GM Performance Crate Engines

[LVCamaro]

I was always of the understanding that ALL GM High Performance CRATE ENGINES were test fired/ran before crate. I surfed around the Net a bit, trying to find some sort of confirmation of that rumor without success. Can the experts here about GM Performance Parts Div. confirm or deny whether these HIPO GM engines are fired before crate?

We installed and briefly test fired/ran the new Ram-Jet ZL1 crate engine last Monday in my 69 Chevelle inside the shop...without a load, everything seemed fine. Then, last Friday, we pulled the Chevelle outside the shop under it's own power to set up for a road test mile or two. At high idle RPM while in gear doing a clutch/shift test in the parking lot, we suddenly heard rod noise! We immediately shut it down and yanked the engine to find EVERY rod cap nut was only speed wrench tight [less than 10 TQ] and the mains held less that 45 TQ. The rod/main bearings appear to be the only damage, but with the Memorial Holiday weekend, it'll be Tuesday before new bearings/gaskets arrive for another test run Tuesday evening.

This debacle is now in my spine, so when/if I can confirm whether GM test ran the engine...I'll backtrack until I find and expose the responsible moron. :thmbsdwn:

SS :mad:

[907rs]

That sucks, Steve!! :mad: Hopefully it was only the bearings that suffered. I thought I read in the new add for the 572 motors that they were run on a dyno before being crated. I don't have one handy, but I believe the title of the add reads pre-thrashed or something similar?

[chicane]

Steve, its got a warranty..... give it back to them and let them pay for it.

FYI, every crate I have run across and installed, never had one sign that it was 'run in'...... the exhaust ports were spotless and free of carbon. So, I dont believe that any of them run in at all, factory. Unless it is one of the higher end crates, like previously stated, I believe that it would be stated in the purchasing advertisement.

You might want to give Scoggin Dickey a call, since they are GM's largest OE/WD. I am pretty sure that they could answer that one for you.

Barry Crow, 800-456-0211

[LVCamaro]

The Ram Jet ZL1 comes complete with ignition, fuel system, water pump, starter, automatic transmission flexplate, ECM and wiring harness for quick and easy installation. General Motors Performance Parts warrants to the original retail purchaser for the time of 12 months from the date of purchase and/or 12,000 miles.

I'm outside the 12 month purchase date, but I'm wondering if it was possibly run pre-crate with the bolt-on parts that come with this engine. Thanks for the tip, I'll try that on Tuesday.

SS

[Blown353]

Yikes! That's totally unacceptable on a $2000 "Goodwrench 350" crate engine, let alone the $20K Ramjet ZL1.

Must have been a Friday or Monday motor, as the saying goes. I'd love to know exactly how that got out the door. It's quite obvious someone became distracted and skipped a rather important step; my hunch is it happened around lunch time, break time, shift change, etc. I've had similar incidents happen with my crew at work before on several occasions.

Glad to hear you caught it before anything really major happened, but personally I would be tearing the entire motor apart right now; if they forgot to torque the rods and mains, who knows what else they may have got wrong?

GM usually doesn't like people tearing into their crate engines for warranty reasons (they will usually tell you it's OK to open it up to a certain point but stop there until an authorized party can look at it), but as you stated the time stipulation of the warranty is already up. My guess however is that being their "flagship" crate engine they would probably honor it anyways even though the 12 month period is up simply to avoid bad press. However, I know there's a time concern here as the car is supposed to leave for Power Tour in a few days, so if you want the car to leave on time I don't see any real option other than fixing it yourself.

FWIW, all of the dozens of over the counter crate engines I have seen from GM (ZZ4, ZZ430, the spec circle trackers, ZZ502, etc) did NOT appear to be run-in nor did they specify they were in the documentation.

[LVCamaro]

Here's the email from GM Parts Depot:

Sent: Sunday, May 29, 2005 11:42 AM
Subject: RE: RAMjet ZL1 engines


Hello,

Thank you for your email.

They are not test fired. They are spin tested only.
The engines were a limited run of 200 and are no longer available.
Hope this helps.
Thanks
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Our plan is to run it up on the chassis dyno Tuesday afternoon after new rod/main bearings and see if we can break it within GM specified perimeters. If the engine demonstrates any compromising squawks during dyno abuse, we'll do a major or replace it pan to ram plenum on Wed/Thurs.

Thanks for the insights and suggestions...

SS

[427ls1]

As an engine builder i think the gm crate engine is a great sales item for their dealers. Not only is it flashy, but it keeps the gm , ford, or dodge dealers garages busy, and i see alot of sales of parts or complete engine sales after the customer has had trouble with them. the gm garages here bring me all kinds of things to fix for them. I currently have a 502 that burns oil with only 2000 kms on it, and a zz430 with "piston noise". I get alot of the 3.1 or 3100 3800 4.3, 4.8, 5.3, and 6.0 litre engines that need to be bored and new pistons because of factory "piston noise". Usually it only means boring the block to .010 or even honing it to .005 over. People need to realize that the engines carrying the "gm" "ford", or "mopar" logos on them new and sold from their performance catalog have never seen a company owned assembly plant. All these engines are cast, machined, and assembled by "farmed-out" contracts.

[rocketman]

i had a 502 like that once where rod caps where loose.

[mazspeed]

Yeah I had the same issues with my zz430 motor. They don't test fire crate engines, and sometimes don't get every nut and bolt to specs. We had bolts loose on mine as well, but the shop that is doing my car knew that they didn't test fire motors and went ahead and tightened each and every bolt to spec, and they said almost none were where they should have been. You would think because everything is warranted that they would do this so that they would have fewer returns.

[Kendall Burleson]

I try not to buy a crate motors if I can. some were giving to me for a project car so pull it down and it was ok.but that kind of stuff happen alot.with all of them. :yes:

[Jims78elky]

Wow..Thats really bad.Iam glad to hear this cause i purchased a new Ram502
awhile back! I think i will get it over too my engine guy who can do a check
for me..I realy don't think i could handle knowing it "could" happen.. :_paranoid

Sorry to hear that bad news ..but thank you for the tip! :thumbsup:

G.M Better start doing something about this,sure there is a warranty,but i
could just hear it,"uh..well,you must have done something on the install" I
guess iam throwing my warranty away but what to do? If my motor guy
finds something i'll update.

Uhggg! :willy:

-Jim