Force Feed ZZ502

[ccracin]

So here is my dilema, do I pro-charge my ZZ502 or TT charge it? Maybe some of you guys can weigh in. I am in the planning stages of a new project. I have spent the last 10 years involved in circle track racing. I am ready to get back on the street. The project is a 1968 Chevy C-10 street machine. I am currently designing a complete tube chassis with circle track inspired suspension. I guess that qualifies for G machine status. Anyway to the engine, I have a new ZZ502 and my plan is to force feed it with EFI. I am still torn as to how. I need to decide soon as I want to plan the chassis correctly. I have talked with ATI and Innovative and they have agreed that I should be able to make 1000+- at about 15-16 psi on pump gas and intercooled. The truck will allow a large intercooler. They however don't have alot to add about specific engine combinations, or least they did not in my preliminary conversations. What does everyone think? Frank at Prodigy, any ideas? Tom Nelson, I know you build great engines but any ideas for supplying me a TT setup. Anyone else that can add something would also be greatly appreciated. I have a desire to do as much myself as possible. I am designing the chassis and other components with a 3D modeling package and want to see it through to completion.

Thanks,

Chad

[Blown353]

It's better to build an engine from the beginning with boost in mind rather than start with a naturally aspirated engine and try and convert it, as you usually end up throwing stuff away or making lots of compromises.

Several things really need changing for a boosted application to be the most reliable and get the most power:

SC or turbo specific cam grind
piston coatings & compression ratio
piston clearance (going a little bit more on the bore, say .0005" additional, for boost and increased combustion chamber temps & piston temps isn't a bad idea)
wider ring gaps
inconel exhaust valves
headwork (especially on the exhaust side but don't neglect the intakes)
head gasket selection (MLS is very good)

Also, the ZZ502 heads aren't too hot especially on the exhaust side, I'd recommend something like Canfields or AFR's.

[camcojb]

Yeah, I am not sure you can get to 1000 HP with those heads, especially at that boost level.


Jody

[ccracin]

Thanks for the replies so far. Blown353, I really couldn't agree with you more on your comments. The 1000 is just a number for kicks. It is cool to say it makes 1000. In all actuality I think @ 12 -14psi on that motor the power level will be sick for a pick-up. I think we'll need stock in BFG. The thing is we have the 502. It has a forged crank, pistons and steel rods. The heads will make great torque off boost and I agree that they will be limited on the top end. The static CR is 9.6:1, my thought was putting a bit thicker MLS head gasket on to lower the CR and increase the valve to piston clearance a bit. Although I havn't checked it to start so I'm not exactly sure that part is needed. Call it extra insurance. The main intent is to make as much consistant power as possible while still just hitting the key and going. I traded some e-mails with Shay Campbell and Jim who bought his Camaro and they said the 502 lived and it made I think 800 on pump gas. I may be mis- quoting here. Shay said he did nothing but change rocker arms. I'm thinking the head gaskets may help a bit. So now that I am done rambling, back to a question. What do you think this engine capable of and what components would you suggest Pro-Charger, TT etc. Thanks again for the help.

[deuce_454]

if you plan to yank the heads id swap the pistons right away, get a set of flat tops to bring the compression down to about 8:1. and if you are any good with that 3d cad you are much better off going with the TT setup as the big difference between the two with regards to difficulty is designing and fabrication the tubing and headers for the turbos. , secondly, and i really think this is a big point, your engine will deliver 150-200 more shaft horsepower with a properly sized turbo setup than with a crank driven supercharger at the SAME boost level, simply because of the SHP needed to drive the SC. also boost is adjustable... so tour wife or 17 year old son isnt handed the keys to an 1100 hp pickup with no rear grip..

[cutlasskid]

i also think tt set up is the best way, i have not had any luck with procharger. tt due have alot of heat issues but having the adjustable boost is very nice.

[Gordz32]

although chevy has forged internals, I'd be a little scared with 1000hp and possibly grenading the motor. I'm a chevy guy forever but I wouldn't trust the (stock) balancing, internals at 1000hp. just my 2 cents

[ccracin]

At this power level, I can't help but be a bit concerned. Although, I don't think balance is an issue. That is concern with RPM not power level. I still will not spin this engine past 6000 with an upgraded valve train. As for the strength of the parts, I would definitely not use this engine as a base in a racing application. In this application the hardest this engine will be worked is on the dyno. If it survives that, I think it will survive on the street. Even with 295-305's on it, the fact that it is a pick-up says I will not be punishing the internals. I am considering adding inconel exhaust valves to add longevity. So, suffice it to say I am willing to take the risk. Let's hear some recommendations on parts. I am going to work on a concept for TT headers. When I make some progress I'll post for comments. Thanks for the feed back so far.

[ccracin]

Anybody home? I'm sure someone is out there at least willing to tell me I am full of crap. I'm of the mind I can learn from anything. The previous replies still have me thinking. I still need some specifics on parts. Thanks.

[Slow Ride]

I'm in your same boat. I want to add twin turbos to a 454bbc in my s-10 blazer and have been having a hard time finding useful info. I am probably on a much more limited budget than you, but I still want max power for my cash outlay. I am watching this thread closely.