Can anyone ID this gearbox??? Doesn't look OEM, I have an idea who's it is but I want to confirm.
http://picsorban.com/upload/tr9.jpg

I ran the magnet sheet over the car. I could tell theres a little filler in the car, but since the glass is out I could look in and see it was a "poke and pop" deal, typical dent repair deal. No real rust issues that I saw.

[jack67rs]

What part of that car is a 67??

[Todds69]

Looks like quite the find, as long as the $$ decent...go for it.

[Steve1968LS2]

What part of that car is a 67??

Actually.. I just ran the numbers and it's a '68.. The guy thought it was a '67 with '68 fenders but it's really a '68 with a '67 rear quarter. lol

He thought the windwings were in boxes with the rest of the parts. But the VIN says '68 :)

[monza]

Looks like a good roller, all depends on the cost? ( another girl...should be Penny's bad ass little bro)

I've always thought a great start would be from this place Mike Custom Cars- http://www.mikescustomcars.com/69bodies.htm#

Maybe not what what your looking for just a thought and doesn't make for a exciting start for a mag article. Add the cost of your roller then all the repair to get it to that stage seems like a fair price?



But back to the start..... did you buy it and for how much?? :)

[mazspeed]

Hey Steve, what are your plans with the car?

[Steve1968LS2]

But back to the start..... did you buy it and for how much?? :)

Actually those bodies look pretty good.. prices seem "fair" for what you get.

I just got off the phone, I paid $5.900 which I think is pretty good for a solid roller.

It wouldn't be that hard to get running and on the road.. but I might as well start in on the fun stuff :)

[Steve1968LS2]

Hey Steve, what are your plans with the car?

I don't know.. I'm sorta torn.

Plan 1.

Budget build.. 5.3 LS truck engine.. modified factory subframe... suede black paint, killer wheels, C5 brakes .. A real track vibe, a look sorta like f-bomb.

Plan 2.

Nicer build (not Penny nice). LS7 engine or built LS3.. aftermarket subframe.. suede black paint, killer wheels, Big brakes, track vibe.. same as above.


I want the car to have a very sinister look. I'm open to ideas

[awr68]

This will be fun to watch!!

[brownz]

I don't know.. I'm sorta torn.

Plan 1.

Budget build.. 5.3 LS truck engine.. modified factory subframe... suede black paint, killer wheels, C5 brakes .. A real track vibe, a look sorta like f-bomb.

Plan 2.

Nicer build (not Penny nice). LS7 engine or built LS3.. aftermarket subframe.. suede black paint, killer wheels, Big brakes, track vibe.. same as above.


I want the car to have a very sinister look. I'm open to ideas

Would go with #1 just cuz would be cool to see what you can do on a budget. Plus with a Ls7 would just piss Penny off lol but dont forget the forgeline wheels no need for a budget on that and FLAT paint is sweet try white think that would be cool! just a thought

Brandon

[Steve1968LS2]

Would go with #1 just cuz would be cool to see what you can do on a budget. Plus with a Ls7 would just piss Penny off lol but dont forget the forgeline wheels no need for a budget on that and FLAT paint is sweet try white think that would be cool! just a thought

Brandon

That's what I was thinking.. I can't afford to build a car nicer than Penny.. so I want to build it different. A real mil-spec look but with wipers for Power Tour and maybe even a hidden AC system.

Other than that I want it lightweight and fast.. and lots of black.

Besides, If I build it budget first I can always go back and do the higher-end stuff.

I know the look the car will have, just figuring out the parts selection.

[JohnC]

Congrats on the new find, Steve! Looks very solid.

Ideas, eh? Sure, I have plenty for you...

How about all-wheel drive, or a turbo, or big billet chevy rallyes....:willy: :faint:

...something different and unique is always cool.:cool:

John

[monza]

That's a good price for sure... a budget build would be fun to watch... fun cause you'd never be able to do it! Unless "freebees" and good guy deals don't get tossed into the budget.:thumbsup:

[XcYZ]

Looks like the perfect victim, Steve.

I'll throw my 2 cents in... I think you should build the biggest cube LS motor you can afford/fit into the budget and drop a set of L92 heads on it.

[Nine Ball]

You already have a mega-buck 68, so I'd say go for the ultimate bang-for-the-buck hotrod with this one. See how nice of a car you can build with a limit of $25K invested, doing most of the work yourself.

[jack67rs]

You already have a mega-buck 68, so I'd say go for the ultimate bang-for-the-buck hotrod with this one. See how nice of a car you can build with a limit of $25K invested, doing most of the work yourself.

I agree, maybe a trans am style racer on a budget. although I was'nt crazy about the g/28 camaro phr did, I think it would be easier to accomplish with a first gen.

[Vegas69]

I saw you shopping on Ebay the other night. I didn't figure the cat was coming out of the bag this quick. Suede black driver would be really cool.:yes:

[bigtyme1]

Paint it Silver and call it SuzanB:unibrow:

[Steve1968LS2]

I agree, maybe a trans am style racer on a budget. although I was'nt crazy about the g/28 camaro phr did, I think it would be easier to accomplish with a first gen.

We'll see.. the look will most certainly be different from Penny. Not sure on the parts load out.. maybe a mix of nice stuff and budget stuff.

Like an aftermarket subframe with OEM brakes.. that sort of deal. A super budget 5.3L or used LS1...

Oh well, I have time to decide.. gonna take a bit to get the body in fighting form.

I'm thinking of a name.. Project Track Rat... I don't think it's been used before in the PT circle..

[Steve1968LS2]

Paint it Silver and call it SuzanB:unibrow:

The the best "play on Penny" line I've heard.. PM me your address and t-shirt size.. you WIN! ;)

[Rybar]

Nice score Steve, you just can't get enough of LSX powered 1st gens. :thumbsup: That looks like a pretty solid body which is the main thing.

I'd like to see the most you could get out of a stock subframe with say DSE coil overs and ATS spindles. Maybe try out an air-bar or g-bar rear suspension. I'd paint it charcoal metallic grey on black ralley stripes. With some charcoal centered Fikse profil 5s 18's. And for power I'd do a pullout 6.0L truck motor with L92/L76 setup and a T56. Let's see if you can do a budget build without it snowballing too much :lol:

[Smack_talker]

If your gunna do the budget deal, I say a budget street fighter would be cool. First gen without all the bling would be diff at this point.

[rwhite692]

Steve, just buy it. You need it. It needs you.

<edit> Oh wait, I see that you pulled the trigger. Excellent.

-Rob

[Vegas69]

Nice score Steve, you just can't get enough of LSX powered 1st gens. :thumbsup: That looks like a pretty solid body which is the main thing.

I'd like to see the most you could get out of a stock subframe with say DSE coil overs and ATS spindles. Maybe try out an air-bar or g-bar rear suspension. I'd paint it charcoal metallic grey on black ralley stripes. With some charcoal centered Fikse profil 5s 18's. And for power I'd do a pullout 6.0L truck motor with L92/L76 setup and a T56. Let's see if you can do a budget build without it snowballing too much :lol:

You already blew the budget in one paragraph!!:D

[DWMotorsports]

I don't know.. I'm sorta torn.

I want the car to have a very sinister look. I'm open to ideas
Build a Chevelle :rofl:



Looks like a nice starter for sure...:thumbsup:

[Spiffav8]

Looks good to me! Should be able to build a real nice car with what you have in mind.

Like Anthony said...This will be fun to watch. Though I'm betting it will be more wild than mild knowing you. :unibrow:

[ArisESQ]

Personally I don't see the point in building another camaro pro-touring style when you have Penny... which has pretty much every pro-touring bell and whistle you can imagine.

I'm probably gonna get al kinds of crap for even suggesting this, but maybe since you already have arguably one of the nicest pro-touring camaro builds out there, why not try building something a little more like pro-street meets pro-touring meets street racer... like some big shiny wheels, with plenty of tire in the back, a huge cube LSX with forced induction, and some nitrous maybe... I dunno. I feel like something like that could potentially be a lot of fun to build.

[DriverzInc]

I have to agree, flat black is getting a little too done. Maybe tone on tone with a flat grey, with gloss grey graphics, and then flat black powder coat the trim. Do your motor up in grey's and brushed look. Just a couple of ideas for color schems....

Sent you a PM, I have some great ideas for wheels! :thumbsup:

[Payton King]

Nice looking car!

I would make it a track rat just like you stated earlier. Epoxy primer (tinted to your choice of colors) , full cage, LSX motor and aftermarket subframe. I think you will have about the same amount in modifying stock one. Maybe even some steel NASCAR rims and rubber....slight flair of fenders on all corners.

Keep Penny shiney and beat the crap out of Buffalo (as in Buffalo nickle)

So you don't answer your PM's? What do I need to do to get on the A list? LOL

[Steve1968LS2]

Personally I don't see the point in building another camaro pro-touring style when you have Penny... which has pretty much every pro-touring bell and whistle you can imagine.

I'm probably gonna get al kinds of crap for even suggesting this, but maybe since you already have arguably one of the nicest pro-touring camaro builds out there, why not try building something a little more like pro-street meets pro-touring meets street racer... like some big shiny wheels, with plenty of tire in the back, a huge cube LSX with forced induction, and some nitrous maybe... I dunno. I feel like something like that could potentially be a lot of fun to build.

That sounds exactly like f-bomb.. lol

I don't know.. I see many different ways to build a "PT" style car.. Anyone that knows me KNOWS I can't build something junky.. I just can't. So, that leaves nice and expensive or nice and inexpensive. Expensive would be an $80k car.. inexpensive would be in the $25k range. Or I could shoot for a mid range budget of $40k. Hell, my Fairlane has $36k in it (counting the car) and it's considered a "real guy's car".

I want something that's the poster child for Street Fighter.. needless to say I will be speaking with Steevo and working out ideas.

[Steve1968LS2]

ok...after pondering this a lil longer im gonna outline the "plan" for ya:unibrow:



semi gloss tan...forget the camo idea. scca cage, with a vid cam mount(we want in car vids) black out anything that was supposed to be shiny...including the wheels. speaking of wheels.... NO mini-tubs.... 255's/275's, 3-link, simple oe based brakes w/ cooling ducting, tradional iron block/alum head sbc(big bore/short stroke)...dry sump is a must, along with overkill cooling, trans&diff coolers. CARB'd...no stinkin efi... 8mpg MAX. tko trans, stock subframe... worked over with a "kit". "real" spoilers f&r....window "straps". 32 gal fuel cell(think 90 miles wide open:_paranoid )
on board nav/timer set-up, fresh-air system/helemt radio communication

then tune for the elevation in Ely, NV :unibrow:

I'm digging every one of those things EXCEPT the engine.. I'm an EFI guys and carbs just suck. Besides, with EFI I wouldn't HAVE to tune for elevation.. just bring you the car. lol -- TKO 600 for sure.

I'm really leaning towards a satin car.. blacked out parts with any stainless brushed. Non-mini tubbed (for now). OEM brakes. "real" spoilers. window straps, big tank (although those get pricey). LOTS of cooling. I might even do stories on building two frames. The first would be a fully-modified stocker and the second an aftermarket frame.. see how the price REALLY shakes out. I like the aftermarket frame since you can run wider front tires. 265 front and 275 rears would be nice.

[68protouring454]

sounds killer steve, how about 275s all around like carlc runs? i can't wait to watch the build transpire, its gonna be badass:cheers:

[ArisESQ]

That sounds exactly like f-bomb.. lol

I don't know.. I see many different ways to build a "PT" style car.. Anyone that knows me KNOWS I can't build something junky.. I just can't. So, that leaves nice and expensive or nice and inexpensive. Expensive would be an $80k car.. inexpensive would be in the $25k range. Or I could shoot for a mid range budget of $40k. Hell, my Fairlane has $36k in it (counting the car) and it's considered a "real guy's car".

I want something that's the poster child for Street Fighter.. needless to say I will be speaking with Steevo and working out ideas.

I agree that there are probably a thousand way to build a PT car, but in the end they are intended to serve at least vaguely the same purpose... Thats why I figure a car like F-Bomb would be cool to see. They have a lot of character and are a blast to build and drive.

[Stuart Adams]

I'm looking inside my crystal ball and I see 100K in the future, LOL.

[Steve1968LS2]

semi gloss tan...

Hey, maybe I will steal your avatar for my nose art.. ;)

[Steve1968LS2]

I'm looking inside my crystal ball and I see 100K in the future, LOL.

Maybe I will build it twice.. the first budget.. then "all out".. see if the "all out" car is any better.

:yes:

[Musclerodz]

For a track rat, I would not go black, that would be one hot SOB on track day. I say white epoxy primer/sealer, blacked out trim, wheels, etc. THen you can sticker it to death with sponsors. Carbed 5.3 or 6.0, stinger hood. NO mini tubs, notched stock sub for tire clearance. ATS spindles, SC&C upper arms, coil over shocks, Alston "G" bar, Fays2 watts link.

[ArisESQ]

Personally I think you should do minitubs just because they suit these cars so well. I realize that there isn't necessarily a huge performance advantage for a track car, but then again if you wanted to build an all out race car to dominate at the track, I feel like a first gen camaro may not be the best starting point.

[mad68rs]

Hey steve I was thinking about a 5.3L truck engine too, but i haven't seen very many "built" ones. How much horsepower and torque do you think you could pull out of one? Enough to hold up at the track?

[Steve1968LS2]

For a track rat, I would not go black, that would be one hot SOB on track day. I say white epoxy primer/sealer, blacked out trim, wheels, etc. THen you can sticker it to death with sponsors. Carbed 5.3 or 6.0, stinger hood. NO mini tubs, notched stock sub for tire clearance. ATS spindles, SC&C upper arms, coil over shocks, Alston "G" bar, Fays2 watts link.

You guys and your silly carbs.. lol.. I'm still not convinced it's a cheaper route compared to the plentiful GM EFI stuff out there.

Ohh.. the G-bar and Fays2 deal sounds nice...

[slownova]

i've heard enough about the 5.3s already. maybe its becouse of where i live, not sure. you should build a 6.0 with a 4.8 crank and whatever rods you need to make it work. some L-92 heads and intake. be cheap, run balls out and be unique and cheap.

[buickfunnycar.com]

...Trans-Am:yes:

Keep it sinister and keep it simple...:unibrow:

[CraigMorrison]

Is this the car you were telling me about last week?

[Steve1968LS2]

Is this the car you were telling me about last week?

Yea, it was the covoluted eBay deal..

[Huxsol81]

Other than that I want it lightweight and fast.. and lots of black.





OH YEAH!!!!!!!:thumbsup:

[jeff s]

Find me a 67, 68 vert like that please

[radrambler]

steven
i like the #1 idea if it matters..love to see your build of the 5.3 fi
how about that fairmont with the 5.3 turbo ?....DAMN
i just picked up a 5.3 pullout for less than 250.00
i already have the camaro intake ...i made a deal for the rest of the ls1 injectors and rails along with a f-body pan/pickup/tray that i needed anyway.
i will probably throw a cam in(after reading how much they pickup)
gonna clean it up and paint it ,gonna get the rambler going sooner because the ls1 is all apart and takes more $ than this to get done.
yes, i said going...not draggin ass anymore...
back to your build......love to see you do as much non-bling ,creative build ..scrounging up good used deals (ebay or forum classifieds)and making paint your friend.


radrambler

[Bulldog68]

My thoughts exactly... trans am style without all the frills. Clean, functional, minimal expensive stuff (billet hinges, etc). Oh yeah, and how bout a carb'd LS3 under the hood?

I agree, maybe a trans am style racer on a budget. although I was'nt crazy about the g/28 camaro phr did, I think it would be easier to accomplish with a first gen.

[evilzee28]

...Trans-Am:yes:

Keep it sinister and keep it simple...:unibrow:

Seconded!! a clean, back to basics look with awesome track look & capabilities. Modern day Trans Am car with large dia Minilite, 3 piece replicas:thumbsup:

[monza]

A sinister sort of lower budget all blacked out track car would be cool... except maybe one thing, can you use your special "magazine powers" and get GM performance to 'loan' you a LS9!! That would be something to see new and different.:unibrow:

[formula98]

I'm all for #1. I just picked up 2 Gen III 5.3's :woot: one for my 80 and the other we'll see! If it works out ok maybe for the 67. Do a Carb intake! That is my plan and will consider FI in the future!:thumbsup: I would like to see an article done on the Gen III and a carb setup similar to Reggie Jackson or Dale Jr.'s carb setups. A budget build would be great!

[Musclerodz]

You guys and your silly carbs.. lol.. I'm still not convinced it's a cheaper route compared to the plentiful GM EFI stuff out there.

Ohh.. the G-bar and Fays2 deal sounds nice...Well, the intent would be to later install a TBI/FAST system with a cowl plenum intake alah early Chevelle or 67 Z/28 with a flat hood Yunick style.

[Neil B]

Seconded!! a clean, back to basics look with awesome track look & capabilities. Modern day Trans Am car with large dia Minilte, 3 piece replicas:thumbsup:

x3. Simple, clean, and functional. For $30-35K tops.

[G-TX]

Unless I missed someone else guessing the steering box.... http://www.mamotorworks.com/corvette-1-302-1363.html
http://www.1320video.com/img/HRMFairmont/FairmontFeature_HRM_April_Pg_72_73.sized.jpg
I'm with the others here on the turbo :D 5.3...
http://www.1320video.com/img/HRMFairmont/FairmontFeature_HRM_April_Pg_76_77.sized.jpg
http://www.1320video.com/img/HRMFairmont/FairmontFeature_HRM_April_Pg_74_75.sized.jpg

[Bulldog68]

Seconded!! a clean, back to basics look with awesome track look & capabilities. Modern day Trans Am car with large dia Minilte, 3 piece replicas:thumbsup:

Good call on the minilites. :thumbsup:

[GeoffP]

I agree to keep it simple. A 5.3 would be a cool engine and should be relatively low cost to get. Keep it on a budget that the AVERAGE guy can build. Don't cut up the body, floor pan, etc to make stuff fit. See just how good you can get it to handle with the stock frame using available aftermarket add-on's like A-arms, spindles, etc (like several have suggested). I'm not sure that I agree on a $25000 budget. I bet you could build a nice ride out of that car for less than $20,000 if you shop right, buy used when possible, etc.

Just my .02 cents...

GeoffP
68 Camaro LT1/T-56 4.11 (soon to have the FIRST set of 12.19 Wilwood 6 piston brakes) :)
87 Camaro IROC-Z LT1/4L60E 3.23

[awr68]

Steve, you really got these guys thinking!!

Budget build eigh? Yeah mine started that way too!! :lol:

:lol: yea, many builds start that way.

But I have Penny in my garage if I have the urge to wax something. Besides, I can build this car one for $28k, test it, and they throw all the NICE stuff at it see what gain in performance there was, if any.

[Steve1968LS2]

I agree to keep it simple. A 5.3 would be a cool engine and should be relatively low cost to get. Keep it on a budget that the AVERAGE guy can build. Don't cut up the body, floor pan, etc to make stuff fit. See just how good you can get it to handle with the stock frame using available aftermarket add-on's like A-arms, spindles, etc (like several have suggested). I'm not sure that I agree on a $25000 budget. I bet you could build a nice ride out of that car for less than $20,000 if you shop right, buy used when possible, etc.

Just my .02 cents...

GeoffP
68 Camaro LT1/T-56 4.11 (soon to have the FIRST set of 12.19 Wilwood 6 piston brakes) :)
87 Camaro IROC-Z LT1/4L60E 3.23

As for the "budget".. some will argue that it should be $10k to build a car.. some would say $50k.. It's really an individual deal.

I think anything under $30k is a "average joe" budget, especially for a Camaro. The Fairlane it at around $36k right now and most people consider that an realistic build. Also, we are talking about a build using all new parts that can be duplicated and not the "I found this stroker at the swap meet/junkyard for cheap" sort of deal.

Also, I could build the car for $15k but it would look like crud.. I want the car to perform and look cool as well. Something the average guy would be proud to cruise or run at the track.

[brownz]

Steve build for the average guy:D i think that 30k is a good number to keep the quality and still have some money left. i was thinking 15k for my car and now its going to be about double that so i hope you 30k dosent turn into 60k lol

[Steve1968LS2]

Steve build for the average guy:D i think that 30k is a good number to keep the quality and still have some money left. i was thinking 15k for my car and now its going to be about double that so i hope you 30k dosent turn into 60k lol


No.. I will budget for $25k and that way I will spend $29k lol

One place I will not skimp is on the wheels.. wheels make the car and someone wants steelies then they can duplicate the car even cheaper. lol

My goal is not to build a rat rod. :yes:

[cetchup]

Call it "Bad Pony". 3 shades of Black and all business,"Bad Business".JMO

[GeoffP]

Steve,

You're right that $15k won't cut it, but I really think $20k will. I actually have less than $15k in mine right now and get all kinds of thumbs up's when I'm out driving it. It's not perfect by any means, has a little rust and a wee bit of primer, but it still looks really good. I have to respectfully disagree that $30k is an "average joe" budget. Maybe it's because of the area of the country I live in that shapes my opinion (Georgia BTW). Or maybe it's because I bought mine at a really good deal (from my brother) to keep it in the family, so maybe that has skewed my opinion as well. In your defense (I'm not much of a debater am I??) I have to remember that 67-69 Camaros are getting to the point that the car purchase by itself would break most average joe's budgets. Thanks for the comments. I'm sure you are right - $30k is much more doable with new parts.

Good luck with your build. I am sure I will enjoy tracking it start to finish.

(edit - flow of my post didn't look right - had to fix it!)

GeoffP
68 Camaro LT1/T-56 4.11 (soon to have the FIRST set of 12.19 Wilwood 6 piston brakes)
87 Camaro IROC-Z LT1/4L60E 3.23

[trapin]

Putting a carb on a Gen III ruins all the fun of having one of these engines in my opinion. And besides, it's expensive too. Car Craft just did a story on a 5.3 build and they converted it to a carb. Cost them $1116 to do it. Stupid. And unnecessary too.

[formula98]

Why would you say something like that? :question: I picked up a brand new 5.3 (2 of them) it did not come with a fuel injection setup! I have the carb and I'm going to buy the Edelbrock setup for $650 ~ $700 how much more will FI run me? Minimum would be $2,500 to buy an off the shelf setup...

Some of the motor guys I've talked to state the carb will provide better power over the FI and still have great mileage. There are pro's and cons to both. I love FI, but not in my plans at the moment! I read some articles on a Carbed LS2 a while back and it produced better results than FI. It is all in what you are looking for and what your budget can handle.

[Steve1968LS2]

Why would you say something like that? :question: I picked up a brand new 5.3 (2 of them) it did not come with a fuel injection setup! I have the carb and I'm going to buy the Edelbrock setup for $650 ~ $700 how much more will FI run me? Minimum would be $2,500 to buy an off the shelf setup...

Some of the motor guys I've talked to state the carb will provide better power over the FI and still have great mileage. There are pro's and cons to both. I love FI, but not in my plans at the moment! I read some articles on a Carbed LS2 a while back and it produced better results than FI. It is all in what you are looking for and what your budget can handle.

Nope.. you could have bought a used LS1 intake and fuel rail for a couple hundred bucks. Most LSx engines you buy from salvage yards will come with all the stuff you need and then you just need to rework the harness and flash the ECU.

Is that 650-700 for the carb set up counting the Carb, Intake, Electronics, and Harness? Everytime I add it up I get at least $1000... :shrug:

Then you have to tune the carb.. and if you change big altitude you have to re-tune the carb.. If carbs are so great then why don't new cars run them anymore? lol

And while I do agree that a carbed LS motor will make more power it's at the sacrafice of drivability and fuel economy. :)

The REAL cost of doing a carb:

GMPP carb intake 88958675 Scoggin-Dickey $369.75
Fel-Pro intake gasket 1312-1 Summit Racing $22.69
Fel-Pro header gasket 1438 Summit Racing $26.36
MSD ignition conversion 6010 Summit Racing $312.70
MSD extension harness 60101 Summit Racing $184.10
Carb, Holley 750 0-4779 0-4779C $415.95


Most likely I will do both and show which one makes more power and which one costs more.. sort of a shoot-out with myself. lol

[formula98]

Nope.. you could have bought a used LS1 intake and fuel rail for a couple hundred bucks. Most LSx engines you buy from salvage yards will come with all the stuff you need and then you just need to rework the harness and flash the ECU.

Is that 650-700 for the carb set up counting the Carb, Intake, Electronics, and Harness? Everytime I add it up I get at least $1000... :shrug:

Then you have to tune the carb.. and if you change big altitude you have to re-tune the carb.. If carbs are so great then why don't new cars run them anymore? lol

And while I do agree that a carbed LS motor will make more power it's at the sacrafice of drivability and fuel economy. :)

The REAL cost of doing a carb:

GMPP carb intake 88958675 Scoggin-Dickey $369.75
Fel-Pro intake gasket 1312-1 Summit Racing $22.69
Fel-Pro header gasket 1438 Summit Racing $26.36
MSD ignition conversion 6010 Summit Racing $312.70
MSD extension harness 60101 Summit Racing $184.10
Carb, Holley 750 0-4779 0-4779C $415.95


Most likely I will do both and show which one makes more power and which one costs more.. sort of a shoot-out with myself. lol

I have the Carb, The link below is for the Edelbrock setup with harness and controls the coil packs. $699 (709.99 shipped) I'll still need the gaskets. If you were to buy a FI setup off the shelf! you would pay in excess of $2,500. Even one out of a salvage yard would be more than a couple hundred bucks. I didn't buy from a salvage yard so I didn't get all the extras. The 5.3's I picked up have Zero miles on them. I have no harness, manifold, injectors, MAF, fuel rails and so on... I thought the carb would be the budget way to go! If you can hook me up with a FI setup under $700 I would go that way, but I've not found anything that is in that range. I'm definitely going to look as I would love to be Fuel Injected over a Carb.

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/EDELBROCK-LS1-LS6-CARB-INTAKE-MSD-TIMING-CONTROL-7118_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQ_trksidZp1638Q2em118Q2el124 7QQcategoryZ36474QQihZ007QQitemZ170193748485QQrdZ1 QQsspagenameZWD1V


This is how I received my motor!

http://farm1.static.flickr.com/151/353225052_d96e46a0c1_o.jpg

This is with the Edelbrock setup

http://farm1.static.flickr.com/165/353223886_06871c1d83.jpg

it is very clean and from what I'm told very streetable. If you can point me in the direction of a FI system that would be the same price I would go that way. Thanks for the info I look forward to finding a budget FI system....

[Steve1968LS2]

Just because you have a carb doesn't mean that cost shouldn't be factored in. :) -- if someone want's the Carb deal it's $1,000..

And there's no need for an "off the shelf" EFI deal.. used GM stuff is perfectly fine.

And the carb deal is cool, I have nothing against it. I just want to point out that it's not the dirt-cheap option to the "unaffordable" EFI.

Really :)

[Steve1968LS2]

Oh, and in your case you were at a bit of disadvantage since your engine came without any EFI stuff.

BUT... a used GM intake and TB is cheap.. as is a fuel rail. They you need a cheap Vette regulator/filter deal and some mods to a stock fuel tank. Lastly you need an OEM harness (again, from a scrap yard). You can mod it yourself with enough effort or pay $400 to have it done. They have the ECU flashed.

Done..

Or go with the cheap MEFI4 option like Turn Key offers.. 5 wires and you're golden. I bet I could put EFI on your long block for $1000... maybe $1,000.

But I have to admit... the carb deal looks very cool. :yes:

[formula98]

Thanks Steve, I'm giving it some thought. I picked up 2 of the 5.3 motors for what I had paid for an LS2 that never materialized. I still had some change, but not enough to buy new EFI setup. The carb setup looked less expensive. Since my post earlier today. I have found an LS1 intake setup going for $150 - $400 on ebay also found a harness at $465 an ECU at $100 so it could be possible to do something for around $1,200 ~ $1,500 with a used intake. I will keep an eye out for the parts as I've not comitted anything to a carb. I have to look at the write up Tony was talking about.

I would also like to know why GM would put a Carb version of the LS2 out if there wasn't something to it.

I love the BOSSEFI approach, but again $2,700 for just the carb/FI setup. I love the look of the Victor Jr. intake on the LS motor.

Anyway I'll follow your build no matter which way you go with it. I'll be putting the first 5.3 in my 80 Camaro this summer and decide if the other will go in my 67. I'll start a post on the parts I come across for the 80 project and we'll see how it comes out.

[JamesD]

My only suggestion is to keep the billet to a bare minimum, ideally none.

[trapin]

Ron....GM offers the carbed LS2 primarily because it's easier to put in a classic car than the FI is. There are still a lot of "Old School" guys out there that don't want to mess with the computer stuff. It's just an option that caters to another segment of customers.

And like Steve said, they will perform a little better then the FI motors. It's focus is probably more towards Drag Racing then road racing. I doubt I'll miss the few horsepower I'll lose for the convenience of the PCM and Fuel Injection.

[Steve1968LS2]

I would also like to know why GM would put a Carb version of the LS2 out if there wasn't something to it.


Because the carb is cool, many people fell more comfortable with a carb, and there was a demand for this sort of set-up.

Plus it does make a bit more power.


The key to doing EFI with these engines is to use as much GM stuff as you can. If you can find it used even better. Once you go aftermarket then the EFI approach gets REAL expensive really fast.

I will most likely build it both ways so we can see exactly how much it cost both ways and the power difference. I think that would be useful info.

[Steve1968LS2]

My only suggestion is to keep the billet to a bare minimum, ideally none.

Yea, I agree.. there really isn't THAT much on Penny.. the taillights and hinges mostly. Damn, black hinges would be SOO sweet though... lol

First go around will be to hit budget target.. Once I get that done I can add some higher end components.

I started doing some math and building a PT Camaro is tough to do..even on $30k.. but I think I have a plan.

[formula98]

Ron....GM offers the carbed LS2 primarily because it's easier to put in a classic car than the FI is. There are still a lot of "Old School" guys out there that don't want to mess with the computer stuff. It's just an option that caters to another segment of customers.

And like Steve said, they will perform a little better then the FI motors. It's focus is probably more towards Drag Racing then road racing. I doubt I'll miss the few horsepower I'll lose for the convenience of the PCM and Fuel Injection.
Thanks Tony, I love the look of the Carb setup, but I also like the way the FI feels (love the milage also). You guys have me thinking and will do some more home work! Thanks for the advice. I've had the LS1 in my 98 Formula I loved it. I only did a few mods and it was fast!

[formula98]

The key to doing EFI with these engines is to use as much GM stuff as you can. If you can find it used even better. Once you go aftermarket then the EFI approach gets REAL expensive really fast.

I will most likely build it both ways so we can see exactly how much it cost both ways and the power difference. I think that would be useful info.


Thanks Steve, I'll watch your builds and continue picking up parts along the way. I hope to have the first one in my 80 this summer (It's still in California and I'm now in Michigan). I'm looking for parts now and will post what I find and a what price so you can use the numbers for reference!

[formula98]

Any chance you can do a comparison of a Victor Jr that is FI using fuel rails and a throttle body the setup looks like a carb but is FI. I would be interested in possibly doing something like that. Do you know if you can use the stock harness and ECU with this type of setup?

[formula98]

I started a new thread here http://www.lateral-g.net/forums/showthread.php4?t=13490 I don't know if it is in the right section (Engine), but I have asked for help with the parts I'm going to need to do the FI.

I purchased an LS1 intake off of ebay for $127.50 so I'm on my way.

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=160207177177

I appologize for hijacking your post.

Thanks for all the great input.

[pro-touring nova]

i am with alot of peaple make is car low dollor,use the stock sub frame,use 5.3 with carb set up, you could use 200r4 for the trans,ls1 rear brakes,and use the hotchkis suspension set up for the car,that my .02 cents

[1984 camaro]

20 years ago the seller would have asked 500.00 bucks for that car and I would have passed on it. Looks like a good clean car.